EP 372: Colorado Kill Stories and a Hit and Run

You're listening to the Epic Outdoors Podcast, brought to you by Fierce Firearms. Epic Outdoors choice for custom hunting rifles.

Hey everybody, Jason Carter, Adam Bronson, John Peterson. Of course, we got Cash and Logan. How's everybody today? Doing good. All right. All right. John, how are you doing? I'm doing great. I kind of had a tough week or two. Yeah, you know, touch and go here and there. It just feels like John's been a little off. Just been a little off. Maybe magazine, maybe Adam and I stress him out just a little bit. I don't know, Bronson. I feel like we do the best we can. John, you got to have some patience. I do the best I can with what I have. I don't know if there's anybody with more patience than I have. I was pretty confident, but you know what? I second that. Third it? Fourth it? Well, anyway, as we start this podcast off, we ought to say thanks to Fierce, the sponsor of the podcast.

They do about everything. Title sponsor here at Epic Outdoors. Appreciate them and all they do. Selling their rifles like crazy. I do have a Fierce story. We had a client come in. Anyway, he wanted a rifle setup, put the scope on it, and we threw a Z5I on it. Swarrow. Devin and I took it out, shot it in, matched his rangefinder, everything. Comes in, does the paperwork. He takes out. We hand him his rifle, bullets, and rangefinder. The bullets were his. He brought them in. Said, hey, match them to this if you can. Sure enough, shoots great with them. All was well. We shot that thing. No joke. It was amazing. Shot it 1,000. Showed him the group. It was amazing. He took it out. We're shooting rocks at 1,400. 18-inch rocks, he said. What? He could hardly even talk in the parking lot today. He was so excited. And he smashed a cow elk at 1,100. You're kidding me. And he told us. He walked out.

He goes, I'm hunting cow elk in the morning. And I'm like, well, I mean. You might want to shoot it first. I would personally go shoot it, but he didn't. And, well, he did at the Rocks, you know, or whatever. Yeah. Anyway, buddy comes in. It's like, all right, here's my credit card. No joke. Make it happen. Make it work. Anyway, kind of fun. Just something else for us to do here at Epic Outdoors. We have a good time with that. We love making stuff shoot awesome. And it's pretty easy with Fierce Firearms. And so, anyway, anybody that wants one, of course, we sell them. We're a dealer. You get a better deal here than anywhere I know. Go on to FierceArms.com. Check them out. Tell us what you want. We'll get it coming. They're pretty awesome to work with. Well, we have them in stock. A lot of them in stock here. Picked out a stock gun today. Yeah. Need a gun for Christmas? Do it.

Want to buy your own Christmas present? Give us a call. I mean, who doesn't? Just like this guy. Tell me a guy that doesn't buy his own Christmas presents. Well, maybe Logan. Logan. Logan. Does mom still buy your Christmas? Santa still comes to his house. My mama buys my Christmas, too. Jana, mama. You got to take advantage for as long as you can. Yeah. But. I did last night. Married dudes. You did? What do you mean? You bought me a new QU-Axis hybrid coat. Yeah. Oh. There you go. Ho, ho, ho. Who's it? Ho, ho, ho. I mean, I don't know a guy out there that doesn't buy his own Christmas. Hey, Merry Christmas to all the old fellers out there. You know you're going to be happy. Yeah. You know you're going to be satisfied. She's going to be the right size. She's going to be the right size. She knows it. You know it.

I love it when you get to that spot in marriage where you're just like, you get it. And she's like, I get it. Yeah. You know. 29 years this week for me. What? Wow. That's awesome. I think you already hit 29 a couple months ago. Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. 30 next year for both of us. Been the smoothest sailing 29 ever. Doesn't get better than the 29 we've had. Absolutely not. So I'm on the record. I am on the record. I'll admit, I also bought my own Christmas present. Yeah. What? What'd you get? I got the QU 6500 roller bag. And it is awesome. Oh, they're no. I was looking at that literally the other day. So they're basically a giant waterproof duffel, which you need. Yeah. Right? Airline travel, whatever. Well, they're beefy for airlines. Yeah. And on an Alaska drizzle, you can throw it out on the tarmac, whatever. It's just fine. I had another one that lasted probably 15 years.

And it was, the wheels were broken. The zippers were broken. It had been used. It was time. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Geez, John. Heck yeah. Did you use an Epic credit card for that? I did not. I didn't either. That's awesome. We can throw it on your hunt budget, whatever. I think I had to use mine and tell Becky, now this is what you got me for Christmas. And she's like, thank you. Yeah. You're welcome. Thanks for doing that. That's a great Christmas to me. Thank you. It's true. Not to mention a trip or whatever else we're doing on. Well, you've got a lot going on. That was like six months ago. You can take her out there and smash a lizard. American alligator. American alligator. Did that work, sir? She can't wait. Yeah. Reptile. Merry Christmas, Becky. What you always wanted. A set of alligator jaws in the front room. So isn't there some stories about finding dog collars? Yeah.

Devin was saying that. He might come in here in a minute. He had a long-winded call. But he did some reading, whether it was proof or whether it was AI, something he was reading. But he had dog collars and stuff from Civil War. The 1970s on one. And then. A cat. Or ate a cat or a dog. I can't remember. And then something from. Yeah. They said. Oh, yeah. They said. We haven't had that dog. There was a name on it. You know. Some numbers. Ring them up. We haven't had that dog since 1971. Or whatever it was. Yeah. Geez. He's inside the gator like some metal collar. Then they found a bunch of lead balls, right? From the Civil War or something. Supposedly. I mean. It's hard to even repeat it. They could eat that out of the mud and the dirt. I don't know how that got in. Wow. But leave it to Devin. Right? Talking about rockfish freaking sturgeon on the snake or any of the old stuff.

Lizards out there in Florida. So any animal that looks into your soul, Devin knows all about it. Yeah. Owls probably do live a while. Probably. Yeah. So with alligator, I'm unfamiliar. What do you do? Like, what do you take home? I don't know. You don't know? Do you take a skin? Probably. Do you take a head? A skull for sure. Do you get the beetles to clean it out? I don't know. I'll find out. You're going to eat it. I'll tell you. I'll tell you when we get done. I've not done this before. I know there's guys in Florida that are like, you don't know this? But no. Oh, yeah. Of course. Well, I live in Utah. Yeah. We have horny toads and snakes. The biggest alligator we have out here is a lizard. The biggest thing we have is about a six-inch lizard. Hey, I just remember when I was a kid, fireflies just caught my attention. Like, what? They're no joke. Fireflies are no joke.

Eight before I saw them. Yeah. Like, what? You're lighting up your bosom or whatever. I don't get it. I don't know.

Yeah. Us Westerners don't get a few things like that. Yeah. I don't even get it. I was like blown away. Oh, we don't have hurricanes. Yeah. Exactly. But anyway, there was 100-mile-an-hour wind across Wyoming a couple days ago. It's no joke. Blowing over semis. What's that little newsletter you have, Jason? Wyoming State Daily? Cowboy State Daily. Yeah. I like those. Yeah.

The Venusian, that little newsletter or whatever. We get a lot of weird subscriptions around the West. Even people that haven't poached yet, they've got articles on. I mean, it feels like you know everything. It's wild. All right. Let's move on, Bronson. What are we going to talk about? We've been cranking out a magazine for Arizona. We're almost done, guys. John? Yeah. I say almost. Lights at the end of the tunnel. We came in with a breath of fresh air this morning. Although the energy's drained out of us by now, it's three-something in the afternoon. Yeah. Not a good time to do this. On Friday. We're doing our best. You know? Had a Christmas party this week. That kept us up a little late. That set us back on Thursday morning. Yeah. Not going to lie. Logan? I have nothing to say about the Christmas party. I'll bet we could say a lot. I got nothing. Logan still. Nothing happened.

Let's say game night. Logan? Logan was not on his A game. No. I was on my F game. In sports, there's MVP awards. In this game, there was definitely an LVP award. I got MVP for the opposite team. Yeah. That's one of the things. If we had to play the next night, Logan would be riding the pine. He'd be caught. Yeah. I wouldn't even show up. You'd be guarding the cheesecake. What's that game called? I think that's what it's called. The Wolves of Miller Hollow. Yeah. I think so. And let's just say Logan called out Wyatt as hard as you can call someone out. And he was wrong. And he was wrong. I would have put house money on Wyatt being guilty. That was wrong. That was the beginning of the end. It was a great game, but then you just come back and you just keep ruining it. You just kept after it. You had to try to redeem yourself for the next three rounds. I tried to be quiet.

Then they put it on. Tried to be quiet. Have you ever. Okay. How does that look? I'll start right now.

Anyway. No, it's good. Pretty fun. Pretty fun. But anyway. Yeah. By the time you hear this next, we'll have an EMAG live probably, right? John. By the time. Yeah. Next podcast. Yeah. Probably next week. Got. Yeah. Wyoming moose, sheep, goat, bison, elk, and Arizona elk and antelope. It's ready to kick off here first of January. That's right. Right after Christmas. Second of January probably. We cranked it out. Next week's going to be a nice week. Right. Do some things. Work the business. Normal business hours, not four to four. Four to four. Four a.m. To four a.m. Or whatever it is. John, how you feeling? Are you feeling better? I left at one and you got here at three. Whatever it is. It just is what it is. Right. But we're happy. Bushy-tailed, wide-eyed, and drooling. All right. So where are we at, guys? Let's talk something. Let's talk some hunting.

So we've got the who here applied for Idaho? I haven't yet. You are going to. I might. You are going to. Come on. You are going to. Logan, you are. I'm not. I'm doing Alaska this year. Really? Yeah. With who? My dad. Okay. Meaning not applying for Alaska because that deadline is well upon us. You're going to go to Alaska. He's applying. I'm going to. You're applying? For bear. Yeah. Oh, I didn't know that. Awesome. I've been waiting for the right time to ask Wyatt his advice. And he was busy and now he's gone. So. I can give you my input. All right. I don't know. I'll talk with you off there. I'll take anybody that knows. You bet. Adam's been to Alaska. I'll send you to QU Island if you want. Go on. A little canoe.

Logan in a canoe. Yeah. Logan. You could also film, you know, movie Deadliest Catch. I could do some outdoor voice stuff up there. You're doing black bear? Yeah. I think so. Awesome. Are you going to fish too? Are you going to do a fishing trip? Yeah. That's the main thing. But if I get a bear tag, the fishing might be a little light. Are you going to bring in the bear jerky or what? Because you've got to eat them. Yeah. I don't. Just like Adam, I'll let you know when I get there. Okay. All right. Well, cool. What else we got, Bronson? Well, we haven't talked about as far as the last part of the hunts. We did a little hunting. John, I don't know if we talked about your Colorado stuff. We talked about your Nevada last time. Cash, you've been to Colorado. I went to Colorado. So, maybe we can finish that up. But anyway, yeah. Cash, maybe you start off. You had a. Okay.

You picked up an elk tag off the. I did. Whatever. Reissue list. I did. Jeez. Second year in a row. Yeah. Same season. Different unit.

SSDU. SSDU. Yeah. We have all these little acronyms going on.

Yeah. Went out there.

But, yeah. Went out. Grabbed a tag. I have a certain strategy I use to grab that tag. And it seems to work the last couple of years that I'm not going to divulge. On a hot mic. Really? I have a strategy. Wow. There's some theory to it. I can't remember. You're not sharing these strategies with us. Or, anyway. Not on a hot mic. You got a first season rifle tag. First rifle. Went back out there. Spent a few days. It was a muddy, stinking mess. Oh, that was mid-October. And it was torrential in southern Utah, western Colorado. It was unbelievable. Yeah. It was western Colorado. And so, we got out there in the mud. I still have mud on my truck. Yeah. Yeah. I do. You saw it? It formed cement up under my wheel wells. You know, the clay and all the other aggregates. I took it in the dealership for the 14th time. No. Just a regular mechanic at this point. But, yeah. No.

And they don't like them coming in. They don't. What do you do? What do you do? It's part of the truck. You go spend an hour and a half with a pressure washer. It's like, no. But, anyway. Yeah. Anyway, got out there in the mud. And, gosh, we were there, what, three days early, I think, to scout. It's only a five-day season. And so, I got out there with my brother-in-law. Luckily, he had a camp trailer that we took in there. And I was just going to take a tent. And that would not have been very fun. Because we spent, like, two and a half, basically two and a half full days in the trailer just socked in with fog. Yeah. Fog and rain and this and that and whatever. And scouted. Gosh, found a lot of elk.

First, let's see, night before the opener, I actually found a bull that I liked. And along with a couple other bulls that were in there that were just kind of cool, whatever, not going to kill them. But this one bull kind of caught my eye. Had big swords, kind of wide, bigger frame. Were they with cows still? No. No. Kind of breaking up? The bigger bulls were not with the cows. They were, I mean, a half mile away, like, starting to get in pockets, you know. But all the younger bulls were still ripping off, like, pushing cows as much as they could and everything. But those bigger bulls, they were definitely off from. Like, maybe far enough that if they really caught away from water to go in, they could. Yeah. So, but anyway, went in, found this bull, and left him on a ridge, like, unbothered, no one else around. Not even, like, couldn't even see anybody anywhere.

And left him on a ridge till dark. And figured first thing in the morning we'd walk down this trail, get above him. And he'd be standing there, we'd smash him, and be done. And get in there the next morning. And then my father-in-law and Logan actually drove out and got there at, like, 10 o'clock at night. This is, like, no joke hiking in. Yeah. Like, this is, like, no joke. I think you were texting me or something. You're like, dude. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, it was, when we left him on the ridge, I was like, gosh, I kind of hope he comes up a little bit. Because if we have to pack him out of there, it's going to suck. Yeah. And we can get to that part in a second. Logan, did you embrace the suck? I had to. The suck was forced upon me. I didn't give him an option. Well, Logan got there at 10 o'clock. 10 o'clock at night. He did? Oh, yeah. He got there at 10 o'clock at night.

Hadn't even got his orders yet. He didn't know what he was even getting into until the next morning. You hadn't heard from him or talked to him? I had FaceTimed Cash a couple of times. Yeah. And talked to him. Why would two dudes FaceTime? Why would you guys do that? Well, I FaceTimed him when I was looking at the boat. Oh, okay. I was like, hey, look at this boat. I'm used to you. As they're driving out. Oh, okay. You were like. You just flipped your phone around, threw it on your thing. Yeah. It's kind of cool. I got a glimpse of the landscape, but it did not do it justice. No, it didn't. No. You're not even close. Heck no. It never does on video. No, never. No. Never. Ever. So, anyway, I FaceTimed him, showing him, like, what do you think this boy is? He's like, ah, sweet. Heck yeah. I was like, we're going to kill him in the morning. Let's smash him. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So, they get there at like 10 o'clock. We get up the next morning early. We're going to get up there plenty early, sit in the dark, and be above him on a trail. And we get over there, and I don't know, somehow, there's like the trail that's marked on Onyx, and then like the hiking trail that you push, you know. We get down there a ways, and I'm like, this seems way too high. I was like, I could see the trail before. It seems way too high. So, I look at my map, and all of a sudden, my point jumps, and we're like, I don't know, 200 feet above the trail. I'm like, okay, we just got to crunch down through here. So, we get down to the actual trail, and it was one little pocket. There's like a dry pond, and the trail went through it, and the other trail that we should have been on, like dives off in the thick oak, and then side cuts. And so, missed it, whatever, didn't matter.

It starts to get light, and I start just picking out elk and whatever, trying to pick him apart, and can't find him anywhere. I'm like, what the crap is going on? Like, there's a couple little pockets. Like, he could be over that roll. Like, we'll wait. Not push anything yet. And after a couple hours into daylight, I'm like, we can't find him. Like, there's these pockets of bulls. They're not going anywhere. They're on this ridge. There was one bull in there that I liked. You could see other bulls from the night before. Well, a couple. Could you recognize them, or you know you're in the same bulls? Yeah, a couple were new, but most all of them were all the same bulls. Yeah. And, like, with the same bunch of cows, everything. Like, everything was pretty well where we left it. But he was not, like, could not dig him up. So, I'm like, okay. Oh, geez. And you're in there.

Yeah, we're, like, right in there. Like, we're right above. And from where he was, we can see two more drainages over. If he would have just took off either way, we would have seen other than if he went down into the thick ponderosas, which we thought were a lot further the way than they were. And so, I start thinking, like, gosh, he's got to be in those pondos. And it turns private in there. And so, I knew, like, if he's in there, like, there's no play at all. And we watched some elk from the night before actually go all the way through that big giant patch and end up on the other side, like, deep into private. But it's like, gosh, hopefully he's not doing that because there's water in there. There's feed. Like, there's everything he needs. And there's one section of water there where we had him.

I was like, okay, he's either going to be by the water in one of those two drainages or he's going to be in the private. So, I look. Even with the fog and the wet. Yeah. And it was, yeah, at this point it had been dry for a day and a half. Like, that whole, that day before was all dry, sunny, whatever. So, everything was kind of drying up. But, anyway, so I decide, hey, I'm going to jump across this other ridge and look over this fold that we can't see, which would be, if he didn't move more than 100 yards, he would be standing right there. And so, as I started out, there's actually, there is some elk we couldn't see right there. And as I'm going, thinking, like, dude, he's going to be right here. So, I'm kind of ready to go. And it was just, like, five cows and a little rag. Like, oh, my gosh. Like, it's not him, whatever. So, I keep going.

And we had kind of kept track of this bunch of bulls in the very, very bottom down towards the water. Just watching them. There was one bull in there with, like, a double beam. Like, pretty cool looking little bull. A little bit small. Like, just needs, like, three years. And he could be really cool. But got over to the point and couldn't dig him up anywhere. Looked below me. There was some elk in the thick oak. Could only pick out a couple cows in there.

Eventually, they got up and moved out and saw everything in there wasn't in there. And then, so I sent my father-in-law over the big ridge that was behind me and up in the top of the canyon. Like, if this bull happened to gain, like, 1,000 feet. And, like, just took off somewhere or whatever. I was like, well, check up in there and whatever. He actually found a dead bull that was on, like, a wallow in there. Like, small six-point. He's like, this isn't it, is it? I was like, no. He's a five, but, like, five-inch fifths, you know. Like a fresh dead bull? No. It sounded like it was fresh when he found it. But it was from, like, the rut. Oh, got gourd or something, probably. Yeah, wounded or gourd or something. But nasty-looking thing, whatever. And these bulls that we'd kept an eye on just kept popping in and out of this thick oak.

And this one bull in particular, I liked him, but I wanted to find this other bull. He had just a bigger frame. But this bull kind of checked the boxes as far as, like, the look I wanted. Because I'd killed, like, bulls with smaller backends or whatever. He had a better, prettier back end, which I liked. And the longer I sat there and looked at him and looked at him, the more I was like, I might ought to shoot him. Like, I don't know. And you're in there. Yeah, and then I got thinking. That's what I like about cash. I'm in here. My gun's in here. He's a straight killer. My gun's in here. And I got Logan and a father. Something's dire. I got backwards. If we have to do something with this raghorn, we will. Yeah. But for now. It's illegable. It's illegable. Yeah, he's perfectly legal. No, so I start looking at where he's at.

And I'm like, okay, if he gets down there any further, it's really going to suck. I was like, it's already going to suck where he is. And then I got looking. I was like, he's pretty well as low as he can get elevation wise. It's like, if I'm going to kill him, it's going to be right there. And so he keeps popping in and out. You're by yourself. Logan's not there to talk you into this or your brother-in-law. No one's in there. My brother-in-law and Logan are up on this ridge. My father-in-law is up on the other ridge. I'm in the middle watching this bull. Logan can see how this is going to go down. Nobody's there to talk you out of it. I remember. Straight up donkey right there. I remember. Yes. Yes. I remember Rory saying to me distinctly, if he walks over there, he's killing a bull. And I said, yeah, probably. And you know him well by now. Like, you and Cash have hunted a lot together.

Yeah. How many elk have you packed out with Cash in the last 13 months? Like three? Three? Three, four? Yeah. That's three out of the four bulls I killed. I was going to say. When Cash goes to go places, stuff dies. Granted, the one in New Mexico was pretty dang easy. We had to pack it like 100 yards. Maybe, yeah. Maybe 100 yards. This one make up for it. Oh, man. Did it? This hunt turned me into a praying man.

So, no, anyway, I get down there and I'm watching him. I'm trying to pick out this bull. And I'm like, okay, I'll give it. It's like, what is it, like 1030 or so? I'm like, I'll give it till noon. And like noon or one, like when stuff kind of moves. Nobody's. Or whatever. Nobody's called me by then. Yeah. And so, I'm like, if he doesn't, if I don't catch him out moving, whatever, by then. And this was the other part of it, I guess I should add. And my brother-in-law married my sister when I was in like high school, whatever. I've never had anyone on my side of the family on a hunt with me. It's always been either my wife's side or like just friends or whatever. So, to me, I was like, I would love to kill a bull. Because, and his name is Braden. He had to leave that night. He had one day. He had one day. But he scouted with me the whole time.

And so, I was like, I would really love to kill a bull with him here. Like, that would be pretty awesome. Plus, there's one more packer. Yeah. Plus, there's one more packer. If we're packing out of there, I want another packer. And so, I kind of like sat there and debated it and debated it. And I was like, he's a bull. Like, I'd be happy with him. Like, if I got to the fourth day, would I kill this bull or be regretting that I didn't kill him? Granted on what we found, whatever. I was like, if we got to the last day, I'd probably be mad I didn't shoot this bull. So, like, I better just kill him. And it's kind of cool that Braden's here. And so, decided, I gave it until, like, 1230 or something. And I call him, like, hey, if you guys want to come down here, we might put a move on this bull. And if we can get close right there, then we'll kill him. And they're like, okay.

The minute I hang up this bull, right where I was thinking about going, this little five-point comes up over and beds right there. I'm like, great. Right at the killing knob you were going to go shoot from. Right where I was going to go shoot from. So, I'm like, free. I'm like, now what are you? Just shoot the five-point and call it a day. Yeah, call it a day. It would have been a little easier. And so, I get those guys. They're on their way. And by the time they get there, this bull's, like, 300 yards looking right at us. And when they walk, he just dips over the backside. I'm like, okay, we're fine. And so, I take Braden with me. And we go down there. And it doesn't roll off as hard as I thought to the bottom that he's in. But it kind of tapers more. So, I get over there. I'm like, crap. I was like, it's either going to be 700-yard shot or, like, 150.

And so, I'm like, if we blow him out, like, it's not the end of the world. Like, he's not the biggest bull in the world. Yeah. A 350 bull. Yeah. I love it. I love it. I mean, very calculated. Let's flush him and we'll gut him. Yeah. Exactly. And so, we get down there and I'm like, okay, we're just going to creep up to this next section where it actually falls off and we'll be right above him. Like, if he steps up on that right above where he's at, it'll be, like, 250 yards. And so, we get down there and, sure enough, they end up getting up. And I don't know if they knew we were there, if the wind swirled or what. They got up and there's a spike with him. And then the other bulls are in the thick still. And Braden's like, there he is, stepping up right there. I was like, okay, that's the spike. Then my bull steps out of the tree and I'm just, like, laid across his spotter.

So, I had him bring his spotter. I just lay across his spotter and Logan can attest to this part. How far was he? Did you film this? Yeah. It's all on video. Yeah. Nice. Yeah. It's all on video. We sent Braden with the camera. Yeah. Braden took the camera from there and then you guys were spotting from that other point. And so, got down there and Logan said after, he's like, I've never seen someone shoot as fast as you shot. How many rounds? It was three. Yeah. I hit him three times. And, I mean, he just piled. They're no joke, man. I just shoot until they're dead. Like, until they fall, I'm shooting. That bolt must have been red hot by the time he was done with it. How fast he was working that thing, I couldn't believe it. I can show you the video. You showed Logan how, man. Oh, yeah. How a real man does it. Like, I pumped him. And Logan's like, I think he missed the first shot.

And I go over there and I was like, one, two, three. There we go. Hit him all three times. So, anyway, he piles into an oak and whatever. And I look back at where those guys are. And, you know, like, usually you look back on an obit's like this. I was, like, looking clear up. I was like, that's going to suck. Were they giving you a fist bump or were they turned away like a – I don't know. I couldn't see them very good. Because the only way is back up. Going down at the bottom is not an option probably. No. It's all blocked by private. Like, there is a road that's there, but it's on the private. So, like, oh, my gosh. And even to get on that road, you would have had to drive an hour all the way out and around and then back in. Oh, it would have been at least an hour. And that bull is at the bottom. Yeah, he's at the very bottom. I'm good with driving an hour.

I would have been too. Yeah, I would have been too if there was access. But there was no access. Wow. So, we looked at – we got him down there and cut him up and everything. We looked at the pack that was ahead of us. It was, well, like 2 o'clock or something by the time we got him cut up. Just get going, huh? And, yeah, it was – Spur the ponies. Yeah, it was the most brutal pack of our life. Jeez. And I – Like, hands down. We climbed, what was it, Logan, like 1,800 feet of elevation or something. I wonder if it tells me. I didn't track it, but I put a line down after because – The best part. I ended up getting lost. Logan got lost. I did an extra mile with a hind quarter and the back straps on it. Was it dark? It was so funny. No, I'll explain it. It was pretty funny. It was 92 down to 7.5 back up to 92. Yeah. So it was – Yeah, you're – 1,700. 1,700. Yeah. Yeah, like 1,700 feet.

So – and that was in, like, if you do a line distance from where we were to where the – Road was. Yeah, where the side-by-side was, it was, like, the route you'd have to take. I want to say, like, after that I looked and it was, like, almost three miles. But it was, like – it wasn't, like, a gradual climb through miles. It was, like, big bench, kind of up, big bench. You have these big, steep climbs. So it sucked. Yeah. But got out of there and – One trip. One trip. What did Logan carry his fair share? I did finish it for him because I felt bad. Dude. Did you? I did. It's bad. It was, like, the last, like, 600 yards. Like, I – Well, yeah, of course. We got the pack wheel. We had the pack wheel. How'd that go? That thing – Was it awesome? Oh, dude, they're so legit. Really? Oh, my gosh. You had the company pack wheel? Oh, yeah. I didn't know that. It was so awesome for the 600 yards.

Where is that right now? Yeah, you can't use it. I think it's – Wyatt has it. Wyatt stole it last. Oh. It might be back in the storage unit, but Wyatt has it. Yeah. He used it in Nevada, remember? Yeah. Or the buddy. I'm not kidding. Yeah. He used it? Oh, yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah. I'm not kidding. The last 600 yards, it saved us. Because the last 600 yards was all, like, pretty steep all the way there. And my father-in-law got to there, and he's like, I don't know if I'll be able to come back. He's like, but if I can do it, I'll bring the pack. I was like, all right, sounds good. So he gets back, and we're like, oh, okay. So we get some off of us. You can do this. Whatever on there. You can do this. He'd forgotten the saddlebags. Oh. So we just had the top shelf, but we had ratchet straps. So we took it and ratchet strapped, like, my pack and another pack on top of it.

And it actually worked pretty good, really. And so, yeah, we got it out of there. But that thing was, they're beasts. Like, you can go on rocks, logs, it'll climb, anything. That's awesome. It's legit. So if I could afford one, I'd buy one right now. But, yeah, it was sweet. That sounds good. That's great. Did you get it? Logan, my father-in-law, there was a 24-hour trip for them. Jeez. Yeah. Honestly, less than that. We got home way before 10 o'clock. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, you did. Can them all run. Yeah. It was awesome. They didn't even know what that was, Chase. It's a movie when we were kids. Yeah.

It's awesome. Good for you guys. It was fun. It was super awesome. Good to have my brother-in-law there. Two for two while you're building points in Colorado. Getting tags, I get your job. Didn't burn a point, so it was good. Wow. I would never build that many points in Colorado. Otherwise, that takes a draw. 20-something points. Well, your point is you would never hold out for that. No, I wouldn't. Hold out at all. No. It was a pretty unique opportunity, really, to go and hunt that. It was pretty awesome. That was a unit I'd been on before. So, somewhat familiar with the unit on the deer side. You hunted it second, I think. Yeah. Before. Yep. Yep. Pretty awesome. Pretty fun. All right. Let's see. John, you're not in jail. I'm not in jail. Yeah. What is that? So, yeah. I purposely withheld this story. Yeah. I haven't even heard it. We haven't even heard any of this. Me neither. Yeah.

So, I don't get hot very often. I don't know. Okay. I don't know. There was somebody, there was a time when you were face to face with a guy that was kind of on your glasses. That was a year ago. Giving your wife some grief. And I would say in the last, yeah, in the last 10 years, it's probably been twice. So, once every five years is pretty good. That's not bad. Not bad. Yeah. So, what triggered? What triggered? And I might be totally unreasonable, but this was a chain of events that got me hot. But, so in the summer, it was like the 1st of July. My son was involved in a hit and run. He was hit and the person in the car ran. In a vehicle. In a vehicle. He was in a vehicle. They were in a vehicle. He was in a vehicle. The craziest thing. The person hit him, drove away. Yeah. And it seemed so, like such a shut and closed case. He was at the drive-thru at a bank.

Like they should have cameras. Cameras everywhere. Yeah. Like there were four cameras on, you know, where he was. Yeah. And is this like a little bump or is it like pretty good? Yeah, it was good. Like it did damage. It did damage. Okay. The back, like bumpers broken. The taillights broken. Like, yeah. Yeah. It wasn't a love tap. Cut and dry. And, like, they knew and they left fast. Wow. They backed up and left. Yeah. Because if you hit them in front of you, there's only way to bank find. There's only ways to get back. So you got a driver or you got the license plate from all the cameras? Or how did you know? No. I'll get to all this. Okay. This is. All right. I love this. So. Just get me to the end. Did they have to pay? Jason. We're close. No, you got to wait. This is the story. So. Kick your feet up, Gar. Let's get it. You know what's interesting about this? So we've had some.

An issue or two here with storage units. And we get going on a little detective work. Oh, yeah. Yeah. We don't stop. Yeah. So. And like Cedar City's not very big. You know. So he calls me immediately. I get there before the police officer. Who calls you? My son. Oh, okay. My son calls me. Yeah. I got hit. He's like, yeah. Backed up and left. Backed up. Gone. And he couldn't do anything. He was, you know, in the line. In the thing. In the, you know, for the drive-through. Yeah. And so I get there before. I'm like, okay. We look for cameras. Like I said, there's four cameras on this area. Like it's. We'll figure it out. No brainer. Yeah. Easy. So I go in and talk to the bank. And the bank was like weird. They're like, well, you know. Protecting our clients. We do not, you know, just give out. You have to have a court order and a warrant. Yeah. Wow. I'm like, come on.

It would have been two seconds to go look. Because I was there within seven, eight minutes. Vehicle description. You're a client of theirs. Yeah. Vehicle description. You got damaged on their property. You might be like, hey, you're liable. I got damaged on your property. Yeah. I should sue them. If anybody knows how to. I should sue them. There's people. You let me know. My kids-in-law. This will be his first case. Yeah. This will be great. It just. Anyway. Charges it in. So because they're so slow and so difficult, I can't get. I can't do anything. I can't get the footage in. Nothing. So police officer shows up. We do the report. Everything. And he's like, okay. Yeah. I'll let you know. But yeah, we've got to go through this whole process. To get the. Yeah. Video. To get the video. Just sad. We're nearly six months later. I've called the office. They're never there.

You just have to leave a message. Bank or cops. Bank or cops. The cops. The individual. Okay. Yeah. So multiple times. Right. And I can't get a response. Nothing. So then the other day, my kid calls me and he's like, hey, I just got pulled over for turning my turn signal on for two seconds and not three seconds. Oh my. What? Get real. Talk about. No triggers. Here? Here. Here. In Cedar. All right. And I'll explain to you guys, people out there, you're just going to have to imagine, but you know where you go, you're going to the university and you go past Tag and Go. And then there's a stop sign. You turn left and then you immediately turn right. Yeah. Go up the hill. It's really quick. Oh, within. So the cop was following him. It's 50 or 75 yards. Yeah. It's really quick. Your blinker probably from turning left has not fully turned off before you got to turn it to the right. Exactly.

Right? So that's the situation. What vehicle is he in? Jason. None of that matters. Well, he's got a little sports car. No. It's at his home probably. So he's probably in one of yours. It's blue Kia. Okay. Yeah. I'm just wondering if they're profiling in Lamo. Like he's young. No, but he's young and he has a little sports car. He's young and the cop was following him. Yeah. Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So anyway.

Anyway. Okay. So we get pulled over. So it's just one of those you turn left and you immediately turn right. And he, I could hear him on the phone with the cop because the cop was still there and I'm on the phone, you know. No, give me, give me. And oh, I was like, let me talk to him. Let me talk to him. John's like a hound dog with a hot track. Ready to get the dog box open. And the cop's like, I don't know what happened at the bank. I was triggered. I know your son did not, was not driving safely. Yeah. So anyway, there's, there's not even two, three seconds in between both turns, but doesn't matter. The other thing is the cop was like, and I could hear him on the phone and he said, you know, I just, you, you, I got to tell you like, you know, people that do this, like just, I've seen a lot of accidents come from this. And I'm like, he's turning right.

The only, there's no accident from not turning on. The only thing is, is if he does turn it on and he goes straight, someone could, you know, think he's going to turn and he doesn't. Or if he, or yeah, if he doesn't turn it on and all of a sudden he stops or slows down a lot to go up to take the right, somebody could be texting and hit him in the rear end. Something. Yeah. That's their problem. But yeah. But I'm just like, so petty. Yeah. Like the pit most. I've got six months. I turn my blinker off cause I get tired of hearing it. Click. Click. When you're in a turning lane, I just turn it off. Yeah. I get tired of it. Well, they might be after you. Just so. So looking at me going, he's old. Yeah. He's old. Oh, I'm the same one. I don't like listening to it. Anyway. So I, I'm, I'm fuming cause I can't, I can't get them to return a call for six months and

they're out picking up these kinds of petty things. Do you start driving to the location at this point? Yeah. So I drive downtown. I'm not going to the location cause he's gone. I went to the police station and I was, I was hot anyway. So are you going there now with the intent to talk about this most recent or the six month episode again? Yeah. The six month thing. Yeah. But, but if this other one comes up, you might get, you know, okay. So anyway, that, that for the, the turn signal, the cop ended up just giving him a warning. All right. So I'm like, okay, well still, still I'm, I'm, I'm pissed that one warning adds up to another. Yeah. Yeah. Right. And he gets pulled over again. He's getting a ticket, even though. I've had a lot of warnings showing right in a row. He's doing 84. So same thing. I'm passing the guy. I go there. There's absolutely no one there to talk to. No one. Yeah.

Anyway. So the next, I, I, they ended up, you know, do you want to file a complaint? No, I want to talk to somebody right now, but. This was over the turn signal or over? No. Over. No, I didn't care about the turn signal anymore. It was just, just the fact that precipitated him. I can't get a call back. Just an angry citizen and I'm ready to. So, yeah. So I fill out a dang report and it, you know, a day later, a supervisor calls me and anyway, I was kind of calmed down by then. But the story is, he's like, well, there's no excuse for not getting back to you. I do admit that. Sorry. You couldn't get ahold of anyone. We're just really short staffed and blah, blah, blah. And, you know, the officer got transferred to another, another job within the, within the department, but he still had your case. And I'm like, you've got cops that are pulling people over for turn signals not long enough.

And, and you've got cases that are open for six months and you can't call someone back, you know. You kill me. Yeah. And he's like, well, you know, if we do that, then we'll get other complaints that, you know, there's not enough traffic cops out stopping people for going too fast. And I'm like, yeah, whatever. Anyway. So he says, but there are other situations. There are developments in this case. And I'm like, what do you mean developments? In the hit and run case? So he's like, well, to complicate things, it, it takes quite a while to go through the whole, like the police department can't just go request the footage. We have to go through the fifth circuit, you know, judge. He has to do a warrant, take it to the, to the bank and then get the footage. So after a couple months, we did get the footage.

We found out who it was and we, you know, found their license plate, found out who it was. They are uninsured. And I'm like, okay, that makes sense. But he's like, that's not all. What? So he, this person was involved in two incidents after yours. Oh, good. A bump hit runs. Yes. And did he get cited? And on the third one, there was a fatality and the person is no longer with us. You're crap. He's dead. Gone. Well, so the police officer was like, yeah, there's pretty much nothing else you can do. Who's dead? The guy that hit? Yes. The guy that hit your son is dead? Yes. Because whoever owned that car is dead. Good grief. So you got to. But you've been holding this information for four months. Yeah. Because you said two months later you got the one. Well, or whatever. But I mean. They said there's still. You got to sue the estate. Which I don't know. There would be a much of an estate.

If he's not paying an insurance bill, he's probably not going to. Anyway, he's like, you're in a club. There's some angry people.

Yeah. Involved with this person. That's about the worst luck I've heard. So now what? I'm screwed. But. How did you. How did you almost get arrested? Oh, I was just. Before I was going down to this. Oh, you were like. I wasn't really going to get arrested. But this is how I get my first mug shot. I mean, you're thinking. I can't control. John's down there. I'm going to. I'm just like. You cannot. What's interesting about people is. And then you merge cases. And you know you're not supposed to. Because hey, what's this turn signal cop. Yeah. What's he going to tell you? Yeah. But people are so irrational. You're irrational. Oh, yeah. Because you're screaming. You know you're irrational, though. Yeah. Your point is. Is I'm going to pull some skin off somebody. Yeah. I'm really frustrated. We've all been there. We've all. Jason, you've been pulled over out west by a certain individual once.

And you're still talking about it. Yep. Lost it. Made him give me a warning for no license plate light on dirt roads. That's right. I actually asked for a ticket. And he didn't. He wouldn't do it. I finally came back. And he. Here's your warning. And it was just a difference of opinion. I just felt like he's a. Just. Come on, guy. You know what I mean? He knows me. Knows. Knows me. Dirt road. You know. Emphasis. Dirt road. And just lurking around. Like. It's well after dark. Don't fish. Well after dark. Don't just lurk around. Like. Turn your lights on if you're pulling me over. Like. Turn your lights on. Yeah. Let's make it official. What do you got going? And he just wouldn't leave me alone. And it was over and over and over. Finally I said. You just keep going back to it. Just write me a ticket. You've already looked at my truck. Like. I didn't even have to let you.

You just know I have no blood on my truck. Like. I'm not doing anything bad. Yeah. He knows this. Anyway. But then I have to proceed to tell him. That's what's wrong with the DWR. I'm so frustrated. You know. You have no relationship with the public. Right. Because of things like this. Yeah. You know. I want to be a nice guy. But it's 1030 at night. You're lurking around. Yeah. And I mean. I get pulled over. I get a ticket. I've got 15 days or I go to jail. If I don't. You know. If I don't take care of it. Yeah. And what's funny is you can't figure out how to pay. You actually have to wait until it gets in their system. Right. Before you can pay it. So then it's kind of on you to pay it. Yeah. I don't know. And so it just bugs. I think jail is a little. Well. Probably a little excited. Maybe that's a little excited. But you've got consequences. Yeah. They've got no consequences.

They don't return their calls. Let's talk. Let's talk about a fun hunting story. What do we got? What do we got next? John. But to give you all the validation. I don't envy that. You went through it. Yeah. Sorry, John. Yeah. And the other takeaway is I don't think Colton will be able to help you. Catch the dead guy. Versus dead. And that's what he said. He's like, I'm sorry. I think we've come to a dead end. No, no pun intended. If the person was alive, we could do something. When you first told me, I thought you said he's had two other incidents and he actually killed somebody else. No. And I'm thinking, one was some property damage and ran on somebody's property and damaged the fence. And the next one was an accident where he died. I'm just going to go out on a limb and say this guy was either drunk all the time or on drugs. Yeah. Drunk driver for sure. 100%.

That's probably why he couldn't get insured. Probably couldn't get insured. Probably didn't even have a license. Yeah. Maybe he was just going through a rough spot and he just, you know, spying and wandering. I don't know. That's one option. I don't know. I mean, by the end of the call, I was good. Like, I just said, I just need somebody to say, yeah. Give me this story three months ago. This sucks that we didn't call you. Give me this call three months ago. Who owns the Kia? I didn't even know you owned one. Did you? Yeah. Max. Jason. You don't know the bank and model. Is it the best car you've ever owned? Yeah. Yeah. What kind of filmizes it again, John? Speaking of which, Logan, I wish I'd have sold you that little diesel Colorado a long time ago. What happened to it? Nothing. It's running good. That's great. It's mint.

But the exhaust manifold, and let's just say six out of the 12 bolts sheared off with pieces and parts left in the head. Five grand. Side unseen.

It's already fixed, and they've extracted them all perfectly. Everything's fine. Back up to $24,000. Back up to $999. $9,999. Done. Really? No. Wow. I think it's the best truck I've ever owned. It was a long trip from Oklahoma. I would say that. It was no joke. I mean, that thing whistled and groaned 85 mile an hour, and they were like, we've never seen anything like it. And I'm like, well, it was Thanksgiving weekend. It's like four Sundays in a row. You have no options. You couldn't even buy a bolt, bolt kit, manifold, anything, let alone. Anything you bought, you couldn't have got them out. You couldn't even buy it. You can't even buy it. Everybody's with their families having Thanksgiving. It's terrible. Or get parked. Yeah. It was one of those things you drive, and you just keep driving. It would be like going 50 miles up Lake Powell and ruining a propeller.

I need to do just a little bit of a disclaimer. He doesn't want to get arrested and knock at his door. Why? I'm like, maybe I don't. I mean, I don't want to make any enemies in the police department. Well, they're actually pretty good dudes. Yeah, and they are. I personally wouldn't have thrown them under a bus, but hey. I've got friends down there. I will say that the guy who called me was great. Come on, John. He was, though, and kind of explained it. And I get it. Sometimes there's processes that just something falls through the cracks. You know, King Carpenter, the sheriff, he's an awesome guy. Yeah. He's actually a legit awesome person. There's a lot. And I get it. I love that guy. And those guys do experience a lot of hard things. Yeah. You fell through the cracks with a few filing, and away. A guy got a different job and things like that. Yeah. Hey. There he is. Da-da-da-da. Devin.

I just want to know, did you have your 15-minute cool down? Hold on. He needs a mic. Mic him up. Devin comes in with us. Cut. Cut. I'm sorry. I have no idea what you guys are talking about. What was the announcement? You have an announcement. You said you had an announcement. Oh, I wanted to tell everybody. I don't know if you guys talked about this or if we did. It's in our last magazine. What is it? Okay, inside. We're going to do a giveaway. Yeah. Okay. Between now and March 1st. Yeah, let me get some. We are? Yeah, you guys don't even know about this. What do you mean? I approved it, but through John. Really? Anyways. Oh, I know what you're going to say. Yeah, you send me or any of us an outfitter report or call us and tell us, especially if we sent you with one of our outfitters. Outfitter report. And we're going to give you. Give you a tripod.

Yeah, we're going to do a drawing at the end, March 1st. Between now and March 1st, you can choose any tripod you want with a head. Or a muzzleloader. Or any muzzleloader. Or any CVA muzzleloader we haven't stopped. Acura. Yeah, Acura. Or something like that. Whatever you want. This is on page 33 and 34 in the December issue. Yeah, you can scan. Tell them what they got, a QR code. Yeah, you can scan that. Or honestly, just email me and tell me about your hunt. Details or what you want are on there. If you have photos, that's even better. Just want to hear from guys. Feedback after you got done hunting. I tell everybody, you know, call me. Tell me how it is when it's over. And for the guys who have already told me about your hunt, your name's on the list. You're in. And you don't even know it, but you're in. That's all I was here for. That's awesome. Can I do that? It's great. No.

You don't. I love how urgent it is. No. I like how every time we do a giveaway or something, Cash and Logan really want to be in. It would be pretty cool. I wish I could win some of this stuff. I would like to get in on some of this stuff. That would be pretty awesome. I mean, I like to hear about your hunts, but if it's from 10 years ago, it's kind of irrelevant now. Yeah. Within the last year or two, especially if we sent you with one of our endorsed outfitters, I really want to hear from you. Do you want to say within three years or two years? I'm saying two. Two years. Yeah. Right on. Awesome. Cool. I like giving stuff away. Devin, good work. Yeah. Do you know we had that? Yeah. I remember that. You and I talked about it. I didn't know how it actually got printed. Yeah. Adam and I are so focused on what we're doing. Anyway.

And this, by the way, this magazine got put together when we were in the hills. Kind of. Yeah. Somewhat. A big portion of it was Starlink. Before, yes. It was my Starlink, your Starlink. Adam, you were out and about. This is the Starlink version. Yeah. Starlink. Starlink edition. So, Devin, we talked about, we did talk about that Fierce that we put together and guys smashing rocks at 1,200. Smashing the cow elk at 1,100. Yeah, that was fun. Ethically. To hear a story. He was excited. I was backing out to go to lunch. It was awesome. And he ran up to the truck. He could not wait to tell something. Well, he kind of, he messed with us the first day. He's like, that rifle, man, I'm hitting like six feet high or something at 200 yards. I'm like, yeah. No. Good try. Good try. You know what I mean? And then, yeah, he did the same thing.

He said, you know that rifle, it's, we killed an elk at 1,200 yards. Is it 1,200? I thought it was 11-something. Yeah. It's almost 12-something. Yeah. Something like that. Pretty awesome. Yeah. All right, so we're in the middle. Actually, we're on to some kind of third story. I don't know. Oh. Well, yeah, I guess probably cutting deer in Colorado with Ty. I didn't have a tag. Yeah. Is that what we're going to talk about? Let's dive into it. Okay. Well, yeah, so we went over, I actually went over third and fourth season this year with Ty and then my wife on fourth. Different units, different tags, you know, time for her to burn some points and go over there and have a fun time. I mean, like Cash alluded, mid-October, southern Utah, western Colorado, it was, we had more rain. We had like three, four inches of rain in parts of southern Utah. It was nuts. It's a lot. You know?

I think Salt Lake set the monthly record by like four inches by like in 14 days in October. It wouldn't have any hit the 31st yet. It was crazy. Crazy. So by the time you get over there, you know, second, third, it actually was really nice weather and it greened up all over the place. It was green all over the desert, green in the low country, mid country, high country, and was not cold and snowy at all like you want for a third season hunt. So knew it was probably going to be tough. You know, what also that does is when it's nice camping weather or hunting, not great hunting weather, but nice camping weather, everybody's just out crushing the place, right? You got side-by-sides trucks, you know, hardcore hunters, fair weather hunters are just crushing the place, driving everywhere. And so I think we saw that.

It seemed like when it's cold and nasty, after the first weekend, you lose a certain set of people. They're just like, I'm done. You do. And I don't care if you're on a two-point bonus point unit or a 10 or 15. That just happens. There's some people that say, I'm done. This weather's bad. I'm checking out. Yeah. That wasn't the case. A lot of people. So, yeah. You know, it was kind of a, I don't want to say a grind, but just seeing plenty of deer, plenty of bucks, but just nothing great. And, you know, it's, you know, day three or four, you get a call from my son and his buddy. And, you know, I think they got, I think Jason, a little video of this buck. And I'm like, so I went over and looked at it in person. I'm like, you know, he's just, I know you haven't seen something in four or five days. And it's kind of like, you're ready to slap the trigger.

And it's not an easy year everywhere else. No, it's not easy. These kids have been hunting here in Utah. Oh, yeah. They hunted Utah hard, you know. Yeah. And at both archery, you know, with one of them. And archery, muzzleloader, and rifle. So, anyway, it's just, you're kind of antsy. And they're, you know, 20-year-olds, you know. Hadn't hunted deer in a couple years either. So, he's ready to shoot something. But, anyway, passed that deer. And then, finally, it was like day, day six, day of the hunt. I'm over there. And I glass this buck up. First light. And he had a couple of does. He's tending them. I watch him bed down on the backside of this ridge. You know, I'm looking back into the sun. Hard to see. And they're on my side of the ridge. So, they're in the shade and hard to see. And pretty soon, I, you know, side by side driving down the canyon underneath them.

And it's 200 or 300 yards underneath them. But it's thick trees and whatnot. And then they're all looking at them. But they can't even see, you know, can't see them. And I think it goes over the ridge. And I'm watching the deer. And I'm like, you know, I haven't really decided how good the deer is. He's better. He's got a big cheater out one side. That's all I really could tell. So, that caught my eye. And right then, I see a doe's head just whip around and lock on the ridge looking away from her. And then the buck's bedding. He locks on. And then he stands up. And he's doing this thing. And I'm like, something. So, I'm ripping off my scope. Putting him on my 12s. Because I realize I've got to have field of view here. Something's about ready to blow up. And sure enough, I see a dude walking on the ridge like 75 yards from him. Oh.

But he's walking up the ridge looking off the backside of the ridge. So, they're behind him. Yeah, they're behind him towards me. But close. And pretty soon, just the buck blows out first. He takes off. And the guy's just looking the other way. He can't hear him. Can't see him. Has no idea. Nothing. And I have a hard. I watch him for probably 300 yards. And he goes up a draw to the point that I can't see all the ball in the draw. He can go up and over the ridge. Or he could stay in that ridge or in that little draw and bed. Well, I stay there for three hours, of course. You know, and you're just, you know, 50 yards either direction trying to catch movement. And I can't find him. So, midday I realize, you know, he's probably snuck. He's probably went out over the top. And I missed him right where I couldn't see. So, I get him. I get the guys on the phone.

I said, hey, I had a buck over here today. But I didn't tell them about it. Because it's like nothing's, like, you know, they're not close enough to me to do anything with it. But that night, we got in there. I see the guys come out side by side that night. And they got out of there. So, I'm like, all right. We should just, I got them in there that evening. And I said, hey, get on this other knob. Maybe we'll glass him tonight. And they got there. I could see plenty of deer. Never saw him. And I said, well, now you know where you need to be in the morning. Next morning, you need to be right where you are. And I'll be right where I am. I can see everything you guys can't see. Just really choppy, big, deep canyons. You know, we're a mile and a half away. You know, and cover everything in between. So, all right. Got dark. Didn't see anything. Next morning, same thing.

So, they're going their way. I'm going mine. I have about a, oh, .65, you know, just under three-quarters of a mile hike, you know, to get to where my glass and knob was. And I get there, and I stripped everything down because it's not that cold. And, you know, when you get there, it's going to be cold for an hour, hour and a half. So, I get there. It's just starting to get, barely get light. I'm putting all my, I put all my warm clothes back on, sit down, get my tripod on, and sit there. I turn my, turn my radio on, just lay it next to my pack, and I start glassing. I'm glassing, glassing, glassing for probably three minutes. And I hear a gunshot right over where they're supposed to be. And I'd already looked with my 12s over there, or 14s, and I'm like, okay, they're on the knob. It's just, you know, I can see orange. So, I'm like, okay, they're on the knob.

And by then, I look up, and I can see them there, but they're, like, still in, shooting, almost follow-up. They're not moving and high-fiving. I'm like. It's still serious. Did it, did it, did it. Are they the ones that shot? I mean, it has to be them. And right then, the radio comes, hey, I love water. Anyway, and they said, yeah, we just smoked him. He's right below our knob. Right below, right where they left the night before, which was, even though it was kind of a, you know, the night before, didn't work out, pan out, at least got them to the glassing knob. I wanted Mom to look for them the next morning. The deer was right below them, rut and doze, and they smoked him at, like, you know, first light, essentially. It just worked out awesome. So, it was just one of those things. Proud bad moment. It was day seven. I mean, you know, for all intents and purposes. Well, isn't it? Yeah.

Kids. But, I mean, they're best friends anyway. Yeah, and it's day seven, so it's like, it's like, you've grinded it for, you know, it's only got. You hit it hard. It's Friday morning, and finally happened. Really cool buck, wide buck, just a little over 30, 30 and a half wide, and cool buck cheater. He's excited. We're all excited. We got him taken care of. It was a fun time. Fun time. Seven days on the mountain with him. It was good to do that. And then, yeah, fourth season, just to skim over that, you know, that, we didn't have any new weather. Anybody kind of knows. Everybody kind of got excited in Colorado after we started seeing all the deer. When I say all, you kind of see the highlight reel of what was coming off second season. We're like, geez. I mean, scattered bucks around the state. This is looking good. But, I mean, we see some great bucks.

And then third, just had warm, dry, warm weather. Yeah, this buck was rutting. He was. But this was seven days in, whatever that is, 14th or I don't know what that is. You know, whatever. It's pretty getting deep into November. But fourth season, had a little bit more rain, you know, but it was just warm. There's no new real big event to just shove everything down into the same, you know, elevational plane. And we fought a lot of mud. We saw a lot of rutting deer. Just didn't see anything with age that was really standout, you know. And my wife, we had a good time. We stayed in town. We ate good at night. We had a motel. Anyway, it was, you know, my boy and his buddy were over there with us. We had a good time. But just never turned up a deer on that hunt that was an old, mature deer. Which I'm shocked. I know. Well, we were too. Most of the time you are. But in Colorado.

We had a decent hunt last year. But you remember, we always say this. It's like one deer makes it an amazing hunt. Oh, one deer. One. Literally. It's not like we had that good a hunt. But it ended so good. Yeah, I've been with you in Colorado before. Like, the day I'm driving to you, you smash a 200-incher. And we have like five or six days left in the hunt. And I would have traded you. Yeah, and Jason's like, I wish you'd hear. This is going to get so good. The next five days are going to be better. And we couldn't find anything even close to that. Well, it was the first day, three hours into it. And I'm like, we're just getting started. I will take those chances. Yeah. We're going to find a 220. Yeah. And it had, at that point in history, killed a few of them. Yeah. I'm an optimistic thinker. He thinks that way.

Jason told me, if we'd have been here together, he would have let me shoot the deer. Literally, he probably would have. He'd be able to do it for 10 minutes before he decided to shoot. No, it's like 21 minutes. You know what I mean? Who does that? And then I heard rangers on top of it, the ridge on top of it. I'm like, somebody's going to shoot this right in front of me. Who does that with like a 207 buck? Who videos it for 21 minutes by himself? Yeah. Forearm mass. It's a pretty, pretty heavy. Basal. I mean, mass. Mass, you've got little kickers coming off. Yeah. It's kind of like oozing. Yes. Burning drops. But nevertheless, it was one of those kind of good years. It was just the last of the good years for that area. But most times, just like my son's hunt, most times in Colorado right now, you don't pass

a lot of almost shooter bucks or shooter bucks and say, I'm going to find that deer later. You usually kill the biggest deer. If you kill a big deer, it's the one big deer you see in a hunt. Isn't that pretty much true? Yep. Yeah. And that was the case a year before with you and Justin. I've learned a few things. Oh, and Sean. Yeah. Yeah. But, you know. Yes. Anyway, overall. That one got away. But overall, it's just, this didn't happen with us. We saw a lot of strong rutting hunts. Saw a cool country. Learned a lot of country. I learned a lot. You learn a lot in seven, eight days. Because I went over a couple days. I already had a couple days there before the hunt. So, but it was, just didn't work out. You know. And yeah, she burned in mid-teens points. Or I don't know, double digits. I can't remember exactly. A lot of points. And for everybody listening, points don't equal dead. Quality.

Don't equal something. Right. You get a chance to go hunting. They equal a chance to go hunting. In a unique situation to hunt something with low tag numbers. Like you had all these points. What would you turn that in for? Like, let's say, meaning you didn't have all those points. No, I didn't. But the tag you had required mid-twenties. Next amount of points. Mid-twenties. Wouldn't it? Well, like you would normally equate that to, I should be hunting a 330 plus bull, a 350 plus bull. Oh, yeah. I mean, if you were Utah or something like that. Oh, yeah. Or whatever. The amount of points it took over there, you would be hunting some of the better units in Utah. Yeah. Yes. Like, that's my point. Does not equate. Equates do not, or excuse me, points do not equate to giants. And they don't hold the same value they do in other states. From state to state. That's right. And they change over time.

20 points 20 years ago in Colorado, unbelievable what that would give you. 20 points now gives you an option to hunt either a four-season with low hunting pressure and take that chance, or in some cases you're burning that many to draw, like a .44 to draw a second-season tag. You know what I mean? Yeah. It's just different what it takes now. You know? Anyway. But, yeah, great time. You know, I'm probably going to write this a little bit like Jason I know did in the December magazine. You know, my wife and kids have a lot of points, too, in a lot of states. My kids have grown up. And, you know, meaning, you know, since they were 10 or 12, they're getting options. And so my fault. Dad gets point boost options. No. They're not. There has to be a payback somewhere. It's true. It's straight up true. I don't know. Some of my kids aren't even going to. That's not even going to be an option.

You know, they're not going to forego their own hunt. But then some. Who knows? Yeah, who knows? You just never know. My point is. Girls get married. Who knows? My wife had a tag this year. You know, time to use them. She's got them in other states. That's going to happen more in my, you know, near future. I've got to start using points. You know, some of them. I've got kids that are in their low to mid-20s now. They've got 20-plus points. Oh, yeah. Arizona for elk. And, I mean, I'm not even. I'm putting in furry rifles most of the time. What I love is Sean's like, hey, Dad, I've got this and this and this. Like, I think I've got the points. And I'm like, oh, let me look at the spreadsheet. Sure enough. How about that? You do have options. They get to where they're at a certain age. He's the same age. He's that low to mid-20. Tim and Ty are similar. He's, you know, got. Yeah, he's not 20.

I mean, well, when he was a brand-new baby, he had Arizona points, and then they did away with that. Yeah. And there was the five-year rule that if you don't put in for five years, well, that's when he turned 10. He was like. So, we gained points until he was like year four or five. And then there was a five-year rate. Until he was nine. And then they purged. And they purged.

Anyway, where does that leave us? That leaves us plenty. There's more stories. I got a lot of stories. We all have some. And I think also I've got a short list. I want to. We're going to have more and more stories. And then I think, Bronson, we ought to also schedule some time a little bit to go over the point strategies, some things we were talking about with consulting. You started in on it. I really liked that subject. Well, the one thing, you know, Jason wrote about, you know, in our magazine, Jason wrote about it in December. I'll probably write a little bit about my application strategy from a 2026 perspective in this January magazine. And a 20,000. A little bit high view. You know, and it integrates my family, like I alluded, because I've got some of them with points. And I like, you know, I've got, you know, grown daughters. I've got son, my wife.

And I, you know, you can't hunt every single, all of them draw two or three tags. And me draw hopefully two or three tags. But some of them, you know, live out of state now, too. So, but I have, there's some that are like, all right, this is the year. This makes sense. A season move later or something. I'm going to try that, draw them this in this state. Or this one in this state. And it's important to fund. We've had great hunts doing that. I've got to incorporate that. It takes a spreadsheet. It takes a lot of thought and planning. Fortunately, because we have points built up. You know, we have options. Points give you options. That's right. And that's kind of what we can talk about. And that's, and we've got a lot of it going on. And then when you also mailed in with it, the current weather conditions and all of those things.

We're, again, doesn't feel like we've made the best of choices. And we always look back and go, man, I can't wait for a new slate. We usually try to hunt our, quote, favorite, you know, Utah or Nevada deer spots, no matter, at all costs, and put everything into it. And some of your, you realize. I'm on the point. You know what? This is the first year. I used to chase everything that was big. Anywhere that was producing something big, I chased it. And. You're the fish in the pond that hit every lure. I didn't care. If it was a 200-inch lure, I'm hitting. You know what I mean? Even Oregon. Next thing you know, you have an accordion file full of tags. Wow. Even Oregon. I've got shed antlers from Oregon from 1953. I don't know. Not that old. Okay. The late 90s. Yeah. I do one really cool shed. Freaking base. Comes out like your pant legs up over your shoe. That's like. Comes down around.

It's really freak. But I guess my point is, is now, like this year, I've just thought, I want to hunt where I want to hunt. You're going to rain it in a little bit. And I'm okay if people are smashing big deer in Wyoming. And I'm okay if I don't go there. Like, I want to hunt where I want to hunt. Or let's say, eastern plains. I mean, I don't mind hunting eastern plains. And I would go there. But I'm just saying as an example. I guess I'm just at the point where. They had a great year over there. But you're not going to chase it. Because that's not just, that's not where you. I don't know. I kind of want to just, I really want to hunt where I want to hunt. And, you know, where I want to hunt right now, at least the last few years, has been tough. Yeah. But I love it. We're optimistic. The October, November moisture has been phenomenal.

We've had the lightest winter so far we can have in terms of weather. But fortunately, unlike last year, it was dry all going into now. We've at least had all that precip in the desert. And all that's green in a lot of places. And that's going to help animals, you know, just winter great. If we can just get a normally good winter now in these northern Arizona, Utah, northern New Mexico, you know, Nevada. Watch out. Yeah. It feels good. I mean, we're doing a lot of research. Of course, we're right in the states. But like Arizona, guys are excited. The outfitters and people that live there are excited. The ponds are full. Because of the rain. In places they haven't been full for three years. Yeah. They had the eight inches of rain, as you kind of alluded to and talked about a little bit, in other states and areas. Obviously, we just talked about it. But in Arizona, felt that and had that.

And elk and the quality and antler growth is directly correlated to rain now. Rain just happened. All the green grass right now. And then, of course, we would love for it to keep going. Looks like we're going to get snow here on Christmas. So, here, anyway. But all of that's exciting. And then that plays into our plans. I had a guy there at Outfitters say, man, I just don't know that you seem to not draw as many early rifle tags as you normally do. Are you getting smaller? I'm like, no. Okay. But larger than ever as far as business-wise and people applying. But our guys are pretty discriminating. They don't want to waste 20, 25 points on a dry year. And it was pretty tough over there, right? And so, we consult a lot along those lines of, let's wait until a really good year. You've waited a long time. Got a lot of points. Upwards of 30-plus on some of these guys.

And so, anyway, that also goes into play on when, how, where, all of those things. All right. What else we got? Anything else? I just want to give another shout-out to a sponsor, Apex Next Evolution, talking about hydration. And there's a lot of hydration-type companies out there. And we've gone in-depth with Apex. And we've chosen them because of the nutrition factor and that it's not bad for you. You know, it's as good as you can do and still get, like, some energy and some recovery and, you know, some hydration. I had a lime coconut today. It was money. It was good, huh? Yeah. I never tried that one. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. No, one thing I've learned in the last, I don't know, six months, hydration has become, like, very – there's a lot of ads out there for hydration. Drinks and mixes and this and that, whatever. Don't fall for just the ads.

Like, everyone can say whatever they want about an ad. Like, when you really look at these, like, the Apex, it's good stuff in there. Yeah. Like, when you really look at it, it's good stuff. And these others, like, there is some junk out there. Yeah. It's ridiculous. So, yeah. Yeah. Some of that junk makes me feel pretty good. Yeah. My wife's a nurse, and that's the first thing she does. Yeah. You know, and she's always on me about stopping other stuff. So, anyway, we've got discount code. You can get 25% off if you order on their site. Do Epic 25, and you get 25% off. Give it a try. It's amazing stuff. The energy stuff is awesome. It lasts for, like, five hours. It's great. Speaking of this stuff, like, in the middle of the night, the last couple nights, and maybe it's because we're working on a magazine and we don't drink a lot of water. Maybe any water. Yeah.

Remember, Bronson, we went to lunch, had some water. It was, like, the first water we had in 24 hours. Anyway. I'm trying to do better. Middle of the night, I was, like, about ready to cramp. Just come on really fast. You'd stretch your leg out really fast and beat it, right? Yeah. Jenna had the same thing happen, and I'm, like, go get a spoonful of mustard. And so she did it, and then pretty soon I'm up there getting a spoonful of mustard. This is, like, 3 in the morning. Why wouldn't you tell me this? About 2 in the morning. Did it go away? Oh, and instantly. And then, but you've got to wash your mouth. I mean, you've got to sleep with your mouth. Gargle. Gargle. The whole thing. The whole thing. Okay? Got to do the whole thing. And we wake up, and she's, like, I wonder how it works. I wonder what's in it. You know, and she's kind of on this health kick and stuff.

Of course, she is her whole life and good at that kind of stuff. And I'm, like, geez, we're going to find out mustard's bad for us or something, you know. Anyway, she does a little work, and sure enough, and I got it right here, it says, like, it does not, it is not about the electrolytes or anything like that. And it's way faster than electrolytes. It stops the rapid nerve reflex. Like, anyway. What is it? Mustard seed? Yellow mustard and things like pickle juice contains acidic acid, vinegar, and strong flavor compounds that stimulate receptors in the mouth and throat, triggers reflex to the nervous system that inhibits motor neurons causing the cramp. Wow. In simple terms, the intense taste sends a reset signal to the nerves. The signal shuts down the misfiring of the nerve impulses. The muscle relaxes often within 30 to 90 seconds. So you don't need to drink much of it, then.

That's why you have a mustard packet, and it's enough. I took a full tablespoon. I was, like, 16-ounce bottle. Straight up. I didn't care. Whatever it is. I brought some here to the office. Oh, there you go. But mostly for the antelope. I've stood there with both hamstrings like that and sucked down one, two packets. And within literally 30 seconds. 30 seconds. Remember? By the time I put it all in my backpack. You're good. And I start walking. I'm like, I'm a whole new man. Yes. Remember the kid? It's insane. Remember the kid on the Spartan race? That was like. Oh, yeah. I gave him some. Yeah. We gave him one. I looked down the hill, and he's up. He beat you. He's out and going. He was so bad. He was curled up in a ball. It was bad. This is called a neuromuscular reflex, not hydration or sodium replacement. Yeah. You need that stuff for sure. Because long term, you're going to cry.

You are. And it says electrolytes would take 10 to 30 minutes to absorb. Mustard works under two minutes. That's why it's effective mid-cramp. Yeah. You know, yellow mustard, about one to two teaspoons. Swish briefly, then swallow. So what it doesn't do, it doesn't replace salt, doesn't fix dehydration long term, won't prevent cramps hours later. That's hydration. That's why you drink with that. So you need to drink. Yeah. Yeah. But anyway, kind of interesting. Just an immediate band-aid that lasts 600 yards. Oh, the middle of the night? Yeah, exactly. The middle of the night. And you don't want to drink a bunch, because then you're going to have to use the bathroom 14 more times. 14 times. It stubbed your toe. It's miserable. Blind yourself, because you need the light on. Exactly. You can wake up the live kids, dog. Pretty soon, burr. You got dog thinking somebody's breaking in.

Right, Devin? It'll happen. Wake up the whole family. All right. Go ahead. Run along. Here we go. Yeah. Just another shout out to Vortex, another partner of ours, making a lot of different optics. I mean, anything for any price point. You know, if you want to spend some extra money. That Christmas bonus you got at work, there's options there. If you're on a tighter budget, there's options there. So, yeah. You got a Christmas bonus. Yeah. We would like that back. Have you spent it already? What are you going to do? We have what we call a gear store. There's no better place to spend your Christmas bonus than a big outdoor shirt. Adam's life goal. I told him I wasn't spending money. I'm done for 2025. He has worked on me daily. Well, because I sell him a gun. You said that like two weeks ago. I sell him a gun. There's only two weeks to go. I sell him a gun.

And then about a time, I'm going to hold out until January 1. Goals are goals. The reason I bring it up to him is I sold him a gun. And a week later, I said, hey, Logan, can I sell you anything? Nope. I'm done spending money. The next day, he pulls in with a new motorcycle on the back of his truck. Do you remember that? I totally remember that. Like, totally lied to me to my face. And Adam and I were like, you never said you were interested. Like, I would like to be clued in on these things. I love things with wheels. I was, you know. So anyway, that's why I give him. He always says no, but I know he's got something cooking. In Logan's defense, I don't think he knew he was buying anything. What do you mean? He's an impulse buyer. Really? I am. Oh, yeah. Okay, I need the lure. I can't just talk about bait going to get thrown from him. I got to actually put something in front of him.

Jig it along a little bit. But I'm going to say put something on your desk, but if you break it, you buy it. My weakness is on sale. That's my weakness. Which we probably ought to bring up. If you would like to get product by Christmas, you pretty much got to order right now. I thought that was an interesting ad you guys threw out there is we ship same day as order. I like that. Yeah. I think that's true. Yeah, we do. A lot of things in stock. If you're a gal out there looking to get something, I promise you we have something your husband wants. I promise you that. Anyway, give us a holler and we can help you with that. Check out the bargain bin on our website. Got a lot of good stuff in there for prices. We get stuff on there all the time. We just added a new thing the other day. Like a 3500.com. Yeah.

If you're not sure what you want, just call us and tell us what you think your husband's worth to you. And we'll find something we feel matches with. Yeah. You put a value on him, we'll spend it. That's right. I mean, exactly. Anybody interested in any outdoor clothing, QU makes some of the best out there. If not the best, I think it's the best. Making orders like it's my job. Of course, I got gals hitting me. My wife and kids. And hey, let's get on and order this and that and the other. Anyway, pretty awesome. They make anything and everything that you'd want. Like I said, got my own Christmas present. And some for other family members, which I cannot divulge what they got. But I can tell them. I know what you got. I know what I got. Exactly. Coming. All right. That's it. We're going to have a weekend. We're going to finish up this magazine, go to print.

And we're going to start talking about points. Next year. Next week's podcast. Let's talk about 2026 plan, strategy, mindset. I'm excited. Yeah. The hunting science behind how we draw. May already have a full schedule. John. Hunting science. I like that. All right. Sounds good. Have a good one, everybody. Let's face it. If your goal is to kill big stuff, you need to draw quality tags. Quality tags are typically hard to draw. To increase your odds of drawing good tags, you need to apply in multiple states. That's where an Epic Outdoors membership can help. For only $150 a year, you get access to our consultants, our online tools, and to Epic-approved outfitters and members-only optics discounts. With unlimited access to our team of consultants and access to the Epic Outdoors magazines, applying in multiple states is easy. No more worrying if you're applying for the best areas.

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