EP 290: Adam's 2023 Archery Drop Tine Muley and the Crew's Early Season Tags

Anything to do with Western big game.

Welcome to the Epic Outdoors podcast, powered by Under Armour.

Hey everybody, Jason Carter, Adam Bronson. We got most of the Epic Outdoors crew. We got some guys in the field. It's kind of crazy. It's a crazy time of year. But anyway, we've got Devin, Josh, Cash, Logan. How you doing, Logan? Not going to talk about you today. I think we covered my entire personal life last time. I think we have. Has there been any major advancements? Was I not here? I was going to. Major backlash. Adam's here too. Adam missed. What do I not know? You did have some major backlash? I think he said Jason Adam at first. But if not, I'm here. He talked about being catfished by his now friend, roommate. They kind of joined. Yeah. After that podcast, they had to sleep in separate rooms now. I didn't dare go to church in Minersville the week after that aired. You might not go there for a few months. Yes. The judgment would have been fallen. Oh, my gosh. Anyway.

So no major advancements or changes in your life? Nope. Okay. Good. We're moving that on. Thank goodness. We're still courting. All right. All right. So, okay. So, yeah, there's been a lot going on. You know, first off, I guess we want to thank Under Arm. Appreciate their support. Their support in this podcast and whatnot. Anyway, they support us in all we're doing. We also have a lot of great supporters out there as well. So, namely today for this podcast, be Kenneth Trek, QU, and Red Rock. Just awesome companies. Great companies. And so, speaking of gear. Oh, yeah. You know, we've been selling some. The optics are like crazy. Like, it's like, I don't know. It's like everybody's decided they got to go hunting tomorrow. So, today we need to buy optics. Everybody knew for the last six months they needed to get some. And they waited. And waited. Including marriages. Yeah.

Including somebody in this office. What? Got, you know, a new pair of peers studded today. Who was that? I like new developments, you know? Who got some new peers? Me. Yeah. I like it. They're already in my vinyl harness. Is it already done? Oh, yeah. Did you test them out? Like, did you look? I mean. It's been studded. The glass is cherry. Yeah. From the factory. I haven't even looked through them yet. Have you even cleaned the dust off? I haven't looked. The factory little paper dust. They're ready to go. Oh, I got. Nothing like waiting until the last minute. I put some grease on the eye cups for him. Don't worry. Did you? I wonder what those little fingerprints were. I didn't want him to be the first one. I didn't even look through them. I just greased them up for him. You're talking your hand. Human grease. Oh, yeah. You got to put your grubbies on. Yes. Oh, yeah.

I put them into my eye cups. Just got a little eye grease all over them.

But, hey, we've stocked up. We still have a bunch of luck. I was going to say it, but I want to have Logan have to retract. Just stop. Yeah. Yeah. Stop. But, anyway. Yeah. But, hey, we've still replenished. We've been blown through a lot of optics, but we've got a lot ordered in here. And so, if you need something, call us. We made some epic orders. Unbelievable. The last week or so. So, yeah. Appreciate everybody that's thinking about us. And, you know, luckily we had a good supply on hand. For people that don't know, we're the best deal out there. Just look around and then give us a holler. And we'll be able to get them to you. ASAP. It's pretty awesome. Anything, right? Basically. Yeah. Talking Swarro, Zeiss. Yeah. Pulsar. Even if you need to. Vortex. Even if you need to hide it from mama and come here with some cash. You know? What? I mean, we take cash here, too. Okay.

Hey, I read something the other day. Not promoting divorce. Yeah. No. Just the principle of cash. Because in this society, there was something I read the other day. It talked about you go out to lunch or something. Okay. You pay, let's say. 1993. 50 bucks. You give them a $50 bill. Okay. All right? You tip your people in cash and you give the people 50. Now, what that cash did over five generations of spending of that same $50 bill versus the same $50 with a 3% credit card transaction over five times of what it whittles away to. And it's pretty shocking. No kidding. Basically, it's the time value of money. Yeah. But in kind of a reverse. Yeah. But it maintains that value, whereas that $50 minus the 3% that goes to the. You got 47 minus 3%. But you got to think about this. That 3% went to the credit card processing companies who paid wages.

And those wages, those people went out and used their wages to go buy cars and vehicles. Or how about this? I still believe cash is key. I'm selfish. Because I use my credit. I would use cash, but I use my credit card for everything because I get 2% back. Yes. All the time. And then you're spending more. So then you're going to Cabela's and buying a tent cot. You're buying stuff just to get points. Right? It's not a Cabela's. Tell us about this tent cot. I want to talk a little bit more about it. Why? You order one? I don't know how you guys don't understand that. Well, tent cots, I just don't. I've always seen them. I am a true tent cotter. Okay. Okay. And I'm like one of those guys. I don't like all the knickknacks unless they really work. Like, I just want simplicity like Adam. So roll out. This is the most simple system. Here's my cot. Here's my sleeping bag. I'm happy. I roll it up.

I drive away. Okay, so if I have a normal cot and a tent cot, I would rather set up my tent cot. It's so much easier. Easier than a cot. You put two bars on a cot. Two bars on each end. Some cots. Some cots you have to get physical with. Yes. And that's what's bothering you. I have a tent cot. Have you thrown out your back? Fold out two buckles? Have you ever thrown out your back? It's when we were in Nevada last year, Devin had his tent cot. I had my regular cot. I'm glad. No, you probably had the teepee tent. No, no. You did when I went to Nevada. Well, yeah, because it was going to rain. But this night, it was at a lone tree. Yes. And he had his tent cot. And he was just like, okay, ready to go to bed. And I was over there. I'm just glad it was dark and there were no lights on. Because what I had to do to get that tent out. Do you have to? So we got Pollock. How tall are you?

I was six foot. We got Sasquatch over there working over this cot. I had to do things that shouldn't be seen to get that thing done. Did you pull up your drawers or did you have cracks showing the whole time you were doing it? It was just a good thing it was dark. I had it up before the moon came out. He was fully exposed out there. We got the Viking Hans Redsbush over there breaking a sweat. It's true. It is. I like an easy cot, but it needs to be tight when you're done. Yeah. And easy cots are always loose. So you need the tight, hard, freaking POS cot. Yeah. Yeah. But about, oh, I don't know. It was somewhere during the middle of the night. You get these thermals change and there's a canyon that comes down from there that you don't realize. And I about froze. And it was September 10th, September 9th, whatever. And Archibald's in there. And it was supposed to be 50 something degrees.

And I even had like a zero degree bag. And I was getting cold because the wind coming out of that canyon was so cold. And Devin was over in his tent cot. And the other thing you didn't even think about was the owl pellet risk. Exactly. The owl pellets. Oh, man. Yeah, the tent cots are awesome. I love it. And if you've used one when it rains in snow. So tell me. Oh, yeah. I've been in snow, rain. You name it. The same one tent cot. Tell me. What's the most amazing tent cot ever? I've had it since probably 2012. Who made it? I've had it since at least a couple hundred nights. Maybe even a year of my life in that tent cot. Wow. I'm serious. Hey, here's a question. I used to spend the whole summer in the thing. I wouldn't bring a tent. Is it the cot and just the tent? Or does you have to put a separate cot pad in there? No. It has a pad, too, built in? Oh, I have a pad that I put in with it.

Yeah. Just like the eggshell foam. And you fold up with it. So it's in it at all times. My pillow's in there. Everything's self-contained. You're sleeping back in there, too? It's a two-minute process. No. Sleep in bed, second. Yeah. Okay. So walk us through it. It's essentially a very fancy. It's a very comfortable coffin. A coffin. You know all the padding on the side of those coffins? When he said it's very similar to coffin, I forgot I'd ever have a discussion. I quit talking to him. You could open the door. We're going to shop for our coffin this afternoon. There you go. Who makes it? There's a cabela's and what? It's with a K. Coffin cutter? I think they make it. We should. Hey, we should. Look at that. Let's build it. We'll spell it with a K. I said it out loud. I said it out loud. K-O-F-I-N.

I said it out loud so somebody already today, when they hear the podcast, is going to steal the idea. Coffin cutter. And just be worried. And then canvas cutter is going to sue you for it because you're trying to knock off cutter. You're using the word cutter. It's camp right. My wife bought one because she would steal mine even when we were in the camp. Coffin camper. Because it's comfortable. Camp right. Can you zip two together and have like a queen for you and your wife? They make doubles. They make some big ones. I wouldn't recommend it because it'll fill your truck bed.

You know. Big. So in a dusty Nevada environment, in the back of your truck, rolling down dusty roads for 70, 80 mile an hour. Well, the bag. You get it out. No problems. It has a bag. It's clean. Is the bag big enough to fit it? It was brown. Now it's pink. Mine went pink from the sun. I saw it in there today. Yeah, that's what I saw. Okay. I was wondering what that was. That's my home. Yeah, it was pink. It's my home. It was kind of pinkish. And I'm like, what's he got? He went to a yard sale and snagged something important. No, I've had that since like probably 2011 or 12. Wow. Out in the sun. Still rolling. So that's where you're going to be in that this weekend. I'll be in it tonight. Rain. Snug as a bug. Rain. Snug as a bug. We got Hurricane Hillary bearing down on us. He's not afraid. Are they calling it Hillary? Hillary Rodham. Come on. They did not.

I had to draw on them, but I think that's what they intended. Hurricane Hillary. Okay. Well, let me look up some weather while we're talking. Okay. It's the proudest thing she's ever had named after her. You never know. What makes somebody proud? You never know. All right. Where are we at? Bronson. Speaking of the tent caught, Archibald had that thing in Nevada last week. I did. Is that a segue? I was making a segue. Is that where you went? A segue into the Nevada hunts. Yeah. Bronson's hunt. So y'all went over there. I think he spent two nights in it. Maybe three. What was it? Two. Okay. That second night, I slept like a baby. It was like five hours. I think we got to bed about one o'clock. Yeah. But, yeah, it was, hey, it was short. We talked about who was going to kill the first two hundo. Yeah, we did. I don't think we ever had a formal vote, though. Oh, we did.

It was on a podcast and everything. I think we did, and somebody got mad about that. Your text log said it didn't quite make that, so it wasn't maybe official, but it had to be closed. Very. But I honestly, and this is 100% true, I didn't tape one thing on that. I didn't have it. I was not a mid-season for him. I didn't even have a tape. I wasn't. And I should have used Archibald's, knowing that probably would have broke 205, 210. It would have been 210 for sure. No, not because Archibald is an embellisher. No, we've already talked about this. We've talked about the tapes. His dad's tape, it frayed at the end, so he had to cut off the first inch so it starts at one. Or it came from China that way, I don't know. Yeah, but either way. I didn't have it. And with velvet bucks, you're kind of in a hurry to get them somewhere. Oh, it was. Like, you don't just sit and fonder.

It was perfect, though. Like, beautiful. Beautiful. And all I could care about the next day was getting it to somebody that could inject and freeze it. And that's all I did. He even still had a couple of it. Nobody even here has seen it. I have. Other than Devin. I held it. Yeah, you did in the parking lot on the way home at a gas station. Yeah. We happened to be passing by. Adam pulled over before we hit this road. He gets out and he's like, I'm freezing. Because you had the AC blasted on it. It was cranked in there, man. Yeah. Keep it cold. I had all four open. It was cold. I had to stop and warm up twice driving home. Somebody's going to get rain on heavy tomorrow. And then the weekend. Well, the Utah. Are you thinking I'm going to get? We're talking about the Utah. I think the weekend you'll be all right. The Utah general deer and limit entry archery deer. It's kicking off.

Nevada open on the 10th. This is August 19. Yeah. It's pretty exciting. It's exciting. It's good sneaking. So, Adam, August 10th comes. You've been scouting. You've been cranking. You've got a tag. Yeah. Had a couple bucks found. Had one in particular that, yeah, the night before I glassed him up. He was, the deer was always alone. Never saw this deer with another deer ever. Whether it be on camera or in live person. I never saw him with another deer. Not even by random chance. And he was alone when you hunted him. Oh, yeah. Literally never, never. Either on a camera or with glassing up. That appealed to me, actually. You know, you get even two deer together. You've got more eyes. They like to bed like this. It was all teeing up. It kind of gravitated. He was kind of in an area that I thought was huntable, too.

Once I found where he was living and where to glass from, it was a little bit of a hike. You know, not far. But, I mean, you had to, you know, kind of hike, get way above. But, anyway. Washing the night before. Opening day. Couldn't find him. I'm like, he's got to be right here. And at, like, 8-12, I glassed him up, still bedded. I might have even told you I think he's still bedded. Or maybe it was my brother. I don't know. Maybe I told you. So, I think he's still laying here. Because I've torn this apart with the BTX and everything. Sure enough, I found him in the shade, bedded down. And he finally stood up about 8-30, fed until, like, 9-30 or something like that. This is why Devin was, you know, not very far. What, three miles away, something like that. Got Devin over there. You know, this was a couple hours later. Got him in position. And I bedded the buck.

And Devin got to me and showed him, you know, through the spot and scope where he was. Once Devin had him locked in, I took off. And it was kind of one of those. The wind, it was for morning. Usually, sometimes I wait until the middle of the day or even early afternoon. You needed a steady Eddie. I need some wind, yeah. But this morning, remember, it was blowing. At 9-10. It was windy. 20 miles an hour. At 7-30, I looked to the south. We saw lightning. And there was lightning. And a black wall. Yeah, I saw it, too. And I'm like, oh, we're getting wet today. Yeah. It was one of those days that it was like, okay, this is, anyway, happened way faster. Because little storms to the south. And it was a 20-mile stiff, not gust. It was steady. And I'm like, this is what you pray for. This is the conditions you want. Those conditions kill deer. They do. So I took off quick.

Hiked back down to my truck. I had to move and drive a little bit. So I left some stuff. Left my scope and all that in my truck. Because I didn't need that in my little backpack. Stocking a deer. The extra 10 pounds or whatever. So I dropped some of that stuff. And cut out in on the deer. While I was doing that, Devin and I had sat there. And we talked about if this deer moves. Because they always move a little bit. They never stand on one tree all day. We named a couple of clumps. And the one that we thought was probably the most likely. What did we call it? Just whatever. The tight clump. The tight clump. Just a tight clump. That was clump number one. Very good. It was like clump. Let's call this the tight clump. All right. And so we'd already talked about it. And so he's telling us. Hey, he got up and moved. There's 75 yards. He's better right in the north end of the tight clump.

And I'm like, got it. I know where he's at. In my mind, I can see. I took a picture of the scenery. Communication is key. Well, before you leave. This whole thing. Communication is key on killing shoots. Before you leave. You know, and we did. So it's just once you're on the ground. And you've lost all your elevation. It all looks different. So you need to know what you're at. In my mind, I already knew. I already knew where the deer was. So it was lucky. And, you know, by the time I start stalking the deer, it's really blowing. And I was going fast because I'm like, I want to get close enough. I look to the south. That storm. When it's that windy, you can go. Oh. He was there within minutes. Yeah. I was within. He was within 150 yards within minutes. Well, then you texted one. I think you texted an update and said, I'm within 50 yards or something. I'm like, oh, this deer's dead.

80 or something like that. I think it was 80. 80. That's what I had to know. And I'm like, this deer's dead and doesn't even know it. Well, that was when. And you guys are like, what? You thought I was talking about a deer? I was. Yeah, you just said, he's dead. Because you were hunting a deer, too. You're hunting a deer somewhere else. And you're like, how's it going, Carter? He's dead. I'm like, what? There's probably a few words used in a text message that probably shouldn't be used. Well, I was like. Certain forms. And I was like, no, I meant you're going to kill him. Oh. And I was like, well, thanks for the optimism. But hey, choose another word. At least you guys had service. Yeah. What service do you use? AT&T. You had never used that. Parts of Nevada, though, it shines, apparently. It does. But I think it used to shine. I wonder. I would agree with that. But anyways.

Anyway, keep going. So yeah, I didn't even take off my shoes. I didn't even take off my boots until I got to 80 yards. And that's when I stopped. But I was partially like, all right, I'm close enough now. I've got to take them off. Put on some socks like I normally do. And this deer's bedded facing away from you on the north end. You're on the south end. What are you? Yeah, he's kind of facing. And he can see me now. I'm on the north of him. And it's a stiff south breeze. And he's bedded. Kind of looking northeast, basically. But you've got to be careful because he's going to catch your movement or whatever. Yeah. He could turn his head enough to see him. Yeah. And I'm behind a juniper tree. So I've got really good cover. But after this tree, I don't. I have four foot cover. Yeah. So I'm crawling. But then you can get hung out to dry.

And there was, it looked like Hillary was coming our way. Right? It's a wall of water. Oh. No. It was like, this could get serious. Like, this could be like dumping the inch in 20 minutes. And you don't have like a rain gear. I have one top. I have a top. Just the top. Just the top. That's all I carry. I don't carry bottoms. Just the top. Yeah. You know. You didn't have anything. Usually in the boat. I shivered for a minute. I was cold. Yeah. Yeah. And luckily, we got the very edge of the storm. It just, it didn't sprinkle. I mean, it rained heavy drops. But we got the edge. And everything went by us, luckily. But just like normal. You know, I didn't have time to, you know, by the time it's starting to stop, you know, I'm bundled up because I got my raincoat over my camo. My vinyls are inside, keeping them dry. And the deer stands up before I unzip. And unzip. Like he, you know.

Before the rain had even. So now he's standing. And he's kind of coming my way. And I'm unzipping this because I don't. It's just binding in that thing. And you want it off. So I'm slipping it off this whole time. This deer's, you know, he's probably 75, 70 yards. But he's buried in a bush. So by then, I get out. You know, my bow's knocked. And now I'm deciding, all right, is he going to keep coming to me? Or is he going to angle? And he angled away. Anyway, but in that moment that he angled away, I had to take, I don't remember what took my eye off the deer for a minute. For like 15 seconds. Probably like, you know, just, I don't know, adjusting whatever I was doing. Getting my rain gear put away so I can walk around this tree within a four-foot area. You know, if he comes this way, I've got to be ready here. If he comes this way, I've got to be ready here.

And I look, I cannot see the deer. And I'm panicked. Like, I don't know, like, did he go away from me? Is he coming right at me? I can't see him. And anyway. And you don't dare peek around. No. Then you're going to get caught. No, no. But that's when a good wingman can help you. Yeah. Hey, this is what he's doing. That's right. He didn't. He just buried feeding. And when he said that, when I said it, he said, all right, I'm going to. You didn't say anything. Okay. I just took off. All of a sudden, there you were. I just took off walking. And it's blowing. The storm's leaving. It's still 20, 25. It's a big wind. And there's branches doing this. I mean, it's like, you can get away. And I had a big, big bitter brush between me and the deer. And I just walked right to it. And I picked through it. And this thing's like 25, 30 yards buried feeding in it.

And so now I'm like, which side of the bush should I get to lean out and draw my bow? I mean, it's so close I'm not even going to range. Like, I know it's top two pins of both killing. What happens when you don't range? Okay. Well, it is that close. Trust me. Trust me. So you're talking the first time. The first time. Yeah, first time. Yes. And right there. Adam came out of nowhere. Like, this deer covered probably, I would say, 100-ish yards. 80 to 100 yards from where he was bedded. Mm-hmm. To get to the tide club. And I didn't know what you were doing. And all of a sudden, I said, yeah, his head's buried in a bush. And Adam just said, I got one more bush. I'm going to kill him. And he was there, dude. Ninja. Right through the bushes. Well, I had no shoes on, good wind, meaning no shoes. I had heavy socks over my little socks. And so I'm, I mean, I'm just quiet.

And the deer's just been laying down for an hour and a half, two hours. He's ready. It just rained. You know, he's not really alert. He's chowned out. I will say there was one time when he just, he either heard something or smelled something. And that's when I was. And he tensed for just a second. And every time he'd walk, he'd kind of just look back. Just real quick. And that was that bush. He burned a hole through it. And I'm just staring at him. And I'm like, oh, great. Because now he'd go to feed. And then he'd look back over at the bush. Like, now he's making sure. And so I couldn't step out then. So I just decided I'm going to let him get completely back to what he's doing. Even if he walks away from me and rebeds. You know. And pretty soon he walked away. And he's down there like 80 yards. And then he buries in another bush. And I had to loop around.

And I, but I had another big, big couple of bushes between me. And these are like, you know, six, eight foot tall. You know. You know. Big bushes. Stunted trees or bushes. I forget now. And I close the distance again. And I get up there. And I peek around. And I don't need a range find. I mean. And he's that close. It's 25 or 30. It's, you know. Top pin slightly high. I have a 20 yard pin. Yeah. You know. Some people start with 30. Yeah. I do have a 20. 20 and a 30. Yep. But both of those are. You know. They hit this far apart. Yeah. At 20, 25 yards. You know. It's like. Doesn't really matter. Yeah. So I lean out. I have an ephedra bush in front of me. About five feet. Brigham T. That ephedra. Okay. Like, you know. Pretty good. You know. Those are pretty good cover. Because they're dense. Dents. And I can see this deer. He's buried in. I can see his head and neck.

And he'd just taken a step there. And if he takes one more step. He's in open. But I'm like. Dude. He's buried. I'm in. So I drew back. So I drew back. And I'm sitting there. And the deer is chewing. He pulls his head out chewing. And he just. Just turned. Turned to look that way. Randomly. Turns. And his head just went. I just. I can see it. His eyes are. His eyes are silver dollars. Yeah. That's exactly how I'm asking. He probably did. He wasn't. Open his eyes. He probably was like. Trust me. His head went. Literally went back. You saw the whites of his eyes. Literally. He went like this. And he turned. And he literally went like that. Literally. And then within literally a half second. And it wasn't. You're all camoed at all. I'm camoed at full draw. Like I'm. And I kind of have a bush. But there's a limb now. A bow limb. And just. He's like. He's close enough. That is not.

And everything else is blowing. And you're not. Yeah. And he's like. I just walked right there. That doesn't look what I just walked by. Like. I don't know. I've got limbs blowing. And this is just a solid stationary object. That wasn't there before. I had a face in that. I mean. And I'm telling you. I still think. Yeah. I think they can look at me. You in the eyes. Literally. When you're. When you're 25 yards. I try not to look in their eyes. Yeah. Well. I think. 100%. 100%.

All I could see was his head and neck. I never make eye contact. So. Head and neck. I mean. I didn't even have his body to shoot at. Yeah. I'm at full draw. And I. I. You should have shot him. I'm at a. Whatever. Well. He blows and runs like. 10 or 20 yards and stops. So. I just let my bow down. And I just hunkered down. I can see the tops of that. So. I'm like. He doesn't really know. What he's blowing through. What's here. And he. He didn't go far. 20 yards maybe. No. And then he ran a bit and stopped. And then he ran over the hill. And Archibald City. Hit the ground. He went in. Oh yeah. End over end. He did. Archibald for a split second. Thought I shot. I see Adam draw. In my. To my view. I'm thinking. Okay. That thing looks. At worst. Quartering away. Yeah. And then the deer like. Does what Adam said. Looks like. What is that. And then jumps. And I thought. Well. There we go.

And then he. Stopped. He hopped three. Four. Five times. And you're like. Geez. He missed. And I'm like. Oh. He didn't even shoot or he missed. Yeah. And then the thing. Runs. Does this. He took off. He was going pretty fast. When he left over the hill. Yeah. He knew something was up. And. I don't know. About halfway out there. Of his. Of his big loop. He. He trips. The deer tripped. Was he going downhill? Was he going downhill? And a little bit of dust. Was he going downhill? It was like a wash. He. Something. He hit. He hit a bank. And fell. I asked Devin. I literally asked Devin. Did he break his drop? Did he just die? I asked Devin. Did he break his drop? That's what I said. I thought. Please don't come out of there without. That was kind of a. The selling. The absolute selling point. I mean he was kind of on the edge of. Big. You know. Big pretty typical. But you need a.

You need a dropper. Droppers get stuff killed. What I can think of is he something went to go over this wash. I think he just wasn't paying attention because he was thinking. And he just. Yeah. Misstepped. Yeah. Anyway. Anyway. So then he. Ground's given away going down the wash. He went out. Did a big C kind of loop. Came right back. Under a lone tree. He watched. He J hooked. He J hooked. And looked. Did a perfect J hook. Went to the one tree. They always J hooked. Laid down. Just watched. Watch his back trail. We're at him. Did he watch his back trail? Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Intently. Dude. But I'm telling you. It's good to see that stuff. I watched that deer the whole time. And there was one moment. He just. He tensed up. I don't know what it was. Yeah. But if that wouldn't have happened. Yeah. When did he tense up? He would not have been looking back. No. When did he tense up?

When he was feeding and Adam was at 25 yards. The first time. The first time. The first time. I thought it was wind. I thought it was wind. I thought it was wind. But I couldn't see. I don't know where. I think he. I probably had slight movement. Because I'm trying to get out. You know. The first time I had him. About 30 yards. I'm trying to get out either side of the bush. To draw. Because his head. Head is buried. And his body is in the open. So when that. When that happened. He sawed out. It was. Something through the bush. Yes. Like. Ah. Just wasn't always quite. He was dumb to the world. Keep in mind. This is the deer that's been left to himself all summer long. No pressure. Living alone. Yeah. And now you get a little movement. Like. The first time he's ever been on it. Just enough to make him keep looking. When it's really windy. Keep looking. I find these deer are skittish.

They can get. Because they're nervous. They know they're vulnerable. Yeah. They know stuff's blowing. They don't have their hearing. Stuff's blowing. And they don't see. They don't see a coyote or a lion. They don't. They're not as. It can go both ways. Into the details. Yeah. Exactly. Get you close from a sound standpoint. But they sometimes do get heightened. They do. They're just nervous. Everything's moving around me. You know. I mean. I can't. Can't hear. Can't. Yeah. Yeah. Everything's moving. You're vulnerable. They feel that. I'm sure. So he bedded under that tree. Devin. Devin said. And then. You know. I gathered my stuff up. And I got. I got. I knew. I knew where. Where he was. Because he ran towards my truck. I mean. My truck's parked. You know. Half mile. Out there. Maybe three quarters. Whatever. Devin's like. He's. He ran right over by your truck. And. You know.

There's a few scattered trees. And he's bedded under the northern north one. That you're going to see it. That you're going to see the tree first. When you crest the ridge. Probably likes that real bright orange. It's probably gravitated that way. Yeah. You couldn't see the truck. But it just was. Again. A perfect landmark. I knew right. Where'd it go. There's a pumpkin over there.

Deer like pumpkins. Yeah. All right. Keep going. Anyway. Well. Well. That one. I thought I had. The problem is. He was. He was a different deer at that point. And I. Now. Now. He's like. Now. He's very sensitive. Yeah. And I thought I had. All the cover I needed. I had 80 yards. And now. I wanted to get to. The next little brush layer. Which was my last one. It was probably putting about 60. You made a big loop. And came around. And you had the wind in your face. Perfect. And. And you're coming. He's looking away from you. No. You're behind him now. No. No. No. No. You never got between your truck and him. No. Okay. So what. He's bedded. Looking straight north. And the wind is blowing hard from the south. He's looking straight where I got to come from. And the wind is at his back. And he's. I have to come. He's going to see you. And he was out far enough from the tree.

He could see straight west and straight east. He's not in a good stock. Not in a good. No. But I still tried.

Which is down to the water source. Well. Possibly. Right. Or just into this big. You know. Big vast. Old burn. Slash. Live trees. Slash. You know. The food is. Yeah. The food. Food and water. You know. But anyway. So. I. Maybe was slightly over confident. Did you wait at all? Or did you just go? Well. It was. I had to gather. I put boots on and stuff. So. I mean. It took me a minute to gather them. I left my pack and boots. And so. You're throwing your scope together. It was 30. 45 minutes. Before I'm over there on him again. And it's. But. But it. He'd caught his breath. So. What do you. What do you think? So. He's got the wind coming at his back. So. If you come from behind him. He can smell you. Oh. You're done. If you come in front of him. He can see you. That's. The only option I had to do. Was. Was come from in front of him. But. The mistake I made. Is I should have.

Probably looking back. Stopped at the 80. And just said. This is good. I just thought. I had 20 more yards of cover. But from. He was down more. In a little bit of a draw. And I think from his angle. Looking back. That last hill. I was coming over. Behind really big thick bushes. I think those things were skylined. So. Looking through. Picture a bush. On the skyline. He's seen. You can see blue sky. And he can see dark. Coming through sky. I think that's what. Because I had. They were just as thick. As everything I'd been coming through. But. There's a difference. Between a bush at eye level. With a lot of brush behind it. And a bush. Now. On. When I say skyline. We're talking about. A 10 foot wash. You know. Skyline. I'm not trusting a ridge. They're just little undulations. Out in a hill. And the deer's down here. And he's looking up there. That's all I can think. But boy.

He did not mess around that time. No. He was gone. And I thought. For real intense purposes. I'm done hunting the deer for the day. He was. He. He never even paused. This is where the story gets really fun.

What. What. What. What. What. Fun about it. It's. Heaven sent. Oh. Yeah. Well. If you. Bump a deer a couple. A couple times hard. The one thing about this deer. The one thing about this deer. You. You found through scouting. Was that he liked to water in the day. Yeah. Certainly. Rare in Nevada. It's rare. Sometimes he would. Yeah. So. Give you hope. If a deer's always at night. It kind of felt like. Well. What's the use. Yeah. Why would you ever sit in water. Why would you ever sit in water. And the pressure. The worse the pressure gets. The more nocturnal they get in Nevada. It's so notorious for. A. The heat. Whatever it is. Heat. Pressure. Whatever. Predation. I don't know what it is. But man. They're skittish. So. This particular deer. Doesn't have. Doesn't have the pressure. And he's in a spot where he feels like he can water in the day. He does. Sometimes. Yeah. He does. So.

So now. Here we are. We actually decided. It was probably. Two in the end. Two thirty three. It's kind of like. You know. I'm going to eat a real. What else. I'm going to eat a real piece of food. Because you've been eating this. Bird food. You're eating like a crow. Yeah. You're eating like a bird for. Yeah. The last six hours. You know. And. So you're like. All right. I'm going to have a sandwich and chill. Yeah. So we ran. We ran back to camp for a minute. No one. You know. My brother. Aaron. He was getting there too. And so. Just kind of regrouped for the night. And. Did that. But I didn't wait long. I mean. I. It was. I mean. Well. And we also knew that. Where the deer went. Was to thick. Thick cover. Or. There's nowhere you're going to go hunt the deer on the ground. No. No way. You're done. You're either waiting for the next day. Thick live trees. Thick live. Or you go pick.

Or you go pick a water source that he's. You know. Might come to. And it's like. I'm just going to invest on this. And you're like. Well. I'm going to go sit water. Yeah. It was on his way. It's on his way back. To where he was. In a way. But you're still thinking like. Okay. You just. Blew a deer really hard. Really hard. You're done. Twice. Yeah. But. But you're also like. Well. What else am I going to do? I got a couple other spotters down here. And. Your brother and Devin. And. Rest is. Kind of history. Because. Yeah. It seems simple after this. But a lot has to go right. For you to be. To pick a. Water. To sit at. And then. A deer come in there. Okay. So go ahead. How'd this go down? Like. You go get in a blind. That has to happen. Yeah. I mean. But. And you're sitting there. Yeah. And you're sitting there. Two and a half. Yeah. I don't know. What do you.

I don't even know how to play solitaire. I don't even know how to play those games. How do you pass them the time? Mindless. What do you mean? You in there tweaking your bow a little bit? Are you tweaking? No. What are you doing? Contrary to popular belief. I hadn't had a monster all week either. So. So what do you. So normally in a blind. It's blacked out. You know. In there. Do you wear. Do you put on black. Like. No. A lot of guys will put on. Like a black shirt. I know. And a black face mask. And. What do you do? I know they do. I don't. But I have. I leave my mesh up on my blinds. So like when it's like that. Oh it's. It's a little bit different. It's hard to see in there. If those are down. And you'll shoot through the mesh. Yeah. I do. If it's tight. If you got the right blind and you can make it tight mesh. Yeah. Like if it's loose and floppy. I don't know. But.

But I've tested it. I think it still shoots through it. But I don't like it. I've shot my block. I don't mentally like it. Yeah. Until you do it. Yeah. You got to know. Okay. That doesn't affect my arrow. And it doesn't. It's weird. And you're also talking about. You know. Your shoot. Your shots are going to be 25 to 50 yards. You know. What I would say. 30. 30 good wheelhouse. You're not shooting 60, 80 yards. No. Really. It's 20 to 30. Yeah. Really. You know. You know. But if a deer held up out there. You know. You may be at 40, 50. So you go get in this blind. Generally you're sweating your guts out. Oh I was sweating my guts out. Sweating. Even though this wall. Because the wall of water left. Right. Like it's kind of this big. And it's not hot. But you're just. You're just. I chose to sit in a blind. I set. I set one up at one of these. Because. For scent. 100% because of scent.

I think it contains your scent better in them. At one of his waters. One of the waters. Yeah. Because it contains your scent better. Than just making a brush blind. Well. And what I like too. Is it totally concedes your movement too. Movement. And brush blind. And let's face it. Sometimes you're sitting there. This. Not. Or this deer. But sometimes you're somewhere. And you got does. Or fawns. Or you got elk. Or something coming in. And you. You don't want stuff. Elk. Cow. Running off. And barking. And ruining your whole night. So there's other stuff. Non-target stuff. Did you spray any scent remover on. Or just straight up. Oh yeah. You did? Yeah. What did you use? Like. Do you remember? Whatever. Just some kind of scent killer. Yeah. Whitetail stuff you'd use on a whitetail. Yeah. That stuff. Same stuff I took when I hunted whitetail. Silver. And Iowa. That stuff. And then. You know.

Your deodorants. You know. Whatever that. No scent stuff. It's like. Okay. That stuff. But so. Maybe it tries to help. But. But fortunately. I mean. The direction the deer usually came from. Was going to be directly downwind. But fortunately. Today. You know. We watched him go. Into an area. That if he came straight back from there. He was going to be. He was going to be upwind. He wouldn't smell me. But. You never know. They could come into water. And do a whole. 180 degree loop. Especially. He's kind of on edge. To smell it. And to smell. So. Luckily. You know. It's probably. You know. How most of you guys are. I'm getting older. So. When you sit that long. You get stoked up. Your butt loses blood supply. You know. You're sitting on a stool. Like. It's just like. It's true. I got. About every 45 minutes. I have to do a slight little stand up. And just let. You know. Rub your legs.

Just let some blood flow normally for a minute. I did one of those at about 8.15 or 20. And as I'm doing that. I look out the mesh. And I can see him standing about 50. 60 yards over here. You know. So. I got. I. There's no anticipation. There's like. He's. He's here. It's gold time. He's ratcheting. I can see the dropper with my naked eye. And I'm like. I don't even need vinyls. So now. I get back. The bow's always laying in my lap. With a narrow knot. Once in a while. I'll set it to the side. Now it's going to get real. Now it's up and in my hand. And I'm. I'm looped up. I mean. It's like. There's no movement. I have to do other than draw my bow. You're done tweaking. And you're looped. I like it. None of that. Sounds good. But. But yeah. So anyway. The rest seems. I mean. There's. You know. Very normal. Comes into water. Comes into water. Goes to drinking. Yeah. Draw my bow.

He never even. Did you even think about when to draw. Or was his. Wanted him to commit. Now. Yeah. Now that I thought he's here. I'm not fighting daylight. There's no. You know. Get him comfortable drinking. Get him. Get him. Forget about anything. Is it windy enough. Like when you draw your. Never even. You're not going to hear anything. He never even lifted his head. Wow. I don't know if it was as windy enough. But it's just. Some of that also keeps a little. Your sound in there. Yeah. It kind of does. You got mesh. And just. Yeah. Soundways got to get out. Yeah. They just. I feel better. It's bouncing off the material a little bit. And it's dampening it. Yeah. And I don't know. I do it more for my scent. I know that they. I've gotten away a lot more. I've gotten away a lot more. Yeah. Deer downwind for me. Sitting in one of those. Then I'm in a brush blind. When in your brush blind.

Your scent's just gone. Did you kick like dirt up around the base? Oh yeah. A hundred percent. Outside inside. It was a very well. Placed blind. Yeah. One of the best I've seen. Yeah. Well thank you Devin. It was. You put some time man. I'm telling you. I don't know. It was legit. Did the Ninja stock. You were impressed with that? I was very impressed. I'm impressed. You were very impressed. I wish I'd have killed it that day. Because it felt like it was meant to be. And I was pretty. Well and spot stock's pretty. It's pretty awesome. It is the way you want to do it. And I felt like I kind of let one get away from me. A little bit. That morning. I felt like I should have killed him. Or midday whenever it was. But it didn't. But anyway. So anyway. So somewhat. I don't want to say anticlimactic. He's over there drinking. Because it's still awesome.

I mean you still can't believe what's happening. The whole story is amazing. Because I've never. I've never killed a deer. Day one. Here's the third chance you got. I don't think I have. I know I have it. With a bow. Or anything. Yeah. Yeah. So shoot him. He jumps like crazy. So you let it rip. Yeah. You let it rip. How far was he? How far was the shot? I don't know. Just. 23 and a half yards. Top pin. Something like that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean just. I didn't. Angled it. It was a little bit angled. Hit him right in the middle of ribs. Came out right in his armpit. But it just blew through him. And he took off. He. Blood everywhere. I could see naked eye. Blood going. He jumps. And runs out there. And he runs out. Bout goes down. Does a little loop. Rises goes over the hill. It looked like everything was given out. On his legs. And then all of a sudden. Quiet. And I'm like.

I know he's dead right there. Wow. Couldn't call Devin. He didn't. He has AT&T. So I knew. I'm wasting my time. So. I call. No radios or anything. Well. Yeah. But like. I don't know. Was your laugh. Well. The problem. Defend myself first. The problem is. Is like. There's no reason to have even radio. Because like. Nobody's going to get to anybody in time to do anything tonight. Anything tonight that happens is going to be for the next morning. So. Anyway. I did what I was told. Yeah. Okay. I was going to go up to this area. And like Adam said. He's like. You really don't need your radio on. We'll save the batteries. And I'm like. Yeah. Yeah. But Aaron will have his on if you need it. So I get going up the road. And I see something shining. Where I was going to park. Yeah. And I mean. We're way up here. On this road. And you're like. I was way up there. Who's in my spot. Yeah. I'm like.

Oh. Somebody's here. And it was a little car. Subaru with. And at first I thought. No. Should not be there. First I thought. Like you're. One of the odds. There's going to be a body or something up here. You know. Scared me. Of course. Devin. Devin. Devin. Devin. Devin. Devin. Devin. Devin. Devin. Devin. What are these people doing? And I'm thinking probably a parent from one of the lost boys that are out and about doing the drug camps. That went through my mind. There was one little Walmart tent and two brand new lawn chairs. That's all that was there. And then I could hear, oh, every once in a while. You're out blasting. No, not in the tent. Just up on the hill. And so I tried to radio, Aaron, but it didn't work. And then I saw the folks. Yeah, he looked like a nice old prospector and his wife, June. Oh, nice. But anyways, yeah, I didn't have. Yeah.

He didn't have a good night because, yeah, he mentions the word June because he knows her name and he never met them. Yeah. How did you know that? He was yelling, June! June! And I'm like, what am I doing here? So I pack my stuff, hike back to my bike. What were they doing, getting in an argument out there? I think she was a little lost. He knew the way. Oh, man. Pretty soon you're going to be out there looking for June. I would say June and whoever the other guy was. July. Let's just say. Johnny and June. Johnny and June. Yeah. We're closer to 80 than 70. Okay. All right. But anyways, so I bail and I go to leave to go to another spot and there's Aaron parked into the road. Prime time. Like, what are you doing? He's like, dude, do you not have a radio? I'm like, yeah. I do. He said, let's go. He killed the buck. It was awesome. It was a whirlwind. It was.

And then I kind of want to hear maybe, you know, what was brought to the keel side. Maybe. Yeah. I missed this. Who didn't have. Yeah. Let's hear that. Yeah. What happened? I had everything I needed. It's preseason. No. Not a lot of mid-shape, mid-season form going on. I had everything that was needed. I had game bags. I had knives. I had everything. Listen, what I didn't have is somebody with the second knife or anything. Or a second headlamp. There's one knife and you guys are going. I said. I got a stick of gum in my pocket. Pretty much. I had a lot of guys running my old phone. My cell phone battery or my light. I had two headlamps. Lots of leg holders. So these guys go back, meet up, drop at camp, get in one vehicle, drive to me, halfway to me. They realize they have no packs, no what? No knives, no, I don't know. Nothing. We had water and a towel. Literally. To their defense.

That was so good. Darren's like, let's go. And he takes off. And I'm on my 2004 four-wheeler. So I'm not going as fast as him. 2004. Honda. Yes. Uni shock. Is it a mono? I don't know. Does it have two? There's two, but it's not independent. I know that. Well, there's at least two. So anyways, I'm trying to get as fast as I can. I'm like, okay, let me do my stuff. And you're doing 22 miles an hour, getting beat up. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Which is fast for me. And Aaron's like, let's go, let's go. You know? And I was like, all right. He said, he needs water. It's a bloody mess. And he has water. I grabbed a five-gallon jug of water. He had a towel. And I was like, do you think we need a pack? Like, did it die in front of him? He's like, no, yeah, it's right there. I think we're good. So we took off. We show up to the buck. I have a headlamp. I borrowed one to Aaron. And the water.

And two bottles of water.

Luckily, what does Jason teach us all about the epic knives? There should be one in every truck. There should be one in every door panel of every truck. I said, walk back to my truck and get my dive. Buy that one. So I at least had some help. They didn't just watch me the whole time take care of a deer. It was funny. But we had a good, this is not preseason form moment. Yeah. I think we were just excited, man. Well, it's not the first time of the year. You're missing a gear. Oh, you're missing you. Well, hey. You got gear and everything. Well, and the excitement. That's probably about the last thing you guys were thinking was going to happen. Yeah, we were almost there. And Aaron's like, dude, we don't even have a pack. I'm like, I know. I said, my knife's in my pack. And he's like, I don't even have a headlamp. And we're going to drive up to Adam. We're going to have a Bronson moment.

I felt good.

Yeah, it was fun. Adam and Aaron looking at each other going, really? Yeah. We didn't really need a pack, though. You didn't. We didn't. 100 yards of the truck, we were out of there. Anyway, overall, it was, you know, he died near a two-track. And it was nice. So, anyway, long story short, very special night. Everything goes right. And you look like you're smarter than a fifth grader. It's pretty awesome. It was a good way to start the year. Fun time. So, yeah, next morning we broke camp. That's when I seen you in town. Yeah. We saw you back towards the Utah border and getting a gas station. Well, and I called you. I lost service. I called you at the kill site. And you had some other guys show up or whatever. Scotty service. Yeah. And you're like, dude, you won't believe it. What? Anyway. He's toast. Yeah. I couldn't believe it. Well, it was pretty special. Pretty fun. But, anyway.

Great start to the year. Pretty awesome. We're ready to go round two this week. There we go. Yep. Utah archery. Utah archery season's starting. Just want to throw a little shout out to QU. QU. QU. make incredible gear. They're a great sponsor, good friends of ours. Go to QU.com if you're looking for any base layers or insulation, outerwear packs, sleep systems, footwear, accessories. I love their vinyl harnesses. They're incredible. Anyway, go to QU.com and support them. They're awesome dudes and make incredible gear. Another shout out I want to give is to Kenetrek. Made awesome boots for a lot of years. They're hunters. I think that's important actually. Jim and his crew, Jim Wengeman and his crew, they're hunters. He's hunted everywhere. He's hunted all over the place in all kind of extremes. They've got a boot for everything. I've got a couple key ones that I like.

I like the Desert Guides, which is non-insulated, no wind text, waterproof, nothing in it. Just a great well-built leather boot that stands up to stuff you can throw at it. I used that on, well, I used it some in Nevada. I use it on a lot of my desert sheep hunts where water, rain, a lot of that is not important. I want them to hopefully breathe a little better than something with any kind of insulation or waterproof membrane. They also make one very similar to that, the hardscrabble hiker. I also use the mountain guide, which is kind of a souped-up version of the old mountain extreme. I like that one too for a high-top insulated boot. But anyway, something for all uses. They've got low-top boots, kind of cross-trainer type. They've got everything. But check them out at Kenetrek.com, K-E-N-E-T-R-E-K.com. And you can order online. They also have free shipping on everything over $100,

which any boot's going to be over that. But they've got other accessories too. Great guys. Great company. Pretty awesome. Yeah, another shout-out to Red Rock Precision, making incredible rifles. And I've killed a lot of stuff with Red Rock rifles. Are you getting another one on order? Yeah. Maybe. So that's that? Well, is Jenna listening?

Not at this moment. Adam, thank you. This could be Jenna. Is there a podcast she doesn't edit? Maybe she should not listen. Maybe we should edit before she edits. Might be her. Could be. I didn't say you. I said you had. It could be her gun for Christmas. Possibly a birthday gift for Jenna. That's right. In a 7PRC. She's going to be ecstatic. So anyway, Red Rock's actually coming out with a new model. Anybody that's interested should be giving them a holler and getting on the list. I'm, I think, getting one of the first out. So anyway, pretty awesome. New serial number? Yeah, I don't know. Yeah. Kind of got some ideas there. Double 07. Hey, how about that? One was the date we got married. So I don't know. Maybe I'll have to do something else. You did a gun with a serial number on your anniversary? Mm-hmm. Wow. Yeah. That's pretty, that was pretty awesome. Is it your gun or Jenna's?

No, it says, it says J and J. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, yeah. It's pretty awesome. Hey, I'm like that. Now, my wife. Don't you guys, nobody's surprised. I am that guy. I'm the first I've heard it and I've known you for, I've known you for 25 years and the first I've heard of something like that. I'm that guy. I am that guy. I look forward to Valentine's Day. So anyway, redrockprecision.com. Redrockprecision.com. Incredible rifles. Can't be beat. And yeah, they got some really exciting stuff coming up. In fact, we're probably, we got some exciting announcements too and a partnership potentially with them as well. So, all right. Anyway, redrockprecision.com. Pretty awesome. Want to get an incredible rifle. Now's the time. Same with optics. Back to our optics. Epic optics. Man, we've got a lot in stock and it's time and we take pride in being able to get guys quality gear within just a few days.

So if you're looking for something for, you know, great pricing, the best pricing out there, quite frankly, and something that's timely, give us a holler and we'll get you hooked up. I can't think of anything else. Cash, why are you so quiet? I don't know. When are you going to start hunting elk? Next week? Yeah, next week. You got a general elk tag? I've got a general elk tag. I'm going to help on a, help on a limited entry hunt and that's going to be fun. And you've been scouting a limited entry. Yep. What's your opinion? It's, it was a slow growing process but they're finishing out nicely. Very nice. We're talking, very nice. Talking limited entry elk. We're talking legit. Southern Utah. Good. Yeah, we've, we've found a giant that we're going to, we're going to try to, try to put one in but, Archery tag? Archery, yep. So we'll get first. So yeah, you've got the odds between some,

some general, some deer and some, your own general elk on top of a limited entry elk and so you're, you're going to hunt in between basically whatever's left over. Yeah, just any, any spare time. Did you get a multi-season or did you get archery only? No, they didn't, they didn't hook me as bad as they hooked Josh. I spent 50 bucks and just did an archery and I'll go whenever, I'll go when I can. Josh, you get hooked. 200 though, isn't it? Oh yeah. 200 bucks. He's all up for the multi-season and then you tried to go up the chain and throw your weight around. What do you mean? It seemed like you complained a little. No, that was, that was somebody I knew. No, I didn't complain a bit. It was just a surprise when, because you didn't see it at all until you went to check out and then all of a sudden it was there and I was already too far into it. It was a significant. And you're on a timer.

But also, I think it's mental too. It's mental. You wanted it, got it. What was it? 150-ish? It used to be. No, what was it? 150. They gave you a deal. If you bought one spike tag, it was 50 bucks. If you bought for all three, it was 150 bucks. And then you ended up. So you're 50 bucks. You're 50 bucks a season. You just said 200. I know, that's what it used to be. It's 200 now. Now it's 200. It went up July 1st. For a multi-season tag. For the multi-season general Utah tag. And so then Josh was like, what? And then he about lost his mind. Pulled the trigger anyway, though. I was too far into it. Couldn't stop it. Mama didn't raise a quitter.

And this is coming from Josh who puts his car in neutral coming all the way down to Cedar. Trying to save gas money.

Maybe even kicks it on and off. Didn't you log out, log on into your, was it your wife? Careful. And then have to do it again? Oh, this was a, this is a backdoor method that basically, yeah, you still logged in, got to buy two, right? No, you have to sign into whoever's account. Yeah, but since you were, but you're already in your line. Since you're already in line, you have to wait. Well, does Walmart make you start over because you're buying a drink for somebody else? When you check out and then you got to go back to the shelf to get some, you usually go, you know what I mean? This didn't make you go back to the shelf. This just said, do you rely on anything else? Yes. Well, while you're here, yeah. Yeah, while you're here, check. Yeah. You can add them at that time, too, if you want to. If you want it. You could add another sports person. Five kids or something. Yeah.

You're buying spiked out. What it allows you is group hunting to occur better. You know, you don't just buy one and find out they sell out in an hour before you can get one. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, fun stuff. Are you okay now? Isn't that a backdoor secret on Idaho, too? Yeah, it is. Guys that we're doing, I guess we can talk about it. We just talked. Yeah. Guys that go in and you wait and do. In December. Yeah. You can, you know, you log out, you log back into somebody else's account, grab them and tag two. Log out, grab somebody else's. And so that's how, you know, why they've got other guys that are waiting. Yeah, and so it was really frustrating because it feels like cheating, but it's their system. They know what's happening. They're very smart people. They also need to fix that system. I don't know. Yeah. I don't know if it draws the answer, but it's like,

that was a cluster last December. Jeez. Yeah. We also have Muley's Matter. I guess we can get a little plug for it. Yeah. Jump in there, Josh. Oh, I was just going to say, don't, don't forget, you know, now's probably the best time. We got all our deer hunts just kicking off. So if you haven't heard by now, we're doing a big giveaway in December. Essentially, we want you guys all to go out and hunt as hard as you can, kill a giant deer. We want you to do that. But if you don't, and you don't happen to find a giant deer, you know, we're saying if you don't need to kill a deer just to kill a deer, we got another option for you. Yeah. Before December 1st, we're having guys send in their, their tags to us. And essentially, we've got some awesome prizes that instead of just going home with nothing or feeling like you wasted some money on a tag, you could take home a pretty significant prize.

And it's pretty legit. It's pretty legit. It's a huge list of stuff. Yeah. Your odds are going to be pretty good. I'm going to have a hard time choosing. Oh yeah, you would. Oh yeah. Yeah, you would. It's not like, you could take some Bronson cash or you could take some, you know, Carter cash. Or you could have a prepaid gift card from Carter for 500. Basic card. I'll do that. I'll do cash. I don't care. We're going to test the check. I just want some Bronson cash. We're talking, well, I mean, we're talking lion hunts, rifles. I know. Some pictures, paintings, pedestal mounts. The support we've had is awesome. Shoulder mounts. Now it's starting. And I'm just saying, now that it's starting, don't just smash a buck just to smash it. If you want to kill it, kill it. Eat it. Enjoy it. Whatever. We're saying, go hunt. Just don't just smash one to be able to say you got one.

If two by three is your thing, do it. If it doesn't mean anything to you, just do it. If you let the two by three go, if you're, if you're okay with that, if you want to kill it, kill it. There's some big two by threes out there though. Oh, there's some management bucks. There's no question about it. Some of them even hit there. Idaho or Utah. Anyway, so there are, this mealy's matter thing, that's the basis for this was, we've had extended droughts. And then this year it was just too much. We had an incredible winter and it was hard on Northern Utah. You know, a lot of Wyoming, Idaho, Colorado type country, even Nevada, you know, and parts. And so it was just like, you know, if we're, if some of these States can't just limit tags, you got over the counter tags in Wyoming or something. So all it was, was just saying, Hey, just to raise your awareness, pause,

a reason to pause before just crushing a, a buck that you've shot five or 10 of them that look just like it, you know, and it, and it coming off tough years. Yeah. Drought or winter. Yeah. And so then it just started this whole conversation, you know, about, and of course this comes on the heels of everybody's so frustrated in these drought times and whatnot with game and fish being somewhat lethargic in changing tag numbers or whatever it is. Reacting. Yeah. Yeah. The, the slow to react. And so we're like, well, what can we do as hunters? I mean, you can't change what game and fish does. You we've tried. Right. But there is, there is quite a few people out there. There are quite a few people out there that, that think that you should be able to have just over the counter tags period. And it's not going to affect anything. Technology won't affect anything.

I was having a conversation with a guy, um, even down in parts of New Mexico. And I mean, and, and, and he, and he, and he says that he says, most of the big deer I know about are going to die of old age. It doesn't matter about technology. It doesn't matter if you literally said, if you issue more tags than there are deer, none of that matters. So, you know, in a lot of this country deer are going to die. These big deer that he knows about 180 plus are going to die of old age. And so restrictions don't matter anything. And there is, there are people that believe that. And I think in places of, you know, extreme desert or let's say the Frank church wilderness or nasty back country, or even just thick pinion juniper stuff. The nature of the, of the train, whatever it is, you know, if it's up in the rubies or, or, or whatever, maybe, you know, there's some of that,

but just imagine if you had over the counter tags on the Ponce. Yeah.

Well, there's a reason it used to be that way. That's the reason the Ponce was closed is it was a general unit. Right. And it couldn't sustain it. There's fairly, fairly well-roated. It's not a real remote unit. Right. I mean, the deer migrate early. So if they do that at the end of October and you got a thousand people cruising all the roads down south, you crush bucks. You crush them. The only chance they get is to get to Arizona before. And what if they had, and then they're hunting. Yeah. What if they gave over the counter tags in Arizona on the strip? They used to. They used to do the Kai back. Well, they did. I mean, back in the day when there wasn't technology. That's the reason they stopped it for six, seven years. And then it's never been gone back. It's a bit of a limit entry. And we think it's great and awesome, but that's the same thing with the Henry's.

But their point is a lot of these guys are like, yeah, but I'm never going to be able to hunt there now. So what's the use? Well, well, my, yeah, you got 1500 limit entry unit tags in Utah and you got 75,000 general. So there's a little give and take. And we like that. Yeah. We like that. There are still over the counter archery in Arizona and a lot of, a lot of it with harvest. It's limits. Right. And so I like that. I like that the, all these systems different, but I guess what I'm getting at part of this is some people might think that we're a little extreme on saving all the deer and that really it's not going to matter. But I think depending on the state and area you're at, everything's different. And that's why management is different depending on the state. You can't, Colorado is not going to be managed the same as New Mexico and Nevada and

Nevada's managing for 30 bucks per hundred does or whatever, and hardly given any tags. And then when these wet years do come, they have an incredible number of big deer, you know, you know, dozens of 200 plus inch deer running around on a year like this. And so anyway, there's not a one size fits all. I don't think you can go over the counter in every single state. Pentagon. What would, what would all these places look like? Right. But then maybe there's places and it's kind of opened my eyes a little bit. Maybe there are places that could withstand over the counter pressure, unlimited over the counter pressure, no limits on technology. Maybe, maybe because of the nature of the train, you're out in the sand hills of Mexico or, or you're up in some crazy wilderness stuff. I don't know, but mealy's matters here because we were seeing extensive, you know, decline.

So overall populations have on the back of your mind as you go out, huh? And that's all it's supposed to do. Maybe give you a reason not to pull the trigger or punch or release just, just to do it, but, but go have fun and shoot what you want. We want to be clear about that. And, uh, we do need your actual tag. It will go in an actual bin. It needs to be the paper tag. If you want to, if you want to do your CID numbers, yeah, if you want to cut out your, anything that's super identifying, you can't, you know, your tag number, your CIDs that are blocked out. Understandable, but we need a paper tag. We're going to draw a literal paper tag. It's not going to be, yeah, it's the only way to do it. I'm not even sure with the CID, the information that's on a paper tag. It's not enough to break it. Most states you have username and passwords anymore, but I mean, but anyway, don't. All right.

Well, do they need to write their phone number on there? Well, we need to be able to contact you, of course. So, I mean, what maybe with that, we'll have a spreadsheet that we put down. If you were picked for something, we need to be able to get ahold of you. So if it's not on your tag, which most states, it's not some of it is, do you need to get ahold of your email and phone numbers? It'd be great, but all the details are on the website. MuleMatters.com. Josh, your wheels were spinning. I could tell your gears were turning, but jump into it real quick. Just your thoughts on the Muley's Matter and what we've been talking about with conservation and things like that. No, it's good. I think it's good. And it's just our way of trying to help out. You know, everybody tries to do something and it's just our way of doing it because yeah, it's like you were saying,

not everywhere can be hunted over the counter. The reason why some of these deer live in places like that is because the average hunter isn't going to go down there because you can't just go down there and ride the road. It's not, it is not fun. And so guys want to go out and have a good time where there are places up on the mountain where you could go drive around and hunt. And if you did over the counter like that on some of these units, they would annihilate every single deer off of there because people are naturally going to gravitate to the areas that are the easiest to hunt. Yeah. And there's guys that just want to kill a deer. There's nothing wrong with it. I don't, I don't care, but there's guys just want to go kill a deer and they would go there and they would know those areas and they would completely annihilate it, which why you see, even there's units in Utah, I don't know,

name the last time a giant buck came out of some of these units. There's not. There's some, there's some units. Similar to when, Robbie asked me, Robbie asked me, he's like, do you think there's no trophy deer in some of these units? You really think that? Yes. I mean, there, there could be something somewhere. You don't see every single deer, but you don't see some units, especially units that are around highly populated areas and stuff around big, big populations of people that they manage for 15 to 17 bucks per hundred does. You, you don't see big deer come out of them. And you're talking big units. Yeah. Oh yeah. They're not small little. It's a lot of country. Yeah. Even if there's one big deer that say come out of Monroe. Right. Yeah. Monroe is one of those that I was talking about. It's a huge unit. But I'm thinking about it. And with social media, if there was one killed,

you'd have heard about it. Oh yeah. Yeah. I mean, or local. Yeah. Whatever. You don't, you don't just pictures and people. So yeah, it's, it's, so I think there's a, people are passionate about what they know too is, you know, sometimes people are talking about winter kill and we, we just don't see it here, but we do see drought. And so we're all dealing with challenges. Yep. And we're trying to address all those challenges, those particular two, drought and winter kill in the, in the muleys matter movement. And the thing I've, I've noticed that, I mean, a hundred percent, our deer are coming back. I've noticed it. I've seen it on some of these units and, and it is a good thing. It's not a bad thing. And, but we don't necessarily have to kill them while they're in the process of coming back either. And when they're coming back in their infancy, you want to, and they're like,

let's get a mature herd back. Right. Yeah. Get a good age structure built up, you know? And so it's, and they're coming back and it's going to be awesome, which, which means tags can increase, which is, that's what we all want. We all want a deer tag, you know? We just want to have some deer there when we do it. So it's good. I want to address one other subject.

I'll be interested to see what you guys think. Is there's people, there's people out there that say, deer, it's never been better. That even, they know old timers that even their dad or grandpa say, you know, that it's never been better than it is now. What do you guys think of that? Where do you think they're from? I don't know. Do you know where they're, I'd like to know where. Yeah. Because I'd like, I'd like to go there. I'd like to go to that place. I, I said that and was guilty of saying that. But do you feel like people do feel that way? People feel like it's as good as it's ever been. It's good. No, not right now. Not, not in where we live in here, whether it be even Utah. We live near Nevada. I mean, we know what the drought's done. A lot of it's, but Southern Utah, Nevada, absolutely not. Not even, I don't, I couldn't find one person. In 2017, 2019, 2016.

Some of these good years. Those, those were the best I've ever seen in my 40 years of life. You know, it's short 40 years, but that was the best I had ever seen it and contended that it was probably the best it's ever been, but it's not now. Yeah. We've lost several hundred thousands of deer in this state and so it's not. Yeah, it's not. And it, and it was also enough time had gone since we've gone to unit by unit and tag numbers and, but, but on general season scenarios, three to 500 tags on a unit. Yeah. Yeah. Can really start negating that, that benefit that you're seeing pretty fast. And when I say I'm negating, again, I'm being maybe hypercritical of seeing a few older deer on these units. I understand their general season unit, but, but no, I'd like to know, find those people, Carter. I'd like to go hunt where they're hunting. I'd like, I'd like to look them. In fact,

I'll go with you. So, I'll, I'll be your wingman. I want to be your wingman. Well, well, you and I's hunt was starting at the same day or I'd have been your, one of your, I know, but, but find out where those are. Maybe it's in Nebraska. I don't know. Like, I don't know where they're talking. Anyway, just good conversations out there, but you know what, what they say about opinions. And so, and I get it. What this mealy's matter movement isn't necessarily a one size fits all perfect for everything. Not going to fix. It's not going to fix. West wide. It's not going to fix drought. It's not going to fix winter kill. It's just doing the little bit. we can do to help. And maybe even for the next 10 years, you think about, do I really need that two by three or two by two? Or do I really need, do I really need to harvest that? Or am I cool to let that deer walk and maybe gain a little age?

And I don't know, just maybe change the thought process. You can, you can post on Instagram, a picture with your brand new rifle. You want instead of your two by three. How about that? Right. You could still look cool in front of you. That rifle is probably worth more than the tag. Here's my Bronson bucks. Yeah. You can. Oh, 500 Benjis in your hand. Carter backs. I'll initial them if you want. Actually, all five. Send them right to your door. I like it. All right. Well, anyway, yeah, so you can, you can, Logan, you talked about this really quick as far as actually when you send your tag in. Before you send the tag in, they fill out a registration on, on, on, yeah, the monster. Mealy's matter.com. Right. Adam just mentioned, we needed a way to get ahold of you. Well, before you send in your tag, go on mealy's matter.com. It's not up yet. Is it mealy's matter.com? No,

it's epic outdoors.com. Both of them will take you. Oh, okay. Yeah. I like it. So either go to epic outdoors and click the link or go to mealy's matter.com. Um, the registration form isn't up yet. Cause we're not quite accepting tags yet, but when you do get ready to send in your tag, you'll go and fill out a form before you send in your tag and it'll put in email, phone number. You'll pick the prizes you want and the order you want. So we can just get it right to you as quick as possible. Okay. Yep. All right. Okay. Sounds good. Well, we appreciate you everybody. Uh, cash, you got anything else? No. You want to tell us where this big boy is? Uh, no. How's he built? He's built very nice. Long and heavy. Long. I like it.

Devin, how about you? What about me? You got anything as we close this thing down? I'm, I'm going to go. You're hitting the road right now. He's going to go climb in a car. I'm going to walk out this door and go try to find what, see what why it's doing. Oh, since we haven't talked to him for a minute. There you go. Yeah. We need to see what he's doing. Go try to find him. Josh, you got anything else? Nope. You're steaming over there. No, I'm good. Now it's, we brought up the tag fee increase. You just lost it. He's lost it. I'm trying to think where I'm going to go do good on that $200. Spike. What do you think that spike costs the state to race? I mean, when you add an aerial flight, 13 cents. All their wages that you're saying they got, all these wages and the health benefits. What do you think a deer elk costs? I don't even care. It's just funny. We've all been there when you're like,

am I really going to click this confirm button on this prize? That's true. That's true. We have recently. It all doesn't matter. Just a little bit more neutral time and you'll be just fine. When the fletches are buried deep into its ribs, you don't even care at that point. It's worth it. It's worth it. It's worth it. Time with family. Yeah. What's it worth to you, Pollock? When you got a muscle chunk this big smoking in the smoker. It's the best $200 you've ever spent. The $1,400 Traeger. If it's a beef. If it's a beef chunk. It's the best $200 you've ever spent. All right, everybody. Have a good weekend. We'd like to thank all of our sponsors here at Epic Outdoors. For top of the line hunting, clothing, and apparel in every environment, visit UnderArmor.com. We'd like to thank Under Armour for being our title sponsor and making this podcast happen. Visit our website, EpicOutdoors.com,

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