EP 254: Mule Deer Updates Across the West & Stories from Bill Heinselman

Anything to do with Western big game.

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Hey everybody, Jason Carter, John Peterson. It's late, John. It's freaking way late. It's 8.15. I'm usually in bed by now. How about you? Yeah, we're pulling a late nighter here. Late nighter, third monster in, which, you know, we haven't talked about monster, but it's because they don't pay us. And they just take away your health, right? That's right. They're not good for you. But how can anything that makes you feel so good be so bad for you, John? I'm sure there's a lot of things that fall into that category. About everything in life. So, kids, don't drink monster. But when you're 50, I mean, every day over 40 is a blessing, John. That's right. And it's a gift. You never know when you're going to go, so you might as well enjoy it. All right. Well, it is late, but having said that, we don't get in the office very often. Bronson, he's in Alaska. He's sheep hunting. He's cranking.

I know I've got an inReach message. Hiking his guts out. Looks like it's going to go the full length. You know, some of them come easy and some don't. It sounds like this one's a grinder. Short messages usually don't mean good things.

He had a phenomenal sheep hunt in Canada. This one will turn out well. Everything he does ends up good. He's a good hunter. So, anyway, we're expecting good things. We've got Devin and Josh. We might try them here in a bit. It's just after dark down there in Arizona. They're cranking out elk down there having a blast. Been a great hunt. You know, the rut's just getting cranking. And some places it's even a little bit slow. Slower than people thought. Like New Mexico, I've been kind of checking around with my outfitting buddies a little bit. But, anyway, I'm in the office for a sec. John, you're here cranking out the next magazine, the October-November hunt. Yeah, we're getting close to going to print on that magazine. So, somebody's got to do a little bit of work. And that'd be us. And, of course, we all take our turn. I've been in the field a lot and headed back. So, not a lot to report.

Remember, short messages don't mean good things. So, I'd be bragging all about it if it was good. And it's not really that good right now. I am thinking, though, for next year, you hunt elk in September and deer in November. I might be going back to that, John. We've heard that before. But, it's hard when you have big deer on the brain. So, anyway, there's a lot of wet conditions around southern Utah, Nevada, Arizona, Colorado. Of course, you know, who cares, right, about Colorado. But, anyway, we're expecting great body conditions. And, potentially, if there's any spring at all, an incredible 2023. I can't believe we're saying it, 2023. That's crazy, huh? So, some scouting reports up there in Wyoming, deer-wise, mule deer-wise, incredible. There's some big deer in the high country in Wyoming. So, there's going to be a few slammed. Hunts are getting cranking here shortly.

And then, on the winter range, of course, there's always a few that make it through. And it'll be jaw-dropping. Pretty sure about it. So, overall, you'd predict a pretty good mule deer year across the west. Yeah, good mule deer year. That's what it's looking like. Utah, pretty darn good.

Considering a lot of the hunts have kind of come and went, or at least are finishing up the archery, especially. And there were some big deer shot. There's some big deer killed. And there's a few big deer alive. And then, you know, same thing with Nevada. There's been a few really solid bucks taken. Kind of average or just sub-average in Nevada. But with these tag cuts and lots of moisture, we'll take it any time we can get it. But let's just say summer, fall, heavy moisture means good body conditions for the winter. And then, if you have any kind of, you know, spring, as well as these tag cuts, you know, you're just getting some age on deer. There's some deer that have never seen a, you know, in their mature years, haven't seen a good, wet, normal, awesome year. And so, that's when you have, you know, 40, 50-inch jumps. And that's what we like. You know what I mean?

So, some incredible bulls in Nevada. Big bulls in Arizona. And really big bulls in Utah. Exceptional year here in Utah. John, we have a good buddy of ours. I haven't told you this yet. But anyway, he forwarded the pictures of a 412-type bull taken here in Utah. So, just barely a couple days ago. Wow. So, pretty, pretty awesome. And, of course, we expected it. This is one I didn't necessarily expect. But it's also kind of off the radar. I wasn't thinking a lot about it. So, pretty, pretty fun. You know, there's, of course, sheep. There's going to be some great sheep taken and whatnot. A lot of those hunts have yet to come. So, fun. It's a fun time of year here in the office. It's fun out in the field, too. But, when you're getting your butt kicked, it's kind of fun to lift your butt. You're going to be a little bit. You know what I mean? Yeah. But it's by choice.

It is fun to be here in the office. And you get updates from everybody. Yeah. You know, around wherever they are. And just, what, yesterday we got video from Devin and Josh. I mean, it looks like there's bulls in their laps. Yeah. Not to reveal too much because it's hard right during the season. And we have guys right here, John, in our hometown that pry and then go tell competing friends here in the industry. Those are maybe not quote-unquote friends. So, friends keep secrets. You got to keep those kind of friends really close. Closer than we do. But, anyway. So, there you have it. Kind of got to be respectful of people when they're in the field and can't reveal too much. But guys are having good hunts. Well, I want to, John, what do you think about maybe giving old Bill Heinzelman a call? He's killed some incredible animals. He killed Bigfoot. Freaking 270s type inch deer. Amazing deer.

In Arizona, you know, he's killed other amazing bulls. He killed a giant tule in California. I just want to kind of get the scoop from him. You know, what does that entail? I mean, teach us something. It's something I haven't done. And he's kind of fun to visit with. You know what I like about guys like Bill is no is never an answer. If he wants to do it, he'll do it. He'll figure out a way. He's a success story in and of itself. His business. And, you know, it just tells you a lot about somebody. And that comes off in the field as well. He's successful in business. He's successful in the field. He knows how to get the job done. He hires the right guys. And he does it based on knowledge too. He just doesn't just blindly go do things. He does it with good knowledge. Let's give him a holler. See if he's up and at them.

Beep.

How's it going? Good. How are you doing?

Doing good. Just thinking about hunting. Are you? I was wondering, you know, when's your bedtime? I was just wondering about that. Oh, I'm up late. Okay. Well, this is usually my – I'm usually in bed by now. Well, I'm actually – no, I'm hiking out to the bike usually right now. There's still light out. Oh, yeah. It's probably late where you guys are, right? Yeah. I'm in California. Yeah. I mean, it's not light out here. Yeah. I got 25 minutes of light still where I'm at. You could be surfing. Do you surf?

No. I don't know. I'm just wondering. I've tried it. It's hard. I went to Hawaii, and then I booked some access deer hunt to go chase some deer around with my bow. Oh, yeah? Nice. Yeah. Which isn't bad. Yeah, I'm going to take my employees out there this December for an employee hunt. Yeah. Well – Key employees. It should be fun. Yeah, it'll be awesome. It'll be awesome. Some of those employees that are listening to this podcast that aren't going are going to realize they're not key employees, though, you know? Yeah, that's how you – That's a problem. That's how you figure out you need to work harder. Listen to the podcast. All right. Yeah. Well, Bill, before we called you, I just – you know, I kind of bragged on you a little bit that, you know, you're quite a success story in your business and whatnot. And that comes off in the field as well. You've been very successful in business.

You're very successful in the field. You don't take no for an answer. You're just very energetic and very aggressive. I don't know how much of your personal story you want to share as far as, you know, good fortune there in California and whatnot. And then just – and your mentality and your attitude and how that comes off in the field. And you've been extremely successful on getting the right tags, having the right information, hiring the right guys. And then – and it just feels like you've got an upbeat perspective on life and your hunting and whatnot. And just kind of maybe get your take on some of that. Yeah, well, thank you. I – yeah, with life and everything I do, I try to be the best at whatever I do.

But what you see and know about me for hunting and being successful and hunting, you know, for every nice buck or bull I've killed, there's five or ten trips and a bunch of tags that I've eaten tag soup on. And hundreds and hundreds of miles of hiking and lots of failures out there too to – that go along with the one successful hunt or the two successful hunts. And, you know, I am blessed. I have a successful business and a great family that support me in what I do. And, you know, I'm fortunate to be able to target tags where there are some really great animals and great genetics. And I think genetics is a huge part in killing a big animal. You know, you can hunt your whole life in some of these units and never see a 400-inch bull or a 220 buck or a 250 buck. You know, it's just – They don't make them. They just don't make them. They just don't make them. Yeah, the genetics aren't there.

They just don't grow. Yeah. And so, you know, as I – I've only been hunting since 2010. I started hunting. Wow. And, yeah, once I got into hunting, I was like, man, I really love this and it's something I'm very passionate about and I really want to do it. But I want to be the best at it. I want to go out there and chase after big bucks and big bulls and have fun doing it. I love being out there. You know, nothing better than being out in the mountains during the rut. And my wife's getting mad at me every year because my birthday is on September 23rd and I haven't been home for a single birthday in the last 10 years. Did you remind her it's not your birthday? It's mine. It's my birthday. And I'm okay not to celebrate it. Right. Yeah. I'm like, where else would I – she always says, what do you want for your birthday? Yeah. Yeah. To hear elk bugles. That's it.

Have a bull screaming in my face. Preferably like a 420 bull would be good. Yeah. You know, so – yeah, so I'm blessed. I target key tags. I try to at least. And I try really hard to find people that can help me on some of these hunts and scout because you can't – you know, running a company and having a family and that you cannot do all the scouting necessary needed to be successful to kill a giant animal. Right. Right. Or to go after them. And you know that than anybody. I mean, you spend so much time out every year scouting and glassing and running cameras where you can run cameras now. Yeah. Yeah. It's a lot of work and takes a lot of time and energy and money sometimes, you know, to do it. And I get not everybody can do it and that, but there's a lot of stuff people can do themselves to make themselves more successful. And applying every year, using your guys' tag service maybe.

I mean, that's – Yeah. You know, putting in for the right units and zones. Most people don't know where to even put in for. Right. What is a trophy unit? And, you know, they talk to their buddy and their dad or grandfather says, you know, you need to hunt the Ruby Mountains. There's these giant bucks over in the rubies. And, you know, I've got a big group of friends that every year put in for the rubies and they hunt there. And, you know, one or two of them kill a 140-inch deer a year there. And then they hear me going down to southern Nevada, 231, 242, these premium units hunting. And, you know, they're asking why and what are we doing down there. And, you know, they're killing giant bucks. Right. You know, literally the biggest deer in the state are there. Some of the biggest deer in the western United States are down in those units. Yeah. On the right years for sure. Yeah.

The right years. Yeah. Yeah. It's been tough lately. But it looks like it's picking up. And, you know, I'm excited to get down to some of these units and hunt. And heading to Arizona tomorrow to hunt Navajo for a week maybe. And then off to San Carlos for a week. And it should be fun. Yeah. That'll be awesome. That'll be incredible. Well, speaking of the Navajo and you killed Bigfoot, one of the biggest deer killed in recent history.

I just can't get over the tenacity you had. There's some guys that'll, you know, that buy tags or book a hunt or whatever. And they go on a hunt and then they go home and don't think much about it. And you were obsessed with this deer. It took you a couple years. You know what I mean? To get this deer killed. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This deer lived. We found this deer in 2019. The day before my hunt opened. Got him on trail camera. And he was just a huge buck. And, you know, we thought he was like a 230, 240 type buck. And so I spent the whole 2019 season hunting him. I spent weeks and weeks, you know, almost months out there hunting him and just diligent up on him, sitting before daylight and until dark every day for weeks and weeks and weeks on end. And just could never connect on him. And he's a smart buck. He's a smart buck. And he's huge because he's smart.

But he lives in an area where there's some giant deer. Yeah. Thick. Yeah. It's really flat where he lived and really thick. There's no vantage points to glass from. So it made it extremely tough to hunt him. The only thing I really had was water to sit. Water. And I sat water for weeks at a time. And he would come in and they just, you know, you'd be there an hour or two hours after dark every time and never hit water. What I did learn about him and other bucks is first freeze of the year. And this is a good tip because if you're out hunting and you're after a buck and you know it's going to freeze and it's the first freeze of the year. You may be able to get your buck if you're there on that first freeze of the year because I wasn't there but my cameras were. And two days in a row he hit it 9 a.m. Wow. Him and like 15 other bucks came in both days. Into water, right? Into water. Yeah.

Into water in November they came in. It was first freeze of the year where it was really, really cold and the water froze and they were on the water two days in a row at 9 a.m. Probably because it melted off by then and they could drink?

I think so. But it was really thin ice. You can see them kind of breaking the ice with their hoofs, some of the bucks. Yeah. And the big guy came in last but he was, man, boy, he was impressive on camera. We had some great video of him coming in with the other bucks. And, you know, these bucks are all hard horned then. It's November but they were, it's like 15 of them came in at a time. There was a bunch of bucks came in those days. So, the next year, same thing. First freeze of the year next year. I mean, granted, I had already killed Bigfoot but we still had cameras out. But first freeze of the year, the bucks were hitting the water during the day again. So, it's one of those things where if you don't notice that, you can't take advantage of it.

So, that's definitely something that is a good tip for somebody chasing a buck towards that time of year when you're getting that freeze and you're trying to connect on a buck on water. Yeah. That may pay off. I can't remember which year it was but I was getting daily updates from you and I'm hunting a big deer. You're hunting a big deer. Yes. You killed the big deer. I didn't. I didn't kill a big deer. I ate another tag. Yeah. But it kind of keeps you going. It just, you were, I mean, you were running scenarios by me and I don't have all the answers but maybe just a perspective, you know. Trying, yeah. So, yeah, the 2019 season I hunted him with no success. I was lucky enough to buy that auction tag again for that area. And 2020 season was on him really hard. It was a completely different year. Water was scarce. Everything dried up. Everything dried up.

We ended up finding him like eight miles away at another water hole. He, for some reason, didn't like to drink out of metal tanks. And we almost connected with him. And we almost connected with him one day. But, yeah, I was having a tough time and I would call you and run through scenarios on ways we could, you know, I could possibly track him out, rake the ground. And then so all the tracks are clean and then follow his tracks or, you know, different methods. And none of them seemed to work. And it was just very tough and frustrating. You know, and I'm seven, eight weeks into hunting him. And it's frustrating. Frustrated. It's frustrating. It's terribly frustrating. Yeah. And on top of that, at that point in my life, I had never seen a 200-inch buck in the field.

And I remember literally sitting up on this windmill that was nearby just so I could have some elevation to glass a little bit and also watch that water hole. Yeah. I literally said a prayer to God to help me with this giant buck, help me be successful. And I opened my eyes and no shit, I see a buck coming into water with a giant frame. And it's like a 210-inch buck, just a giant frame, typical with three kickers coming out one side and just a huge buck. And I was thinking to myself, I'm like, God answered my prayers and he's given me this giant, beautiful deer. And I'm just too stubborn to take advantage of it because I have my heart set on this amazing buck. Bigfoot. But two years into it, I was like, it's Bigfoot or nothing. And that's the key too. If you really want to kill a giant buck or a giant bull, you've got to pass everything else. Yeah.

You have to pass the 390 bulls if you're going to kill a 400. Yeah. You just have to. And that can be tough. But so eventually he, the buck ends up getting bumped by another hunter. And he comes, this hunter comes in there with his dog and he's the other trophy tag hunter. And the buck disappears. So we lose sight of him for two weeks. I go off and hunt, hunt another. I go hunt in San Carlos after a bull. And by the time we pick him up, my guy texts me some pictures of him on camera during the day. Every three or four days he was on camera at a brand new water hole that's real tucked in and tight. The old water hole he used to be at the year before. But on the metal tank, the water, the dirt tank had dried up and he left because he just never drank out of the metal tanks. But getting pushed in the pressure, he went back to his old, his old stomping ground.

He's drinking, he's hitting the water out of that metal tank. It's really tight with cedars all around it. And he's hitting water three times in a row during the day. Jeez. And so I just dropped everything I was doing and went over there and built a blind that day and sat it the next morning. I let it sit for a day. I sat it the next morning, which was the third day of him not hitting water. And he didn't come in the next morning. But that night, he, like 20 minutes of light left. Sure as shit, he freaking jumped out of those cedars and jumped over a bauld wire fence into my view. And it just happened so fast. And I just, I seen him for a second. And I kid you not, I grabbed my rifle and put it up. The second I saw him jump into view, put it up. And he already had me pegged in the blind. Wow. That quick. And if I, I think, yeah. Wow. It was, it was amazing.

He was looking right, right through my scope. Yeah. Yeah. He was just, I pulled the trigger on him and, and I, you know, I, I probably seen him alive for five seconds. And, and, and, uh, that was it, you know, I, I, and I didn't know where he went and I was just shaking. Like the amount of adrenaline that hit me was crazy. I've never had that feeling in my life. You know, I don't, I don't get, uh, nervous shooting at a, at a big bull or, you know, 400 inch bull. It just, then my nerves don't get there, but I've never had an experience like that where I've spent so much time and energy after one animal for, for multiple years. And, uh, to finally be successful and, you know, and to text you, Hey, I got them. It was surreal. It was surreal. It was amazing. An awesome experience in my life, but I don't, not something I want to do again.

Honestly, it was, it was brutal and it's, it's tough on family too. And, and wife, kids, like when you're gone and you have to explain to your wife why you're going to be gone for weeks and weeks at a time is, is tough. Yeah. Yeah. So, but it's also like, I don't know. You're I'm like you, like, I don't get nervous at the shot anymore. I used to when I was a kid. And then I finally got mad at myself cause I was like, I work all this time to have this one opportunity. And then when the opportunity presents itself, I fall apart. And so I had to, I forced myself to get over buck fever, but then I, I start wheezing and coughing and choking. And I mean, when it's over and the, and the, and the deer's laying there and it's a world-class deer, you just, I mean, I lose it. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. It takes me a minute. It takes me a while. You know,

It's, it's, it's an amazing feeling, right? It's a feeling like nothing else in life. I mean, you, you, you, the amount of effort and energy that you put into hunting a big buck is, is just crazy. You know, and people, people won't do that. People will not sit out and, and sweat their asses off or freeze. I mean, I can't tell you how many days it was 15 degrees out. And I literally sat and froze from dark to dark. Yeah. And didn't, and did not move an inch. You know, I stayed there all day. And then I was like, that's, it was the worst feeling ever. And then the next day I do it again. The next day I do it again. It just doesn't matter. It's like, I'm going to be there. Yeah. And I'm going to kill this buck. And, and, uh, it's just something you have to do. I mean, I mean, people get, you know, I wouldn't say get lucky. People kill bucks though.

You know, just driving down the road and they kill giants or they, you know, they, they go out and the conditions are nice. And the bucks are all bachelored up and they're, they're patterned and they're in a nice, easy area to hunt. And, and I just haven't had that hunt yet. I'm still waiting for that hunt. Well, that's easy. And mine, I don't know why mine are always difficult. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you're hunting crappy country. Yeah. The reservation is not easy down there. It's not. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, it can be tough for sure. So then you do anything you can to put another animal like that on the ground and it, and it's something, you know, it's just something unexplainable when you, I, you just want that shock and awe. I just love, I live for that shock and awe and it's, I don't know if it'll ever happen again. It feels like it's been, it's been a minute. You know what I mean?

And you just, but you keep grinding day after day after day. It's not easy to do. Yeah. And then, and then I, I kill a giant, you know, 276 inch buck. And then he's, all I get is, oh, you're never going to see a deer like that again alive in your life. You'll never see it. But in my head, I'm like, what do I need to do to, to get my next one? Yeah. You know, cause I, that's, that's my goal is like, I want to go out and, and, uh, have that experience again. Where I touch an amazing animal or, you know, to be able to walk up and touch, touch that rack and look at it and look at, you know, how amazingly beautiful that animal is. And, and, and, and, you know, what you went through and what your friends went through with you. Cause you, you have a, you know, a team of guys too.

It's not just you, it's other people, other friends, family that sacrifice to, you know, to that are all part of that hunt. And, and, and, and it's, yeah, you know, and, and that's something else to consider. You know, I had some great guys with me when I hunted Bigfoot and, and, uh, you know, it's not a, it's not a one man show and it takes, it takes a lot of effort and energy from everybody to make something happen. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I've, I've been grinding it out with a couple of my buddies, uh, here recently and I don't know, man. I'm not sure they're still my buddies. Yeah.

It's hard on people and I don't, you don't want to disappoint them, but I mean, it was, you know, anyway, sometimes you don't see a buck for a week, you know? And so. Yeah. It's tough, but yeah, it's, you know what, then if, if it all comes together. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's what you have to be. I mean, it's, it's amazing how it can, a giant buck can just step out after not seeing a buck for four days. You can just see a monster all, you know, just like that. So Bigfoot, we, you, you know, when you were sending photos and whatnot, like every, you know, we, everybody had their opinions on what he would score and, and the beam lengths and, and the, and the crazy triple splits on the beams and just, just all kinds. It's just so crazy. But what was it like, you know, walking up to him? I mean, was he as big as you thought? Was he bigger? Um, so the, the crazy thing was I walk up to the deer.

And I, my initial reaction was, oh my gosh, he's smaller than I thought. Jeez. Because he's laying, he's laying on the ground and he's, he's got so one thing, so much mass that it, it kind of hit the point. Yeah. Yes. Yes. I mean, he has tremendous point length everywhere, but he had a ton of mass. Um, and, and it kind of, kind of hit it. Yeah. So I, I'm like, whoa, he's kind of smaller than I, than I thought. I mean, I thought he was a two 50 buck and I think you thought, what'd you say? Like two forties. Yeah. Something like that. Or two, uh, who knows? I'd hate to say I was that far off, but maybe. Yeah. I thought, I mean, you just don't know. He has that, he has that, it's hard to say anything. That's a 260 incher, you know, but he, he, he had so much going on and he has a giant frame, four point frame. On top of the extra. Giant, 210 inch frame with, with a 10 inch and 14 inch G2.

Right. Right. Which is crazy. But eye guards and beams and everything's just sick. So. Yeah. It's just a beautiful, beautiful buck. And nothing, I, I, there's something about giant eye guards on a buck that just get me. No, yeah. I, I, I'm, I love them. I can't, I can't tell you how many, how many 195 to 205 inch bucks that I've passed. Cause they don't have eye guards. Yeah. And I don't know what's wrong with me, why I do that, but it's just like, I like eye guards. And I want, I want, I want eye guards on a buck if I can hunt a buck like that. Yeah. Yeah. Slickshank. Yeah. Old Slickshank. He's, you know, I've let a fair number of them live. So what I, too, um, you killed a giant, Tule. I just kind of wanted to get your take on, there's not a lot of people have done that hunt. Uh, you know, they don't give hardly any draw tags. Um, they're in California. It's kind of a special deal.

I've never done it. I just kind of wanted to visit with you about that. Um, obviously you were, you got to scout that a lot. It's not an hour from your place or whatever. Yeah. And very capable of going out and knowing the bulls that are there, but it's also a unique hunt and a totally different hunt than normal elk hunting. And so maybe just tell us how that went down and what people can expect if they're looking to kill one. Okay. Well, um, it's a Grizzly Island tag, which is, I think it's the hardest tag to draw in California. Um, I bought the auction tag. I bought it in 20, uh, 2020 also. And so this was my second year having it. The first year I, I had a couple of target bulls and, uh, I ended up killing the, at the time, the number four Pope and young bull in the world with my bow and which was a, which was he, he grossed three 19 and netted three 11.

And, and so I, I, the, the area out there, I'll kind of describe that area. The Grizzly Island's 6,000 acres. It's entirely flat. Um, during the winter, they flood, they flood these fields. There's these little checks, three, three to four foot tall checks out there. They flood the fields and it's, it's all Mars toolies and stuff. They use it for duck hunting and that, and, uh, people can go out there and hunt the, um, a lot of the property, uh, isn't flooded. Plus there's a lot of private property around there where the elk go. Right. So, um, and that's something that people don't know that, like, oh, is it high fence? What is it? No, it's completely free range. Um, which is, is obviously great, but it also screws you because your tag is only good for that 6,000 acre piece of land that the state owns. Right. Okay.

And at, at any given time, I would say half the elk that are in that herd, which is about, uh, 180 cows and about 80 bulls. Okay. Different size bulls. So, so we were looking at hunting there. There's about 80 bulls out there and, um, a hundred and 180 cows. So 260 animals. Um, the biologist said that there's about five to 10 bulls every year that get killed during the rut from being bored. So they, so they lose five to 10, five to 10 bulls from that every year. They also kill six spikes a year, six cows a year. Wow. And, and six bull tags a year.

Okay. So the, the first rifle tag starts tomorrow and it'll go for a four days, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Okay. And then the next, the next rifle tag will start the following Thursday and go Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. And it's three, three rifle tags, um, each, each group, um, the hunters, there's some main roads that the hunters can go on, but they have to park their vehicles on at these designated parking areas and then hike out in, into these areas and hunt. Okay. Um, the, the main, the main area, the center portion area is called red house road. The majority of the writing activity happens right there. It's really easy to get to, um, typically there's 20 to 30 bulls there and cows and, and crazy writing activity. Uh, it's pretty, it's pretty wild. It's pretty intense. Um, uh, I, I go out there myself.

I'm out there from April, May on, uh, by, by June 10th bulls, bulls this year were already hard horn. There was already four or five bulls hardcore on June 10th. Yeah. It's crazy. And, and by, by mid July, almost everything's hard horned out there and they're already starting to rut in July. Wow. Yeah. It's kind of, it's kind of, it is crazy. It's really crazy. And, uh, it's, it's a, it's a, it's flat. It's, it's got some, some grass that's, you know, most of the grass out there is 18 inches tall or 12 inches tall. And then it's got this other type of grass that gets into these little patches that are maybe 30 inches tall. And then you, then you get patches of toolies that can be shoot eight to 10 feet tall. And the, you know, these bulls just go into there and actually entire hurts of the elk. They'll go in there and bed down during the middle of the day when it's hot.

And, and you won't, you won't see a single elk, you know, you'll, you, you drive out there and even right now in the, at 11 o'clock in the afternoon, you won't see a single elk around. And then, you know, an hour before dark or hour and a half before dark, they'll just start trickling out of the grass and places you look in glass all day long. You don't see anything and, and you can see all the way around it. And then, you know, these, these elk just magically appear and then a half hour of light left. And man, it is a party. These guys are just screaming and bugling and rutting and chasing cows and fighting. And wow, it's, it's, it's fun. It's a really good time. Rifle is a, it is a super easy hunt. I mean, uh, it's a, it's a pick your bull and, and, you know, shoot them. It's not going to be a long shot typically.

I mean, uh, in, unless you're just not sneaky, um, there, there's almost always a 15 to 30 mile an hour wind out there. Cause basically an Island, right? I mean, it's, it's, it's an Island, but it's not an Island. It's there. There's a slew that's a few feet deep. Yeah. Uh, on one side, maybe, maybe four, four feet deep on one side. And, and, uh, and, um, it, it wraps around the Western half of it. And then there's another slew Montezuma slew, which is a, a, a little bit deeper, maybe a eight to 10 feet deep in spots on the east and North side. Um, so they call it an Island because it has these slews around it, but it's just private property past that. And so, um, like for, for my hunt this year, uh, opening day, I was on my bull, uh, then he had moved off Island and my, my target bull, I scouted for months and months.

I had pictures of pictures, video of every bull on the Island that I could find, which is probably every single one, honestly, cause I, I did account. I, yeah, I live, yeah, yeah. I live there. And yeah. So, so, um, my, my bull stayed off Island on private property for 22 days straight. Wow. And nobody can hunt the private. Like you can, is there a tag valid for the private? If a guy would let you hunt him? No, there's not. And that biologist said he was, they were fishing game was thinking about possibly letting, letting, uh, um, hunters hunt that. Yeah. So, um, you know, for me, I'm, I wanted to, my goal was to get the world record with my bow. Yeah. Um, and, uh, to, to have an animal 2020 season, I killed the biggest bull out there and it was three, three 19. Right. And I did it with my bow. So this year I go out there and we're scouting, scouting, scouting.

And all of a sudden we see this giant Pennsylvania, this bull. He's nicknamed him Pennsylvania. Yeah. Cause he, he, he looked like the, these crazy growing Rockies that they have in Pennsylvania. Like Dwayne Kramer's or whatever. Like, yeah. Like Kramer's four 56. Yeah. It's just, just magical giant, you know, short beamed, lots of points, lots of extras and, you know, kickers coming off the force and fifths and, and just, you know, they, they grow some crazy stuff. And this bull, his left side looked just like that. It was just amazing. And I'm like, man, it looks like a Pennsylvania bull. He's just awesome. Yeah. And, and we knew right away, as soon as we saw him, like that, that's the bull right there. You know, there was nothing, nothing out there close to him, nothing at all. You know, and it's just, you know, I'm maybe going to kill a, a three 20 bull maybe out there this year.

And then, and then there's that monster. And, you know, I, so I, I, my tags good for 30 days. I'm, I'm in 23 days into my hunt and, and, uh, actually 22 days into my hunt. I said, you know what, maybe we should just go out there and kill one of our, kill one of these other bulls and, or try, try to kill one of these other bulls with my bow. So, and so we kind of settled on what we thought the number two was, and we went out there to go hunt him. And that night we couldn't find him. Um, when I got there and the next morning we're, we're leaving camp and we're glassing, glassing some bulls. And I, and I look over right on the edge of private, I see the number one bull Pennsylvania. And I'm like, there he is guys. He's, he's back on the, on the Island. Let's, you know, we got to make a plan to go after him. So our plan was to, to, uh, uh, get in between him and the private property.

First of all, cause, cause we looked like he was slowly, slowly feeding towards private. So we got in between him and private and then, um, he kind of pushed towards us and then he seen us. And so he pushed back on Island, which is what we wanted. We wanted him to bed down or get in a spot where we could stalk him. Um, and, uh, winds blowing 30 miles an hour. So there's zero worries about wind or noise. Um, we, we, we tried to put some stocks on this bull and, uh, got, got, uh, pretty close to him, end up, end up getting an arrow off at him, hit him in the shoulder, um, hit the shoulder blade, just like two inches, two inches into that, into that blade. Yeah. And, uh, um, you know, tough, you can see there's no penetration. The bull, the bull, you know, rutting and all he, he, he ran a little bit and then he, then he just started walking again and feeding. Shook it off. Yeah.

He was, he shook it off and, and we were like, wow. So we ended up not, not getting him. He went back, he joined some other bulls and we watched him most of the day out feeding and that. And he was just going to go to private no matter what. And so we tried to cut him off to keep him on Island. And at some point he's seen us in between him and private and was like, Hey, I'm going to private and just decided to start running to private. And at that point I'm like, Hey, if he gets off, he's not going to come back on. Yeah. Uh, for the rest of the hunt, there's only six days left of the hunt. So we, we luckily had the rifle right there and pulled the rifle out. And, and that was the end of the story. And, uh, or not, I shouldn't say the end of the story. Cause cause you know, I, I, I was able to, to get a good shot on him and, and, and, and harvest them.

And, and to our surprise, when we walked up to him, he was way, way bigger than, than what we had ever imagined. Yeah. Um, I mean, this, this, this, I think animals, when they have so much mass, they really, really hide their time length. Um, what did he, what did he end up going? He ended up, uh, grossing three 69 and seven eights and then, yeah, huge. And, and that is a super tight, tight tape on him. We, we undercut everything, every measurement that was a 16th over, we undercut it and we were so tight on how we measured and, and where it comes off. Um, I mean, he, he's probably going to grow, but he's, he, he, he's going to gross over three 60. Um, he'll be the number three all time. Boone and Crockett, the new number three for Hunter killed Tule. Wow. Yeah. That's pretty awesome. So where was he? He's a giant. Where was he last year? You know what I mean? What was he? Yeah.

And the year before the year before he probably wouldn't even have broke three, uh, uh, there are two years ago. He wouldn't have broke 300. Jeez. And, and last year I never seen him. No kidding. Probably on private. Never seen him on private the whole time. Probably. Yeah. And so that's something else you got, you know, you go out there and you're hunting all these animals and you're like, okay, there's four or five bulls that I like that are pretty, pretty nice bulls. And then, and then the, you know, the rest are just, just bulls. Yeah. And, and you, you go out there one day and you'll see 50, 60 bulls. And then the next day you go out there and you see 15 and you talk to the, the guys at the duck club on the West and they're like, we got 40 bulls on. Our property right now are 50 bulls on our property. Wow. And they just stay there. They'll stay there for weeks at a time. Yeah. Wow.

So it's, it's, yeah, it's, it's an amazing place, but it's, it's, uh, it can be frustrating. I'll tell you that it can be frustrating. You can, you know, see something nice and have no, no opportunity to ever hunt it. Yeah. But it's kind of nice. You get a, you know, something you can do right there in California and you can crank. I mean, you know, give me some other good reasons to live in California, Bill. Yeah. Yeah. There's not a lot. There's not much. I mean, yeah. There, you know what? California has big desert sheep, right? Yeah. They do. They have big, big sheep. Yep. Huge sheep. We've got some great Rockies up in, in the Northeast corner. Yeah. The elk. Just giants. Yep. Yep. Yep. There's some giants up there. There's some giant Roosevelt's. Yeah. Giant toolies. Yeah. Yeah. Not, I, I don't think our bucks are too great, but I mean, occasionally some guys get, you

know, kill a, kill a big buck here and there. They do. Yeah. They do. There's some, that's a pretty cool opportunity there actually in some of that stuff. It's tough to draw. You'd have to buy a tag or something, but, um, I don't know that and electric cars. Have you got an electric car? No, I won't. I won't get it. I dropped kids off at school and there's six electric cars in front of me and six behind me when I drop my kids off. I'm in a four wheel drive truck. No kidding. For real. They hate you. You're, you're ruining the air quality. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's tough. And to make, to make it worse, I think California is so mismanaged. I mean, they, they, they don't allow, uh, hunting of mountain lions for forever. Right. I know. And, and like, I've, I've seen more mountain lions in California, uh, posted on people's

ring doorbells and, or on their security cameras in my neighborhood than, than on, uh, yeah. Trail cameras in Arizona or Montana or other places. You're in Nevada. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like literally there's, there's mountain lion sightings in, in, in these residential neighborhoods in my, my area. And there's always missing cat, missing cat, missing dog, missing this. And I just laugh because people are like, Oh, my little, my little dog got out of the backyard. I'm like, no, your dog didn't get out. Like he, he got eaten by the mountain lion that you saw in your ring doorbell. He's, yeah, he's cat, he's cat crap right now. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So it happens, right? There's people get attacked by mountain lions in California. There's sightings everywhere. And it's just, you know, you cannot go in one of these units where they, these D units, which is around my house and, and find a buck.

Yeah. You just, you just can't. I mean, if people see a, uh, uh, one, uh, one year old fork and horn, they, they shoot it. You know, there's no age quality to any animals here. And it's, it's terrible. It's crazy though. The department doesn't know some of the sheep that are out there and whatnot. Like they just, I don't know. Like it seems like they could do a better job surveying and whatnot. There's been a lot of, you know, there's just a lot of, a lot of opportunity out there, but who are you going to call? You know, who are you going to talk to? Yeah. So. Yeah. Hopefully they draw my tag one year. Yeah. Getting at max points for everything. And I've, I've never drawn a tag in California. Yeah. Crazy. Well, I appreciate you taking the time. I'm looking forward to the day that you've got a surfboard strapped to the top of a Tesla.

No, no, you're not. No, you won't want to talk to me if that day comes. That's her. I tried surfing. It's not easy. It is not easy. No, I'll try it, but it's going to be sitting on the, on my, on, on the back of my King ranch. Right, right, right. For sure. So. Well, good luck on the hunt you've got going. I know you're headed out. I'm glad I caught you tonight. I just kind of, it's just awesome. I love the Bigfoot story. You, you know, of course, you know, you end up, you know, purchasing a special tag down there, but like you ground it out, you know what I mean? For a couple of years. And just, I just love, I love the story. I love the freaking deer. Um, we appreciate that. You know, letting us have it. It's great. I mean, it was awesome. Yeah. I'm glad you guys had it. And, uh, uh, it was awesome to share it with you guys and, and to have you guys score it for me.

And that was, it was awesome. So it was crazy. Yeah. You know, it was great getting all the advice from you for two years. Free, free advice. Free advice. It's awesome. Right. Let me, let me, let me phone a friend. Yeah. Well, I didn't do much help. Yeah, you did. But I mean, and one time it seems like you did, you guys did end up glassing him up in that thick stuff under a tree, but such a rare thing to do and tough and, and, uh, you know, I felt your pain, but I don't know. All the, all that was, I mean, most of my deer still live and die of old age and, you know, whatever. So anyway, you, this one, this one didn't make it and I was, I was proud of you guys. You guys worked it at worked dang hard and, uh, and we're successful and he was just, just one of a kind. So. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Don't ever give up. Right. All right. Yeah. Yeah. You guys have a good night. All right. Okay.

You too, buddy. Appreciate you. Yep. Take care. Bye.

Well, pretty awesome story. And like he mentioned, we didn't, we didn't say it on here, but we did have his deer in our booth at the hunt expo. Yeah. Um, yeah. And it was just a monster. Yeah. So some of the things I just wanted to kind of bring up that he said that I think is more important than you think. And that's the phone a friend when you're there. Sometimes you get there after five days, you're, you're almost on the edge of burnout. And, and just that fact of calling somebody up and talking to them about what's going on, even if they don't have anything that's, you know, earth shattering, but it can change your perspective and help a lot on a hunt. Well, and so a lot of times, like I'll phone a friend and it's just nice to unload your burdens for a minute and to have somebody say, I believe in you, you're going to do it. Go get back up on that knob.

You know, what do you, you know, uh, and just, it's just nice to, you know, and then, but when you're talking about it with somebody that knows the area or knows the country or whatever at times, you, you know, you just, you kind of unload what you're thinking, what you've done and what you might potentially do. And it's just nice to have a sounding board because it's pretty lonely out there. It is. And it's nice though. You're really like upbeat whenever I'm out and I call in, you know, and you're like, Oh, you're going to do good. You're going to do good. I've showered twice a day down here. You wouldn't like it back here at the house, but you know, it's nice. It's nice. It just, yeah, it unloads your burdens. And so if, if you haven't done that and just call somebody and talk to them about it, call John or I or anybody else that answers the phone here at Epic and happy to visit

with you. A lot of people are a little bit intimidated. They like thinking that we're going to run out there and hunt their buck. Like that's absolutely never going to happen. We, you know, we've got a full schedule year in and year out and bucks and deer and elk and things we've got on our own plan. So anyway, it's hard. It's hard for guys to truly, you know, unload and say, Hey, I'm, I'm at my wits end on this, but I've had a lot on Instagram guys hit me and, and it's awesome. Or even, Hey, so what do you think this thing is going to go? Am I just absolutely crazy on thinking it's the next world's record and you know, whatever. And, and, and dudes are on some special animals and it's pretty awesome. And I'm like the biggest cheerleader ever. I absolutely want him to kill it. Yeah. You know, absolutely. No, no problems. I love it. I love it.

I love hearing about other people's successes and, and maybe being a small piece of just, even if it was just a sounding board for a minute. So one of the other things that he said that I identified with, and that's, we don't get religious very often on this podcast, but when he's talking about sitting up there praying, I mean, I'm, I'm fairly, I'm fairly religious, but who hasn't when I'm in the hills, it's like the heavens open up and I'm like, God's next to me, you know, and I find out, please, please. You know? So, so that was, that's fun. So walk me through that a little bit more. So you do, you, you pray aggressively. Yeah. And, and I just, there's something about being in the hills that just, it like opens up. And I mean, me personally, it's, it's impossible to not be a believer when you're in the hills, you know?

And I mean, I am anyway, but it's just like, maybe it's your higher, you're closer to God. I don't know what it is. Speaking of God, so you know how people are like, I mean, people, okay. So, so people are, you know, if you're laying under the stars and you see the universe, right? And everything that's going on, you're like, you know, how can there not be a God? Right. Right. And you go over that whole scenario. So I'm hiking along and I see Elon Musk's satellites, 40 or 50 of them in a row. It's star length up there in star world. Hall and bud across the entire sky goes across the entire sky and disappears. And I'm like, I got to Google this. I think it's his freaking satellites. And so I Google it. Sure enough. What, how does a private individual make it to where the whole world gets to see my satellites up there and take part in the whole star galaxy complex? I'm like, holy crap.

Anyway, I did have one kind of funny story about that. So my, my oldest son was like six maybe. And I took him fishing. We go to the lake. We're fishing, fishing, fishing, not one bite, you know? And he's looking at me like, dad, you're a lame fisherman. You suck. Well then this hillbilly family, nothing's wrong with hillbillies, but I mean, it's like the clamp. It's show up next to me and they pull out their power bait. And they crush it. And they crush it. And here you are. Are you doing fly fishing? Are you fly fishing? No, we were spinner fishing, you know, and whatnot. Just the metal lure. It's not going to work like power bait. Dad, we're going to catch a fish, you know? And I mean, I said a prayer and I was like, please, Lord, if, if you could answer one prayer, just let us catch one fish. I'll never ask for anything else in my whole life.

Dude, I promised the next cast, he caught a fish and I was like, hallelujah. We're packing up and going home. Son, you killed it. He was so happy and I was just like, oh, yes. Yeah. Funny, funny. If you go home and make them eat them, you might not ever have to take them fishing again. John.

All right. Well, let's call Devin. It's, I know it's their bedtime and they're in a tent down there in Arizona, but they've been having a good time. The elk are kind of going crazy from what I understand. I don't know. I haven't checked on this evening's hunt. Let's just see if he answers the phone. I don't know. It's what? Nine. Fifteen. So here we go. Let's give him a holler. Devin turns into a pumpkin about nine o'clock. Yeah, he does. Your call has been forwarded. Yeah, I'm not going to take no for an answer. We're going to call Josh.

Josh will answer every time. Yeah.

Hello. You and Devin spooning down there or what?

Wow. Got a hot dog in our mouth. Oh, wonderful. Got mustard on it? Oh, yeah. Is that all Devin's cooking is hot dogs? Oh, yeah. Oh, geez. He's treating me with... My hands are full. Delightful dinner. I got soup, out and due, desert dogs. Desert dogs? What's a desert dog? Oh, I'll cook you one one day. It's a hot dog that's been way too long outside of a cooler.

Shriveled up. Is there one on there? I don't know what it's doing. I don't know. What are you guys doing? We're just podcasting. It's way past my bedtime. Yeah, dude. I needed some food. Yeah. I was... How many miles to do today? Nine? Yeah, almost nine. Nine? Does that include you guys getting out and opening the gates? Everything combined. Well, we called you. You've got to tell them about this desert dog. For real. It's really good. It is not. It's a jalapeno cheddar broth. Oh, no kidding. Oh, never mind. I'm just not supposed to give the recipe. Oh. Who cares? Podcast recipes. He wouldn't answer his phone, so I had to call you.

Pretty uneventful day today. Was it? Yeah. So you built a blind.

What else? Weird. Five bugles. Well, I don't know. Quite a few bulls, but just couldn't... Yeah. We just picked the wrong ones. Yeah. You know what I mean. Are you running, gunning? So you're chasing bugles right now? Yeah. Too much water? You don't feel like they're coming into water in daylight hours? Or is it, you know, maybe it'll dry up in the next few days? What are you thinking? That was my gut feel. It's getting warmer every day. Yeah. We had elk on water last night, right? Right at dark. We kind of raced them back to the water, and they just held up. But... Yeah. Yeah, water. I don't know. Put a blind up just in case. And didn't hear a bugle anywhere near it tonight. Yeah. I had another bull. I think he had cows. He just held up and then just turned and walked. And I never did catch him. I don't know. Jeez. How many hunters have you seen?

A handful. Like three or four? Yeah. Isn't that crazy? That's what happens. The worst, most undesirable place on the whole unit.

The lowest density, most garbage place on the unit. Pretty much. Have it to yourself. Chase a few bugles. You're going to do well. Yeah. Pretty awesome. Pretty awesome.

Well, right on. We just kind of wanted to get an update. Of course, you're in the heat of battle. People are probably hunting the unit and going to be listening to this podcast. So we don't want to give away too much, right?

Not a lot to give.

You're on a roll, Devin. Yesterday was just one of those days that you make all the right decisions. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. And we got lucky and a bull just was, he was just, he came out 50 yards and had a big giant dead snag. And I had a couple windows, but I just didn't, I didn't take it. We had another bull between me and Josh and this bull has cows. I'm thinking he's going to come run this bull off and he didn't. He just let him go. Wow. I never saw him. I chased him, chased him, chased him till dark and ran out of light. Huh. But yeah, today was, we made all the wrong decisions. Well, tomorrow's a new day. So pretty, pretty awesome. You guys are down there cranking. Um, all right. Well, that's about it. I mean, do you have any elk hunting advice for everybody else out there that's hunting elk right now?

You're not calling much, are you? You're just, you're, you're running and gunning, chasing bugles. Maybe making them call, making them bugle. Yeah. We've been calling quite a bit. I'd just say, I mean, like I always say, don't be timid. If I, if I would have went a little harder yesterday, I held up for a minute thinking he was going to come back when that other bull was there. Yeah. If I would have 100 yards, unbeknownst to me, they're great big giant clearing and he was just rutting cows in there. I just, I didn't, you know, I was too timid. Yeah. Should have went for it. Yeah. All right. Okay. Well, good luck tomorrow.

I can't wait. I love the daily updates. So. Yeah. We're, we should have a good night. We, we pulled our sleeping bags out. We're going to try and see if we can find star link tonight. So we were just talking about this. The Elon Musk satellites. I mean, every time when you look at the stars, you're supposed to think about the universe and how awesome it is. And you know, that God created all that. And then all of a sudden, Elon comes flying across the sky and you're like, really? I'll tell you what, if they're out there, we're going to see him tonight. It's unreal. Yeah. I was hiking along right at daybreak. I mean, it was dark with headlamp, but, but breaking in the east. And all of a sudden these 40 or 50 satellites come ripping. And I mean, they are hauling. I'd like to know how fast they're going. You saw them, Jason? I saw them. I saw them. I told you it's insane. No, it's insane.

I've never seen anything like it. I Google it. I Google it. We're in a row like 30, 40? No, they say there's like 40 something. But I thought there might be 60 when I was looking at it. It was, and they're perfectly spaced. They're a perfect line. And they are freaking hauling. And I was just like, I kind of felt lucky to see him. I mean, it was like I was, you know, some, it was some special event, you know? And anyway, went across the entire sky out of sight. Hey, we got a bull bugling right here. Right now? Yeah, while we're eating desert dogs. How many desert dogs are you each going to eat? I actually ate two tonight.

Yeah. I was hungry. Yeah. You guys have some, you guys have a good handful of wet wipes? Because you might need them.

Those things sound disgusting.

Josh, he wants to talk a lot more, but you've got to keep it G. Josh, got to keep it G. I'm just listening. All right, guys. Good luck in the morning. Thank you. Let me know how it goes. All right. We'll send you kill pics in the morning. All right. That sounds good. Talk to you later. Bye. Bye.

Let's call Wyatt. Okay. See if he'll answer. Yeah. Yeah. She's C-L-L.

I know he's been hunting deer.

Hey. Hey, what are you doing? You there? Yeah. Hey, this is the late edition. The late edition of the podcast. The late edition of the podcast? Usually I'm in bed by now. I'm just driving past the office now. Oh, you are? Yeah. Give us a quick update. Like, dude, how's things looking? Yeah, I think things are good. I just finished guiding a pond scound hunter. Guy had to come back for the last week of the hunt. Killed a great buck. That's what's amazing. When they come back for a couple of days archery, you're just thinking, I don't know. Are we throwing good money after bad? Like, are we really going to make it happen? The velvet stripped and everything. And then you guys slam a great buck. Yeah, it was kind of a battle of himself, too. If it was worth coming back for three days or staying at work, he decided to come back. Jeez. It's awesome. Well, that's awesome.

So, what's the forecast for some of the, you know, what's your opinion on Utah bucks and bulls quality? I think it's a great year, or definitely a lot better than last year. So, I mean, I wouldn't say phenomenal best year ever, but it's a good year. It's a really good year deer-wise and excellent year elk-wise, wouldn't you say? Yeah, I think Saturday here in Utah, you're going to see a lot of big bulls hit the ground. Yeah, pretty exciting. It's a fun time to be alive, you know? Yeah, most most definitely. Unless you're Jason and doesn't believe in elk hunting in September. That's going to change, Wyatt. I'm done with that. This is it. This is it. From here on out, it's September's for elk. Yeah. I'm done. Screwing around. I like it. All right. So, you're going to hunt elk a little bit and then maybe finish up the month hunting deer? Yeah.

So, I'm, yeah, that's basically kind of my schedule right there. Headed over to San Juan for some elk hunts and then maybe hang out with you for a minute, chase deer. That'd be awesome. Yep. We'll take you. We'll take you. See what we can turn up there. Yeah. And then you've got some whitetail hunts and other stuff going. Yeah. So, we've got a whitetail hunt coming up end of next month, 1st of November. Uh-huh. I'm not exactly sure when it's going to fall into place. Yeah. And still chasing the turnbacks in Colorado a little bit and watching Nevada as well. So, you never know what could happen. Yeah. And I think you're, you potentially, looks like you're going into Mexico elk. Yes. That could definitely be a possibility. Yeah. So, find that out pretty, pretty quick. Pretty awesome. Pretty awesome. So, I might have a few good stories for you. Yeah. That's good. Good stuff.

You're done with all the concerts? I'm done with concerts. Got my last one out of the way. It was the last weekend. So, you're hero to the wife. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Got husband of the year. And it was a great concert, too. I actually enjoyed that one and had a good time. Did you? No kidding. Yeah. Wyatt's one of the few guys I know that, like, he can go to a concert and he can tell you 10 people that he saw that he knows there. Like, he's watching. He's a people watcher of epic proportions. I do enjoy some people watching. Just paying attention. So, how many, did you see a few friends there? There was a handful there, yeah. That's guaranteed. Did you say hi to any of them? I did, yeah. No kidding. All right. All right. Friends there, so. All right. All right. How's Carly doing? She good? Yeah. Everything's good there, so. Good. Well, if she's good, you're good, so. Yeah, exactly.

And then if you're good, we're good. So, if Carly's good, we're good. So, all right. All right, guy. Well, thanks for answering. We're, I'm, I'm going to bed, so. Yeah, I don't blame you. It is almost 9.30 tonight. Hey, you go to bed early, too. Well, I'm on my way there. I can't get home fast enough. Be careful. You're going to get a speeding ticket down this 40. I might. All right. All right, guy. Okay. Okay. All right, guys. All right, bye. All right, John. I don't have anything more. Do you have anything more? No, just fun to get a little update from everybody. Maybe let's throw out a, you know, shout out to a couple of our sponsors that support us and help us bring these podcasts to you guys. Right on. Red Rock Precision is one that we really, really appreciate. They've been a sponsor and a supporter since the beginning. And so they make an awesome custom gun.

And check them out, redrockprecision.com. You can give them a call and they'll talk to you on the phone, go over things. You might also want to check out our YouTube channel. We have one video with them that has millions of plays. Well, they're good people. You know what I like about good people? That they're good people. That they're good people. I'm telling you, in this day and age, I like supporting good people.

Just going to say that. I think we should support good people. So anyway, another shout out to Phone Scope, P-H-O-N-E-S-K-O-P-E. Great products. Incredible. I have it in my pack right now. Never leaves my pack. And video pretty much anything that's important. And they're awesome. Good people at Phone Scope. Great products. Very affordable. One product I like to mention, this year they've got an adapter for GoPro cameras. So you can put a GoPro right on your spotting scope or whatnot. No kidding. And the new GoPros are taking awesome footage. Wow. And Devin and... Josh have one right now? Josh have one right now. Devin had one. We're going to talk about Devin's hunt that he just killed that dropper buck on. Yeah. But he's got a GoPro on and it's pretty awesome. Like, you can see him breathing and... Does he lose his crap? He does.

But it's funny because he's like, I didn't realize, you know... That I lost my crap. That I was just, I was breathing like that, you know, and stuff. And I'm like, I'm glad I'm not the only one, you know. Proof. Proof that he gets excited. So pretty cool. Well, that's awesome. Yeah. Good products there at Phone Scope. Give them a holler. You can obviously go to their website, www.phonescope.com. Or you can find them on social medias. Be Instagram, Facebook, so whatnot. So at Phone Scope. P-H-O-N-E-S-K-O-P-E. Okay. And, yeah, I'd just like to give another shout out for our membership. If you don't know what we do, then we've got a membership. 150 bucks a year. You get nine magazines. We cover Western big game hunting. If you're not hunting out of state, then, you know, you can't draw enough tags in one state, in your home state, you know, to go hunting every year typically on good hunts.

So you need to be applying in multiple states and we help you do that. And, you know, you can call and talk to one of our consultants anytime about which states you should be doing. I have guys hitting me like, hey, I want to go on one good hunt next year. Look at my points and tell me what you do. All right. Wyoming elk. These are your options, in my opinion. These are your best options for the quality. And it's just nice to have somebody to bounce ideas off of. So, anyway, yep. Like John said, we're $150 a year. Well worth it. Give us a holler, 435-268-0777. Or you can check us out at epicoutdoors.com. If you go to epicoutdoors.com, we also have a place you can download some 40% off coupons for Under Armour. Anything on their website. It doesn't have to be hunting related. You get 40% off. I think they're $2,000 cards. You can get multiples. Yeah, amazing. Amazing deal on that.

Great for Christmas gifts. I mean, we give those out to our friends. Of course, anybody can go to the website and get them. So, it's well worth it. It's awesome. Kids, soccer cleats, whatever you need. But, you know, obviously the hunting stuff's loaded. And we've been ordering heavy on all the hunting gear. The Isolichill shirts are incredible. I've been in lots of 100-plus degree weather in weird, crazy places. And I'd be dead without it. So, anyway, great products. I think their hot weather gear has come leaps and bounds in the last couple years. So, yeah, if you're hunting hot. They got the Raider Lite pants that are porous. Amazing. Yep. And on top with the Isolichill shirt, it's pretty awesome. So, anyway, check them out, UA.com. Good luck out there. Yeah. Well, you too, dude. What do you got going? Anything coming up? Nothing for a little bit.

You're going to be moving into a house. Yeah, I'm trying to get a house done. And it's about the most frustrating thing ever, building a house. A year and something later, did you end up closing? I ended up closing. But, man, it's like one thing goes wrong after another. Yeah. It makes you mad at the government. Even the local governments. Yeah. I mean, dealing with building permits and the simplest stuff in the world, it's like you never want to do it again your whole life. So true. But, anyway. Sorry you're going through that. Yep. I can tell you, you're not missing anything in the places I've been. In the places you've been. Yeah. Yeah. All right, guy. All right. Talk to you later, everybody. Thanks for listening. At Epic Outdoors, we help you reach your hunting dreams. Whether it's helping you to develop a long-term application strategy

or finding the perfect outfitter for your next hunt. As a member of Epic Outdoors, you'll also receive the Epic Outdoors magazine and have access to the best hunting consultants in the industry, online tools, and more. To join Epic Outdoors, visit epicoutdoors.com or call 435-263-0777. Thanks for listening.