In this episode of the Epic Outdoors Podcast we look back at 2019 and share stories from our hunts. Some hunts were a struggle, some turned out to be unforgettable. More than anything were ready for 2020 and the hunts to come. We talk about some of our strategies for the upcoming year and what we learned form a few tough hunts.

Disclaimer: this text was produced through an automated transcription service and likely contains errors. Please listen to the original audio for exact content.

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Sometimes the stars align on places you don’t expect them to align.

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Make sure you draw, make sure you draw.

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Nothing stays the same. You got winners, you got droughts, you’ve got hunting. Strategy changes.

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Anything to do with Western big games.

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To the Epic Outdoors Podcast, powered by Under Armour.

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Hey everybody. Jason Carter, Adam Bronson, Chris Peterson. Chris is at the computer making sure we don’t say dumb things. And when we do, he mutes ’em. So anyway, coming at you from Southern Utah. We’re back in the office. It’s been crazy. Been in the hills a ton. We’re gonna cover some of those experiences. Been a lot of fun. We got everybody we’re, we’ve got an office full of people. Phone calls are coming in like crazy. And we’re writing the magazine for January. Of course, December’s just hitting the streets right now.

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Bronson bet E Mag’s been out for probably three weeks, two, three weeks. I don’t know. Awesome. Cover crisp, giant Arizona Bull. Feels

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Like it’s three D on

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There. Oh it does. It’s a good looking, good looking bull. So

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Absolute monster. Anyway, Vince Bloom. Yeah, freaking smashed. A

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Giant raffle tag. Hunter Arizona, 365 day raffle tag. I believe he had it the year before and so he had to kill by August 14th this year. That’s

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Technically hunt two years. Kind

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Of technically hunt two years of bulls, but the second year they’re probably gonna be velvet, which he did. Just an awesome non-typical bull. Thanks Vince, for putting that story together for us. Drawn a awesome governor tag equivalent on the raffle tag there. Awesome bull. So,

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So yeah, back in the office, I’d like to thank Under Armour for sponsoring these podcasts. Of course, they sponsor about everything we do here at Epic Outdoors. Thank you ua. You can go to, type in Baron in the search. And up comes all the hunting gear. At least that’s made in Baron and that’s what we like here in the West. So anyway, they do have force pattern. It’s awesome. Kind of a green version of the Baron. And it comes in a wide variety of, of the different models of clothing they’re making. So

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Yeah, we’re back here full time now. Hunt season’s over haven’t quite hit us yet. We’re still kind of thinking now maybe there’s still something to hunt, but there’s not. So we’re, but we’re not in the, we’re not in the desk mode fully, but we are. But what this also means is we will be more consistently here in the podcast room. I don’t know if we wanna box ourself into a corner yet and commit once a week to how many, but one to two a week. I think I was gonna say that easily. One some days too, depending on if we’re on a rant and we have 30 minutes to jump in here and capture something on film. ’cause once in a while we’re getting on some good rants. There’s topics of discussion, you know, every morning round this office that are podcast worthy. Sometimes we’ll try to capture some of those things as we’re, as we’re going off on a topic.

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Well, the interesting thing is, sometimes in the morning, it’s the only time the phones don’t ring at least for a minute. Or

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We don’t answer before eight o’clock. Yeah, there you,

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Except for this morning. But anyway, where we can kind of talk about our own hunts. Of course we’re doing what you’re all doing. And that’s thinking about next year. It was funny, I, I hit you Bronson and, and what, mid-November and I’m like, I’m tired of this year, but I can’t wait for next year. You know what I mean? I’m tired of my own plan, this current plan, and I’m ready to make a new plan

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This week. This week we’ve been

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Buying and selling. Well,

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No, well we’ve

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We’ve been in every state. We’ve had scenarios that we’re thinking of this year. I, maybe not Oregon and Washington, but, or California. But about ev about every other state.

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Yeah, there’s some big deer there in Oregon. Here and there. We were looking

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Truck did

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We did this morning.

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We did. We did have Oregon. Nevermind all your Oregonians. We, we don’t fill left out. We we’re thinking, we thinking about you this year, maybe. So anyway, couple deer that get you excited here and there. But yeah, it’s just funny we’re, you know, the, the slate’s clean. 2020 calendar’s not got a date on it yet for hunts.

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Maybe one or two.

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Well, maybe for you. I don’t know. I don’t think I do, but maybe I’m not aware of something really. Maybe I’m overlooking something. How about

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Colorado third?

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Well, I’ll be there, but yeah. Not a specific hunt yet, but yeah. But that’s, but anyway, we’re all full of optimism. I guess that’s the other thing too. New year’s bring optimism and a lot of planning and it’s that time of year. So we just kind of want to talk about a little bit about the year wrap up. Jason had a couple of hunts that we’ll get into. We’re

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Terrible. We’re

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Terrible that were probably trucks, they’re hunts that you could have gone through two or three air filters on the hunts. ’cause we had, should have. It was so dry for southern Utah, Northern Arizona, Nevada, during the hunts. I mean the, the antler development was great. So the deer grew, outgrew what they needed. But man, we had a two, three month period that was dry, dry, dry. It

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Was crazy dry. Unlike, I think I even Googled like St. George. We lived near St. George, Utah. Right. So I googled St. George, you know, dry spell or something like that. Up pops 157 straight days of no rain. 157. So we have an amazing spring antler growth off the charts. Then we have nothing but dry. These animals are

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Vulnerable. No monsoons in in our part of the world. Yeah. Didn’t happen. It was, we had a couple late August or late July, early August, but when it doesn’t hit, hit certain places and then doesn’t hit you. But even Cedar City, it was dry. Nevada was dry. Guzzlers all over for sheep were dry. Bone dry. Yeah. One it

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Drying up by the guzzler. That’s right. Drying

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Up one by one. It was, it was crazy. And then it didn’t rain until the 20th of November and then

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When it rained, it

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Poured. It hasn’t stopped.

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And so then we also had snow storms in Arizona. We had those late bulls coming on, bull hunts coming on and you know, everybody’s excited. I don’t know if the rutt, if you’d call it soft or whatnot, but the rutt was just a little bit off. Bulls weren’t broken as much. And then they’re going into this late season thinking this is gonna be amazing. That’d be

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Awesome. It’s been Bluebird weather. Take the lawn chairs up there. And then they had a foot of snow

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Or three feet. Three or three feet. And there was, there was guys being airlifted as I’m learning and talking to guys, you know, across the state of Arizona there was guys airlifted out. Camp trailers crushed, wall tensed, flattened, I mean crazy stuff in places like you Montana.

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Yeah. We’re not talking Montana and Wyoming. We’re talking Arizona. Yeah.

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Between Flagstaff and Kingman. How about that? That’s right. That’s right. Between 10 inches. Eight to 10 inches out there in one and 27 on the east side of the state. So you know, those guys, a lot of ’em didn’t kill elk. And a lot of ’em turn tags back at the last minute game. And fish is having a hard time divvying out tags. Especially when a snowstorm hits. There’s a lot of bulls saved. There’s a lot of bulls saved. Tons and tons and tons. ’cause there’s like six A has 700 late tags. And if you have half the take you’d normally have or less and quality,

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It’s a short hunt. And you could have a, you know, those Thanksgiving storms that rode through Thanksgiving day, day after, which is when these hunts started down there and the aftermath for a day or two, you start chewing two or three days of storms, you’re almost, you know, 40% or halfway through your hunt.

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And then you go to Colorado and let’s just jump right into the mess, dust and freaking warm and brutal, huh?

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It was tough. And it feels like three or four years in a row that Colorado has squelched hopes and dreams. Come November, it feels like you get a little bit of a storm, a couple snows in the second season. Everybody’s all right, here we go. And then nothing else happens. Silence.

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Silence. Nothing else happens.

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There’s like two bucks killed that are, that are monster. And we all hang onto that and go, yeah, Colorado’s the next best state. There was two out of how many thousands of

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Tags. Oh yeah, it was, it was another tough year. I, I actually set out Colorado this year. I I ended up violated the

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Cardinal rule.

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Yeah, I did. I I violated my own rule of never sit home from Colorado, but once in a while things come along and you have to do that. I had a desert sheep peg and so that, that caused me to sit out Colorado this year.

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So should we dive into that? That I’d rather dive into that than Colorado deer. We, we’ve

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Pinging ponged all over the place. So I guess we had probably one of our last podcasts we talked about was in early October I’d gotten home from New Mexico and killed a big bull. Jason killed a giant deer in Nevada. We talked about both of those. So if you’re intrigued about those, look up one of the earlier episodes, right. Two or three episodes ago. Yeah. I dunno. Something like that. But yeah, that put us into all these hunts. We’re talking about mid to late October through early November, I guess. And yeah, I killed the sheep.

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You killed a great sheep. Yeah. Not only did you kill a great sheep, I mean this is what’s interesting about this particular hunt.

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Oh, here we go. I’ve had,

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I milked it. I milked this hunt for all I could. It was about 60 days. About 60 day season. Not quite, but about

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How many days of those did you

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I hunted 25. Wow.

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25 solid days. 25 solid days. So I came in, I came in for, I don’t know, maybe eight or probably nine or close

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To half, but I’d say maybe 10. Yeah. Two different stents you were out there for.

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Yeah. Four

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Or five days at least on a couple stints.

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And actually we all got to watch the ram. You ended up killing all the time. Oh yeah. Any day. Every day. Yeah. Huh.

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Yeah, there was

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Called him the backup.

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We, we, we called him that. And it was the only reason I called him that. It was, you know, as you, many of you know, I do guide hunters too. And my last hunter, I think we killed a ram like the 11th of October, which left me almost a full 30 days. The season went until November 10th. And I’m like, I’m done. And this, this is my chance and I’m a, I’m never gonna get a chance probably with the Utah Desert sheep tag in. That’s it. Or, or maybe another state who knows. And I’ve got close to 30 days. I am gonna take ’em,

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Make the most of it. And so we were tag teaming me, your brother, your mom, even your dad.

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My mom, my son came down. Wayne, Brad, Brad, Gary, Steve. I mean, it was just a revolving door of people because I don’t expect to have anybody else to come out there. There was one st I was out there for 10 or 11 days straight. Yeah. And, you know, people would come and go. And I appreciate every, I owe everybody, I owe everybody a a lot of of days on their future hunts.

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That’s on record.

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I do, I do. And, and I, I I’ll

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Unlimited sheet.

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Well, you can’t cash him in on that, Barbara. No, I owe you on, you know, your Wyoming antelope pun.

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Okay. Alright.

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So, but in all seriousness, I owe a lot of both family and close friends, you know, for, you know, that’s what you do on sheep hunts. That’s, that’s what’s I know. I’ve done it with Jason on a couple of his and, but, but in all seriousness, I owe a lot of people, you know, time on their hunts coming up because Yeah, it was, it was not that I thought I was gonna kill 180 inch desert Ram in Utah. That’s not possible. But I just wanted to, I wanted to hunt. I didn’t wanna be in a hurry. So probably four or five days after I’d really gotten serious for me, we did find this ram that I ended up killing mid-October and just wasn’t ready to be done with three plus weeks of hunting season left. But, you know, you can’t just put one on the shelf and say, I’m gonna pick that off later in the season. And I’m gonna punch my tag on that. You, they’re, they’re live animals and they’re, you know, sheep and they wander and they’re rutting and who knows, he got, he got into it with some other rams and chipped up himself a little bit between the time we found him and the time he killed him,

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He got a fresh big

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White one. Oh, he did, he did probably a week after we found him. But we were just having fun. I, we were having a good time, you know, learned a lot of new country that I, I personally hadn’t hunted with clients just because some, you know, some clients maybe you’re not able to go backpack into some of the country and stay and hunt like that like you want or whatever. Or you don’t have to. ’cause there’s sheeping areas you find that you don’t have to do that. But I just milked it. And

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You hunted for pre rutt rutt and figure fills it

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Post kind of post rut in certain times. Yeah. I was there long enough to experience a little bit of everything. Hunted a little bit in September in between hunters. But then, like I said, you know, killed hunters and neighboring units and even in the unit I had mine in and neighboring units and just had a really fun hunt. Really fun experience. Experienced rain and some snow and, you know, hot. I mean, it was a bit of everything over those 25 days. And ultimately it got into November and that’s where, where my November, you know, plans, I ended up, you know, deciding color what route, you know, not biting the bullet on the landowner tag and, and setting it out. But I ended up November 4th deciding it was, it was time, you know, I had my, my bow on my hunt with me, my, my rifle on that we

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Could’ve killed that ram. Could be 25 yards from it

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One day. Oh, one time. I, I was close that day. I mean a

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Group of us

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Yeah. And we’re like just rounded a bend, I don’t know. Then ran right into a group of sheep and it was like stupid. And, and I had this conversation with, you know, after 23 years of applying 23 years ago, if I would’ve saw the ram, that ram it would’ve been something, an elbow

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To get getting outta

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The truck and let me kill this thing. I mean, he is an upper sixties ram. Yes. And, and that 23 years ago, a one 60 monster ram was like a 1 75 ram in Utah. Come on. And we talked about how spoiled, you know, I’m kind of being and I get it. And, and all the guys at camp

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Pounded 171 inch inches with a client Yeah. And set a bar. A a an invisible bar. Yeah.

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You know, and, and just, just, we’ve done it with other clients, but just, just was looking for something that might be crazy, a unicorn, but just really was having a fun time hunting everybody at night would joke with me. But anyway, finally down to time and I, you know, it was time, you know, the hunt does end November 10th and, and it was the fourth. And I decided, you know, you know, I’m probably gonna leave the bow home now and decide it’s time to kill the ram. And, and anyway, had a great, great stock that day. Got in there and, you know, bettered him down. Made it happen. Made it happen. Anyway, the rifle I had on that hunt was a m o A rifle and 6.5 p r c performed. Awesome. One shot kill, check ’em [email protected]. Make it great either, whether it be a lightweight sheep rifle or any other, you know, rifle long range capabilities. One shot with a m o a rifle, I don’t know, 375 or something like, like that. And it was over, it was great. It was kind of surreal in a way. I, I don’t know, I wouldn’t call it anti-climactic at all, but was very calm, calculated. But part of it was like, there was, I’d been there a long time and I’d seen this ram a bunch and had a lot of different pictures of the video of him and all that before

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Chip and after chip

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And That’s right. And anyway, took him pretty neat to walk up on your own desert sheep after walking on right. At nearly a hundred of others with, with clients. And it was pretty fun. And finished my, my grand slam of North American wild sheep. And that was also kind of a weird thing because at the time, like you Jason, we grew up in southern Utah. Desert sheep were kind of like, I want a desert sheep someday. And somehow in your mind, you think that’s the first one you’re gonna hunt. And it happened last for you, it was probably your third. Mine was my last of the four. It was just the way things happen. You know, you don’t, you can’t predictably think that, but, but went from, you know, it finished with the Utah desert sheep was pretty fun, pretty, pretty awesome,

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Awesome. And had a great, great experience. You’ll see some pictures coming up in the magazine here, probably in the Utah U February issue, but 11, 11 year old ram just, it kind of was all always gonna be just what I wanted. An old ram, cool ram busted up nose, scarred nose on the tip. Just, just everything I wanted. So yeah, just got it. I got everything outta that hunt that I hoped to get. So

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I got a text, which was unfortunate. Well, I just got a text and Wayne was like, he’s dead. And I called you and I think it was 33 seconds after you killed him.

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Yeah, we, it was in a spot on the unit where we had some cell coverage. And of course I’m not texting anybody right there. I’m just, yeah. Cleaning up my gun, getting my, you know, stuff loaded. Dust, my pack dust and laying down and I feel my phone, phone ringing, buzzing. It’s not ringing, it’s buzzing and it’s you. And I’m like, okay, I’ll see what he wants. And he’s like, dude, congrats. I’m like, how did you know? And apparently Wayne had already texted him and with, this is literally within 60 seconds. And so yeah,

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You’re like, dude, I, I killed just

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Like, how good is he? And I’m like, what do you mean the, the ringing and the smoke of the smell of burnt powder is still right here. He, we, we’ve got 30 minutes before we get to this thing. And I’m like, yeah. Anyway. So it was pretty fun. But anyway,

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He’s awesome. Yeah. So he was aroundm, everybody had kind of seen him been a part of this. Took part least. It was kind of cool.

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Yeah, it was fun. Know

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Gary and everybody else. I mean everybody. Anyway. It’s

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Awesome. Appreciate it. They have a lot of people to think it was fun, but in the end, not everybody’s there, but every, it was, everybody was part of the hunt. So it was pretty special. So

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After that, we gotta go to Colorado. Third, third season and you know, kind of the season was getting cranking right in the middle of it. Wyatt Wyatt here in the office. And I went up there and, and kind of hit it well as my wife, my wife was with us, we got, you know, people to take the kids and anyway, ended up going up there and

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Hopes and dreams were shattered. Yeah.

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Couldn’t find a 26 inch heavy four point. Couldn’t even find one. Yeah.

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You thought at least we’re gonna find a good solid buck for come

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When do you not

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For Jenna know, you know, 1 75, 80 older buck or whatever. She and she, she was ready to shoot, so Oh, she

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Was ready. Jenna’s Jenna’s, I mean it’s, we’re talking, you know, a lot of you guys out there have been married a long time and we’re talking over 20 years of diapers and raising kids and not being able to go. And finally we’re able to go and, and at some point she was just like, you know, I don’t wanna shoot one just to make it die. Like if it’s not something respectable and mature, like I’m, I’m fine not to kill one. It was so, such a huge relief for me. I was like, oh we can just enjoy this. Yeah. You know what I mean? And

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Not get bloody

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Keeps his

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Back truck clean, you know, except for the air filter. And so anyway, just hit it so hard and couldn’t make it happen. You ever, we’ve all been on those hunts, you can’t make some hunts happen.

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Yeah. There’s some, you feel like you can just, sometimes you can grind it out and make something happen and other times you’re doing that and it doesn’t matter what you’re doing, it’s not happening. No. And part of it, a lot of it, big part it was the weather, warm, dry, just no ru initiation from what it sounded like. No. You know, no

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Very little migration. And then within every unit it’s a little migration. Even if it’s five, 10 miles, you just got just down onto some winter range type country. If they’re in the middle or they’re in the super thick or maybe they’re nocturnal ’cause it’s hot, whatever. You just, I know it it, for those of you who haven’t experienced it, I get it. You’re thinking the deer in the unit, I don’t know the problem. You lift up your bins and glass and it should be no different than any other year. And it just is. It’s not that way. It’s tough. What was your experience Chris?

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Mine was

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Terrible. You went a little earlier, Dan The second. Yeah, I went,

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I went a little on the second. It was just, it was the same type of thing. I just, I couldn’t make anything happen. Finally we ended up getting on a decent four point with a little kicker on it, but didn’t work out just, and that was the only, the only mature deer in an entire week.

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Wow. Crazy. Yeah.

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You had a little weather if I remember during, I don’t remember at what point you had snowing, right? The end. Yeah. Right toward

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The end. It started to snow just a little bit. But that was, yeah, like we said in the second season after that, it just warmed up.

00:20:33:29 –> 00:20:34:10

00:20:34:20 –> 00:21:10:06
Teased you and then crushed hopes and dreams. Yeah. And there’s gonna be a lot of questions about Colorado. A lot of people viewed the five year season structure that’s coming. You know, they, they shift a little bit later this year just with some changes in the lengths of seasons and you know, gaps between a little bits counter shift. Yeah. Gaps between hunts that have been lengthened a little bit between like, you know, first and second and some of those that have, they’re pushed a little bit later just due to that. But I dunno, the best way to characterize Colorado, Jason dear situation right now would be what, in your opinion,

00:21:11:15 –> 00:21:16:08
We had the worst season. 2019 was the worst season I’ve ever remembered seeing in Colorado.

00:21:17:22 –> 00:21:21:16
I would agree. And, and so trophy wise, still pictures

00:21:21:16 –> 00:21:22:13
That come in, but

00:21:22:13 –> 00:21:38:04
We still view Colorado is a must apply for and hunted off in state. No question about that. But it’s just a lot of good. It’s not, we’re gonna field a lot of calls later in the year on what do I do with my Colorado points? And you still have to

00:21:38:04 –> 00:21:39:19
Go and, but this is what you do. Just

00:21:39:21 –> 00:21:45:02
Be there somewhere. But I can’t tell you this is, these are the no-brainer places, but,

00:21:45:02 –> 00:21:54:19
And that’s a hundred percent right. But this is what you do. You go there expecting to get your butt whooped and then you enjoy it once in a while when it doesn’t. That’s what you do. And you

00:21:54:19 –> 00:22:12:29
Gotta go and you go repeatedly. Meaning as often as you can with minimal points if you have a lot of points. Peop the problem, the big problem with people that have a lot, and when I say a lot, I’m talking maybe 14, 15 plus, right? Yeah. I’m glad I’m not in that pool because you feel like you’ve gotta get

00:22:13:27 –> 00:22:14:04

00:22:14:06 –> 00:23:12:08
15, 20 years worth out of it and, and you just can’t even, you draw it in a year, you gotta turn back tags 30 year or 30 days in advance in Colorado, which you can’t, you don’t know what the weather’s gonna be like there. It’s either you, you roll the dice or not and there’s not no brainer. These are the mu these are the camp miss places to go. Even in areas that you feel like are that way. I had people this year burn 15, 16 points on third seasons. Yes. And they didn’t kill a deer. They came home. And that’s, that feels like it’s a tough, tough thing to swallow, but it it, it keeps going back to the point you just gotta go to Colorado more often. If you go more often on average to mid-tier units and go repeatedly or pick up turnback tags or whatever price landowner tags you can afford. Just be there more often when it, when the stars aligned, boom. You’re gonna get, you’re gonna get one. You don’t kill one every single time you’re there. That’s that kind of deer that we all dream about.

00:23:12:22 –> 00:23:50:24
I was gonna, you know, I texted a buddy of mine, he used 17 points in Colorado. Okay. And, and as a consultant, we take it personal when guys don’t have the hunts, they want to have, I mean we love it when you’re successful has 17 points. He says, Colorado was not what you spend 17 points on and meaning my Colorado hunt and, and that and it, and it hits like that’s a good friend of mine. And it is true. And sometimes hindsight’s 2020, there were a couple units that seemed to produce a little better than others. Just like you would have that hindsight is 2020. I wouldn’t have guessed that those couple of units were the ones that were the good producers.

00:23:50:29 –> 00:24:16:13
Seems like. Yeah, you’ve got, and I’m, I’m gonna say almost no top elite stuff and you have some bad just masses hunts that they throw thousands of tags at and everything else. The 80 or 90% is in the middle Yeah. Of average to good and, and great potential. But it’s all average to good. Yeah. It feels

00:24:16:13 –> 00:24:26:29
Like to me in the last couple years it’s, it’s been a little tougher and I don’t know why, maybe that’s just my perspective, but it feels like, man, 10 years ago you could go and it, it felt Oh yeah, it felt easier.

00:24:27:09 –> 00:25:09:14
Oh yeah. There were units that there were, Hey, you got 10 plus points, go here. Yeah, you’re gonna have an awesome hunt. Some of the Gunnison units and some of those are good and you could, they’re frankly now some of the why I’d say better, but they’re still inconsistent. But there’s no, there’s no cut and dried. No, there’s no a hundred percent and and there’s never a hundred percent, but there’s no, oh, you go here, you got an 80, 89% chance you’re gonna call 8 180 5 plus buck. You can’t say that. No. About, anyway, we’ve had three or four years everybody’s spooked and everybody’s scared to use points and this year they’re gonna be even scared to use them more. ’cause the next year’s dates are even later. And then you got point creep gonna just crush the world

00:25:09:14 –> 00:25:26:10
And everybody overthinks it because they’ve got so many points. You gotta overthink it ’cause you’re not gonna have ’em again. I’ve got, we’ve got guys that are just, you know, what do I do and when do I use them? And like, we’re looking at 20, 21 third season dates November 13th to the 19th. November 13th to the 19th third.

00:25:26:28 –> 00:25:28:17
That’s in 2021, right?

00:25:28:17 –> 00:25:34:16
2021. Yes. And so next year’s fourth, we’re be the seventh to the 13th. People are looking at it going, I’ll

00:25:34:16 –> 00:25:34:20
Wait a

00:25:34:20 –> 00:25:44:10
Year. I’m gonna wait a year. Well, everybody’s gonna wait a year. And guess what happens if I have 12, I’m gonna choose a unit that barely, some people got in with 12 and 13 points. Points

00:25:44:10 –> 00:25:45:22
And it’s gonna take 15 that year because,

00:25:45:25 –> 00:25:55:17
And it’s gonna jump again. And then, and you sit out again and it’s use them on a point on a unit that takes 10. Make sure you draw. Yeah. Make sure you draw. But, but to do that. And

00:25:55:17 –> 00:25:59:28
The other thing that hard on people about, you mentioned the third read, the fourth season dates in 2021. Jason,

00:25:59:28 –> 00:26:09:25
2021 fourth. November 24th to the 28th. Wow. Okay. We’re talking Thanksgiving. Okay. If you can hunt Thanksgiving, that’s governor tech seasons. Okay.

00:26:10:23 –> 00:26:12:13
But it’s also, God,

00:26:12:27 –> 00:26:13:06

00:26:13:06 –> 00:26:15:01
Hard on, you’re gonna be hard on some deer. It be

00:26:15:01 –> 00:26:15:13
After the third

00:26:15:23 –> 00:26:17:01
And you get thirds and fourths.

00:26:17:11 –> 00:26:18:01
Yes. Go,

00:26:18:04 –> 00:26:32:16
Go hunting. They’re, they may over, they may overdo it if you ev if we get snow a line on some of these units. Okay. And we’ve not, we’ve been underachieving and all of a sudden it happens. 2022 and three could be rough.

00:26:32:25 –> 00:26:38:05
Okay. Yeah. Let’s talk about that. 2019, the worst season we’ve ever seen in our lives. And 17

00:26:38:21 –> 00:26:43:28
And 17 and 18. For all intents and purposes were average and below average. Okay. We’re not, they weren’t great.

00:26:43:28 –> 00:26:49:06
Okay. So we’re bottoming out. Okay. They’re given lots of extra tags. ’cause the C w D and they’re trying to clean out

00:26:49:06 –> 00:26:55:28
That Correct. They, yeah, they won’t, don’t wanna be too top heavy. You know, like they were in the the That’s right. Late two thousands. Okay. Mid to late two thousands. So let’s

00:26:55:28 –> 00:27:01:29
Make dang good and sure we don’t have any four year olds. Right. So we’re gonna blow it out with tags and then we’re gonna change season dates. Now

00:27:01:29 –> 00:27:02:17
We’re gonna push you into

00:27:02:20 –> 00:27:13:08
November. We’re gonna let you be more effective. Second, third and fourth are all gonna be rut hunts. Okay. Second season in 2021, second season 2021. October 30th to November 7th. Wow.

00:27:13:23 –> 00:27:14:25
Second season.

00:27:15:00 –> 00:27:22:25
Okay. Most likely good chance you’re gonna have a snowstorm. Right? They’re gonna be vulnerable and we give tons of tags on second we load it. Right.

00:27:22:25 –> 00:27:24:12
Right. You think that’s year to go fourth

00:27:25:14 –> 00:27:25:24

00:27:25:24 –> 00:27:29:13
Everybody cleaned out? What’s gonna left Second and thirds are both in November d Well, how would

00:27:29:16 –> 00:27:45:23
You like to be the third guy and then let’s say 2022, what’s left? We had the worst season, had bad seasons. 20 17, 20 18. The worst season 2019 next year. Who knows? Right? But we’re all getting ready to save our points for 2021. 2020 one’s gonna annihilate anything we had.

00:27:46:15 –> 00:27:53:12
If it, if it, if we have a normal snow year in 2020 or 2021, they’re,

00:27:53:15 –> 00:27:57:22
Let’s call it a slight annihilate bus. And a normal slow snow year is a slight die off in some areas.

00:27:59:02 –> 00:28:23:13
That’s right. Just be honest. Well, I mean normal, but normal snow years prior to or during the hunts, which we haven’t had for three or four years. And they come down and they crush ’em and they kill ’em and they go back and in pickups and everybody’s sassy and fat and happy. And it was the best time of my life. By 2021 when the date moved late, they finish ’em off. Just be careful what you’re wishing and asking for. Just,

00:28:23:20 –> 00:28:46:01
That’s where some weird stuff comes in. That’s where you just like, okay, I’m gonna try some weird stuff. I want to do weird obscure units that the trophy hunters with great optics and teams don’t annihilate the place. Yeah. And, and maybe it’s maybe game and fish doesn’t care about ’em. And you got a guy that happens to maybe that’s hard to survey and they don’t understand how many deer are there. You look for some of these weird anomalies that might produce a monster.

00:28:46:13 –> 00:28:55:08
That’s right. So there’s a lot to be considered about. And we’ll talk a lot more detail in Epic Outdoors Magazine about Colorado in that March issue. But now

00:28:55:09 –> 00:29:02:14
Put yourselves in our shoes and you’re a consultant with a guy with 12, 14, 16, 18 points. What are you telling him? What are you telling him? Bronson? I’m

00:29:02:14 –> 00:29:06:01
65 years old and this is my last chance to kill a 180 5 buck or

00:29:06:01 –> 00:29:09:11
1 95 and I’m What do you, what would you do in my shoes?

00:29:11:17 –> 00:29:13:22
Stop. I

00:29:13:22 –> 00:29:25:26
Mean, sir, I’m just being honest. It’s a tough go, but hey, well I don’t wanna play the paint, the doom and gloom. We will be in Colorado every single year except for Adam’s sheep year happened to be this year. Every single year for the rest of our lives we will be.

00:29:25:26 –> 00:29:31:26
Yeah. It’s just be there, alter it, do weird stuff. You got, you know,

00:29:32:16 –> 00:29:56:01
Be willing to eat tags. I ate tags. Wyoming, Colorado, New Mexico, Utah, and Arizona. How about that? I ate tags this year, 2019 alone. No fun. Right? No fun. And so you’ve gotta just say, Hey, that’s nobody’s fault. I get it. Hindsight’s 2020. I’d take all that tag money, gas, money, time, put it back in my pocket. I’d be husband of the year, I’d be dad of the year and I’d be richer. That’s right. You know what I mean? That’s right.

00:29:56:20 –> 00:30:04:02
But you’ve, you experienced some things, you weeded some stuff out that you know you don’t want to go do again. Yeah. Or not recently, but you also

00:30:04:03 –> 00:30:05:19
Chalked it up to bad weather. Yeah.

00:30:05:19 –> 00:30:12:07
We also, you accept that, you accept that that year was, this year was, was rough. Yeah.

00:30:12:11 –> 00:30:13:08
I mean, tough year. You

00:30:13:08 –> 00:30:15:20
Killed, you started the year killing a 220

00:30:16:03 –> 00:30:17:07
Okay. In Nevada.

00:30:17:13 –> 00:30:34:07
Okay. And it’s like this. So there we go. I got three more deer tags. Well, I guess Arizona. Arizona was and Utah. Archery stuff, you know, didn’t happen. But you had dedicated a hunter in Utah. You could’ve still killed it. But my point is started off awesome and

00:30:34:13 –> 00:30:39:14
New Mexico Elk. Elk was super tough. I went, I I did the New Mexico elk. Chris, you were with me Huh?

00:30:39:23 –> 00:30:41:17
I got my butt kicked too. Yeah,

00:30:41:17 –> 00:30:42:13
You had elk tag.

00:30:42:13 –> 00:30:45:28
Oh, you went back in early October rifle. You were our troops. Jason. Yep.

00:30:46:14 –> 00:30:49:05
Ate, how’d it taste? I was on two tags in New Mexico that we ate

00:30:49:28 –> 00:30:50:18
Two elk tags.

00:30:50:20 –> 00:30:57:18
It was terrible. I mean, I, it’s a unit I’ve been to several times and it was just different. I, it was not the same. So

00:30:57:18 –> 00:31:08:10
Green not, not the same place. Well, and I don’t know if what it was like in your unit, my unit, which we already talked about. So green water everywhere, feed everywhere. I think elk could just wherever they

00:31:08:10 –> 00:31:09:29
Wanted And you smash and grab a three 80. I

00:31:09:29 –> 00:31:12:26
Did. I did. And I’ll take it. I, I took it

00:31:13:23 –> 00:31:16:18
And I gladly took it and drove home. Yes. Happily.

00:31:16:23 –> 00:31:24:10
Happily. And started back on my sheet pond. And it was, I’m grateful for it. Sometimes it goes that way. Other times it goes, you guys are eating paper.

00:31:24:21 –> 00:31:29:13
I’m sitting there for eating, eating tags the entire hunt. Not seeing a mature bull on public ground.

00:31:29:20 –> 00:31:37:02
And it’s not like that unit was mismanaged. It’s same tag numbers overall. Even the the, they put a new early hunt on it, Chris. Okay. But you were there

00:31:37:06 –> 00:31:40:16
A the year before or two years before you were there boss, they didn’t

00:31:40:16 –> 00:31:41:19
Even have a good season on the early

00:31:41:29 –> 00:31:42:07

00:31:42:14 –> 00:31:44:04
That’s right. Yeah. It was just, it was

00:31:44:04 –> 00:31:51:29
Just, well think about this weird New Mexico, Arizona. Remember the moisture? Utah, Nevada Amazing. We were off the charts. Grass

00:31:52:05 –> 00:31:52:17
Was like

00:31:52:20 –> 00:32:13:05
That. Everybody was just predicting an amazing atler growth year. What did New Mexico kill? Okay, there were a couple highlights. There were, but nowhere near what we thought. Yeah. You know what I mean? Arizona was off the charts. It was off the charts. I think part of New Mexico’s is it’s thick and tough and the rut was just, i I want to call it soft, I don’t know what to call it. Well,

00:32:13:05 –> 00:32:53:19
And you’ve got a flatter thick, you’ve got some units in Utah or or other places. There’s elk habitat. And then you hit a border like there’s no elk anymore. New Mexico’s not like that. It feels like there’s good, really good stuff and a lot of marginal. And I think elk just scattered into a lot of marginal, tough, thicker, thicker stuff. Thicker, flatter, thick cedars pinion juniper stuff that, that in drier years is not near the water sources not have great feed in wetter years. You could bail the grass on rangeland in a lot of parts of New Mexico this year. It was unbelievable. I don’t what it was like. Well one of the things

00:32:53:19 –> 00:33:15:01
That I ran into was some of the places that usually have a lot of feed. I got in there and they, there was no feed. Oh. And the elk were not there anymore. I think there’s always a a, a number of cows in there. Yes. But this year it was just over different overgrazed. You, you can tell the difference. They just left them too long or some, I don’t know what the deal was, but there wasn’t feed in places that they Yeah.

00:33:15:01 –> 00:33:21:28
Well and that, who knows It could, who knows what the change was in that regard. Stalking rates are left them there longer ’cause there was more feet. Who knows?

00:33:22:25 –> 00:33:41:05
But just different. It was just a tough year, you know. But at the same time, that’s my point now, bringing us back to minute two of the podcast. Hi Adam. I’m can’t wait for next year. I hope this year ends soon. What are we gonna do? Let’s start with a clean slate. I’m so excited for next year. I’m so excited right now. I every day

00:33:41:17 –> 00:33:48:05
Right now we have two antelope points that Jason plans to use this points on. Come on. We, I thought we’ve, it’s crossed

00:33:48:05 –> 00:33:48:10

00:33:48:15 –> 00:33:48:25
It’s true.

00:33:49:02 –> 00:33:50:25
I think Colorado, Wyoming. I done.

00:33:50:25 –> 00:34:01:01
Alright. Done. So that’s where we are. We’ve already got on the calendar two antelope pun. I’m, I’ve got one for me. Probably one of the same ones. Jason’s gonna go on somewhere in Wyoming or nearby next door to you

00:34:01:01 –> 00:34:02:01
Gonna smash and grab

00:34:02:05 –> 00:34:02:12

00:34:02:15 –> 00:34:08:22
And you know, we’re to that point that we’ve already planned antelope punts Jason, two of them for 2020. You

00:34:08:22 –> 00:34:10:18
Can’t, I can’t be stopped like,

00:34:11:02 –> 00:34:13:28
You know, hasn’t hung antelope in four or five years. And now we’ve got

00:34:13:28 –> 00:34:14:23
Two of them. In my defense,

00:34:15:05 –> 00:34:17:04
You do have 20 antelope points in Colorado.

00:34:17:04 –> 00:34:21:17
Okay. In my, in my and in my defense we saw like, that was a bright spot. We saw some big

00:34:21:17 –> 00:34:29:07
Bucks. Well, yeah, when you’re, you’re driving to find a deer worth shooting somewhere. Anyway. 25 And you had three kids.

00:34:29:26 –> 00:34:30:19
Oh yeah. And

00:34:30:19 –> 00:34:31:16
Two of them killed bucks.

00:34:31:20 –> 00:34:54:17
We did have a good two of ’em. Our Wyoming deer hunt. Okay. Two of them killed. I’m gonna put this carefully. The hunt sucked. But I was with my family and Ashley killed her second deer of her life at 12 years old. Yeah. Five by five. Five in lines in the front fork. And we were up to within a couple of hours of when she had to leave. ’cause she was, had a volleyball the next day. And you have to drive home, right? Yeah.

00:34:54:17 –> 00:34:56:04
Like 10 hours or whatever that is.

00:34:56:11 –> 00:35:41:05
The Carter’s had three vehicles in Wyoming because mama need to bring the kids, some kids home. And me and Sean, Sean can drive. And of course he’s an animal and him and I have neighboring units and so, and, and so we’re in constant contact and I’m helping him. Some days I give up my hunt, just go help him and then, you know, and then come to my hunt and we’re cranking, cranking, cranking, eat lunch together, crank, crank, crank. And it is a lot of fun hunting with your kids when they can finally. And, and Sean’s very capable and done it on his own several times. But it’s a, it’s kind of a new level with my family. And so it was a lot of fun. Having said that, both of us got our butts handed to us. Yeah. And Sean’s missing school. Of course he’s happy, happy about that. But at the end of the day, he was like, dad, let’s end this and go home.

00:35:41:14 –> 00:35:42:01
Let’s pull the

00:35:42:01 –> 00:35:43:20
Plug because he’s, he’s a trophy hunter. Let’s

00:35:43:20 –> 00:35:44:19
Pull the plug. I

00:35:44:19 –> 00:35:54:22
Mean, when I knew it was really close to over when I saw seven Fores in the same group. Seven Fores. Have you ever seen seven Fores running together? No.

00:35:54:22 –> 00:35:55:10
I’m pretty sure I,

00:35:55:20 –> 00:36:50:07
Seven of them, I counted ’em and not one of ’em was a three by two. They were all fores. Wow. I’ve never seen more fores in my life. I it was pretty impressive. It it was. That year was, they were prolific. It was just like, wow. They had a great PA year, year and a half ago. It was unbelievable. Having said that. Tough but awesome at the same time. Great experience, but knew that it was the year. I’m not, I’m not blaming the unit. That’s the one thing. I think it was a takeaway for some part of this podcast. Barring Colorado, Colorado’s been mismanaged. Having said that, just, just the year, you gotta say sometimes the unit was tough this year I got screwed because it was tough. I couldn’t control the elements. Not this unit’s terrible. And so you kind of gotta look through that a little bit and say the history says it’s awesome. I had a tough year. There’s no reason I should have had a tough year other than the weather. That’s right.

00:36:50:22 –> 00:37:17:14
You have to be willing to accept that. And we’re, you’ve probably heard on our podcasts and we’re probably gonna talk more about it, but we’re gonna say you have to be willing or not be willing. Be willing to accept. You’re gonna get your butt handed to you sometime and eat tags and just get back after it again. I mean points don’t equal dead animals that meet your expectations every time.

00:37:17:29 –> 00:37:21:26
That’s a hundred percent. They just don’t. That’s my point. That was well put. Well, I,

00:37:21:29 –> 00:37:22:10
I don’t know,

00:37:22:17 –> 00:37:31:07
It’s just because you have 20 points, 10 points, 15 points. And that’s why we’re saying use ’em often in certain places. Some places. The Arizona strip. Yeah.

00:37:31:07 –> 00:37:57:06
If you’ve got max points there, don’t deviate. We get it. Don’t we get it? Deviate it. Utah you’re sitting at 20 to 25 elk points. Okay. We understand you want to use ’em. Arizona, you’re sitting at 23 to five elk points and you’re waiting for a rifle. Okay. You’re knocking on the door. Okay. When you’re in no man’s land or you don’t archery hunt. So you, you, you don’t fall into the archery category in Arizona. You’re either going to lay rifles. Yeah. Late rifles

00:37:57:19 –> 00:37:59:10
Or obscure something or just,

00:37:59:14 –> 00:38:04:23
But just don’t die with a lot of points. Don’t, don’t do it. Use them. Okay. Can use them. While we have

00:38:04:26 –> 00:38:19:23
A good friend of ours, Adam and client went to Arizona this year, 27. Didn’t end up with a giant and it was less than he expected. Tough. Tough. And he, and he had like, I think 23 points I wanna say during,

00:38:19:23 –> 00:38:21:29
During an early muzzle muzzle,

00:38:21:29 –> 00:38:37:26
Early muzzle. And just, but you know, looking back on it, if he were to say he was ecstatic, you know, understood that it was circumstantial, but you could say that’s not worth 23 points. I’m pissed. You know what I mean? And so blame the

00:38:38:08 –> 00:39:02:01
Outer blame whatever you want. And, but he didn’t have that attitude and in some ways could say that that is enough points to entitle you to a three 80 plus bull. No. 400, 400 inch plus bull in a moisture year like this. Right. It just doesn’t, things are tough in the west. Tags are tough to get and everything. Sometimes the stars align on places you don’t expect them to align.

00:39:02:14 –> 00:39:04:05
Yes. My deer hunt

00:39:04:22 –> 00:39:10:11
In Nevada. Yes. Some of your outcomes in Nevada or New Mexico. I mean just weird tag, wonderful

00:39:10:11 –> 00:39:12:04
Experiences. Weird smash and grab.

00:39:12:08 –> 00:39:25:04
Yeah. And that mine, mine this year was like that. You’ve had a couple like that Chris and not, not in, not in 16 and D which some people say is the best dude and where you have to be. Right. I’ve never drawn a tag there. No.

00:39:25:15 –> 00:39:36:19
Well sometimes and I think it’s, it was well put by a good friend of mine, but sometimes the best animals are taken in the worst units or off the wall weird stuff.

00:39:36:19 –> 00:39:37:11
Or mid, mid tier

00:39:37:15 –> 00:39:47:06
Stuff. Weird stuff. Low density stuff. Stuff that doesn’t, isn’t known. It doesn’t have a lot of landowner tags where you got guys that are spending the money with outfitters and pigs.

00:39:47:06 –> 00:39:51:26
Okay. Another case in point, let’s, let’s look at the Utah general season bucks this year.

00:39:52:07 –> 00:39:52:16

00:39:53:03 –> 00:40:08:18
For general season deer, which if you’re to have me write in writing for masses to read about expectations, we wouldn’t say great place to kill a 200 inch buck. Okay. We would not say that. Would never say that. And I’m not saying that

00:40:08:18 –> 00:40:13:28
Now you is stretched to hit 180. Yes. Even in a writeup. Okay. More one 70. But

00:40:13:28 –> 00:40:28:19
How many? One 60 to one. And there’s a lot, there’s hundreds and thousands of tags around the state and it’s been going up and going up. But how many true, I mean Giants killed on general tax issue. Okay. I can’t name ’em all.

00:40:28:25 –> 00:40:39:25
Having said that percentage wise, yes. Still a very low percentage of big deal we’re taking. But unbelievable the very, if you were to just line up the bucks and say where they were killed, they were rivaled

00:40:39:25 –> 00:40:44:10
The strip. If you just looked at the bucks, not per tag issued. We’re not trying to compare ’em.

00:40:44:10 –> 00:40:46:16
They’re top two 50 bucks. I, I mean we get all that. So the

00:40:46:18 –> 00:40:59:20
Obscure or average stuff can produce is what we’re trying to say. Hunter Murphy three, five years and view ’em from what they are. You know, there opportunity hunts with the chance to maybe bring something great home. But, you know,

00:40:59:20 –> 00:41:03:00
Thinking on, let’s just talk about Utah for a minute. There were some changes that happened.

00:41:03:05 –> 00:41:05:11
Yes, there were. And, and where

00:41:05:11 –> 00:41:06:13
We’re monumental changes.

00:41:06:21 –> 00:41:38:22
The reason why we’re prob we, we’ve taken admittedly Jason and I especially taken it for granted more because there’s the tendency, perhaps many of you feel the same way. That a general tag in your own state can’t be as good as a cheap landowner tag or turnback tag in Colorado or some obscure tag in New Mexico you draw or an Arizona archery Kaibab tag or a Nevada tech because they’re all non-res tags and I’m gonna go, you know, spend, the

00:41:38:22 –> 00:41:44:01
Further I travel, the better the dirt, the bigger the day will be. I’m driving by 200 inch deer just because

00:41:44:01 –> 00:42:02:24
That’s Colorado and it’s gotta be better. It isn’t always better. And we’re not, we’re done doing that. We’re gonna make, we’re gonna dig our teeth in, heels in and we’re gonna sink our teeth into something this year. Yeah. Whether we eat a tag or not, it’s fine. Doesn’t mean we expect to kill a 200 inch deer. We don’t. No. But we’re gonna, we’re gonna

00:42:03:07 –> 00:42:06:23
But sometimes you under a little bit more. Yeah. You under value the

00:42:06:23 –> 00:42:07:25
Easy to get stuff and

00:42:07:25 –> 00:42:09:12
The stuff that’s closest to you. Yeah.

00:42:09:21 –> 00:42:19:11
Or Idaho. Or Idaho General occasionally or Wyoming general season tags. Nobody, nobody wants to burn their 10 points on general season tags. Why not?

00:42:19:20 –> 00:42:20:06
That’s right.

00:42:20:27 –> 00:42:26:28
Where else is better in G and h? Where else is better in Wyoming to use your points, you think

00:42:26:28 –> 00:42:35:00
Something that takes non-residents six, seven points to draw and it’s over the counter for residents. The residents probably ought to take note and and hit it.

00:42:35:02 –> 00:42:42:18
Yeah. And, and you know what I mean? Many of them do and many of ’em kill great deer. And that’s kind of our point is if something is producing you,

00:42:42:24 –> 00:42:45:22
Idaho, Oregon residents, you guys, us Utah. Yeah.

00:42:45:25 –> 00:43:04:13
If you have, if something’s producing, it doesn’t matter how many points it takes to draw. If it’s hot right now in producing, get a tag. It doesn’t matter if it takes three and you got seven, if it’s hot in producing, get a tag and go on it. It doesn’t matter. You nothing stays the same. How many times did we say that to each

00:43:04:13 –> 00:43:05:10
Other? Nothing stays the same,

00:43:05:15 –> 00:43:11:29
Doesn’t stay the same deer, nothing stays the same. Elk antelope. You got winters, you got droughts, you’ve got hunting strategy changes,

00:43:12:16 –> 00:43:12:22

00:43:12:25 –> 00:43:35:11
You alluded to some of the changes in Utah that are, are maybe gonna happen this year. Nothing stays the same. No tags are hot right now. They up numbers three to five years it may be down. Yeah. And, and we talked about what potentially we’re not call calling predicting a doom and gloom in Colorado in three or four years. There’s the potential for it to be crushed.

00:43:35:23 –> 00:44:06:04
So I guess part of that is, is guys that are gonna hold their points waiting for 20 21, 20 22, you may or may not be doing the right thing. And that’s, you know, don’t, there’s a lot of guys, I’d just use ’em, I’d use ’em as fast as you can use them. That’s, I, that’s just me. Go often. Use them, get ’em outta the way, get that pressure. I’ve had guys use those points and go, I didn’t have a great hunt, but I feel so much better without the pressure. These points pressurize a guy pressurize you, they can you wanna make the most of your Utah desert.

00:44:06:06 –> 00:44:08:12
Yeah. Yep. And that was a little slight,

00:44:08:12 –> 00:44:09:14
Slight pressure. Not bad.

00:44:09:17 –> 00:44:42:14
It’s, and it’s different because it’s very controlled number of tags on sheep versus, Hey, I burned 23 deer points on a Henry’s tag. You know, and, and then you have, you know, a very limited number of really elite deer on the Henry’s anymore. Yeah. You know, really elite deer. Yeah. And everybody’s after the same deer and that’s gonna come with a lot of pressure versus a sheep tag. But, but you’re right. 23 deer points in Colorado. I don’t want that. I don’t wanna be in that position. No. I’d be praying for point. Point, what was it called? Point banking.

00:44:43:08 –> 00:44:47:07
Oh well we did remember that. Why are you bringing that? That was 10 or 12

00:44:47:16 –> 00:44:55:06
Years ago. They did it one time. They let you, they let you only use the points that it took plus one man and

00:44:55:06 –> 00:45:00:19
Then you got to bank the remaining balance. Yeah. And so if you had 20 and only took 10, you take 10 or before you,

00:45:01:10 –> 00:45:01:18
I don’t

00:45:01:23 –> 00:45:01:26

00:45:02:04 –> 00:45:05:08
Or 10 10, it’d take 10 or 11 points from you. You’d still have 10 or nine. Yeah. You’d

00:45:05:08 –> 00:45:10:29
Apply for one five and you’d come out with six whatever. And so anyway, it was crazy. And, and so yeah.

00:45:10:29 –> 00:45:22:08
Somehow people thought that was better. And that’s, that’s what we’re trying to say. If something’s hot, you have an in on something, you have a buddy that’s hunt it, it’s great. So what if you’re giving up a few points to get it? You’re getting it. Yeah.

00:45:22:08 –> 00:45:29:02
You’re getting it. You’re getting it. Yeah. Utah’s gonna do away with being able to just turn back tags and not have any repercussions the

00:45:29:02 –> 00:45:30:13
Day before the hunt. You’re

00:45:30:13 –> 00:45:41:28
Gonna use your, all your points, not even get one. If you turn it within the 30 days That’s right. To when your hunt starts prior, if it’s more than 30 days, you could get all your points back you had prior to the draw, but you’re not gonna get one for that year. So it’s gonna set you back a year.

00:45:42:05 –> 00:46:02:05
Very similar to Colorado. Basically. It’s alm they Yes. In fact they mirrored mirror that. Yes. They called Colorado. They, they used them as their template Yes. For their proposal. Yeah. 30 days prior. And if you turn it back 30 days prior to hunt, you’re getting your points back that you went into the draw for and not one for the year. Which could set you back on certain hunts five to 10 years.

00:46:02:09 –> 00:46:13:23
But within 30 days, who knows what the weather’s gonna be. Things still happen within the 30 days. Sorry. Sorry. You’re outta luck. Unless you, and it’s, it’s a pretty hard set rule unless you were to do something drastic to your body.

00:46:13:29 –> 00:46:22:10
Yeah. Or a death in immediate family. There are some really extenuating circumstances, but we’ll, we’ll talk about that. Really emphasize that in the February issue

00:46:22:10 –> 00:46:36:26
And Nevada’s gonna come out with same kind of changes. They’re trying to, to adjust the point creep and to just to adjust it a little bit to where we can, you know, they can keep up with it and, and not just let us all

00:46:38:03 –> 00:46:38:18
Scout a unit,

00:46:38:21 –> 00:46:43:16
Be a democratic society and just freaking do whatever we want because we’ve earned it and we decided we

00:46:43:16 –> 00:46:49:13
Deserve it. I’m in the point, I’m in the max point share and I’m gonna draw 10 years in a row and turn it back until like the

00:46:49:13 –> 00:46:52:11
Night before. And then screw they cant reis re they

00:46:52:11 –> 00:46:54:24
Can’t reissue the tag to somebody else. That’s that’s right. And

00:46:54:24 –> 00:46:59:04
On and on. But I deserve it. ’cause I have the most points so I can do it. I want, it’s just those days are becoming,

00:46:59:20 –> 00:47:26:10
Goes back to the things that we said. Nothing stays the same. A point that point change is gonna dramatically change how people apply in Utah this year. The people that have been getting an elk tag or a deer tag every year waiting for the stars to align, waiting for moisture, waiting for the right bull to be, you know, under a tree bedded at three 30 in the afternoon the night before the hunt. And I can drive to the office and be there by five if I need to turn the tag in. But no, I’m gonna keep, I mean those guys, they’re outta luck now.

00:47:26:10 –> 00:47:45:24
They’re outta luck, they’re outta luck. And so anyway, not not fun. I like having options just like the next guy. But at the same time it did need to be addressed and I actually, you know, agree with it. Yeah. And so it’s fine. It’s fine. Although it affects us too. And so anyway, kind of some fun stuff coming down the pipes for everybody. A

00:47:45:24 –> 00:47:53:01
Lot to talk about. I know we’re all over the place now, but we’ll we’ll get specific on these things that we, application

00:47:53:01 –> 00:47:53:16

00:47:53:25 –> 00:47:58:08
As we start talking about these states moving on weekly, couple times a week.

00:47:58:21 –> 00:48:03:16
We wanna encourage you guys out there sending your photos, stories, things like that. We’re

00:48:03:16 –> 00:48:10:18
Looking at right now, the Utah, the Oregon and New Mexico for February. So if you’ve got those right now, send ’em in.

00:48:10:28 –> 00:48:29:19
If you’ve got ’em for other states that we cover in the march, you know, April, may, June, and you want to get off your plate, it’s on your mind. Send it into us now. We’ll, we’ll cat, we, we’ll catalog ’em for later on. But like I said, more imminent, pressing need for those magazines where we cover the state survey, where the application periods open up first. Yeah.

00:48:29:26 –> 00:48:49:20
And we pick cover photos 10 months out at times. So if you wanna be considered, get it in, the quicker you get it in, the better chance you have at something like that. And we do, you know, put on there must prints this month, that month and whatnot. And so anyway, if you get it in late, you know, we always try to fit ’em in, but you just

00:48:49:29 –> 00:48:51:05
Better chance, better chance

00:48:51:14 –> 00:48:52:08
To get it in

00:48:52:09 –> 00:48:56:02
Mean. As of right now, we’ve already got a few covers slated already. Yeah. For the rest of the year,

00:48:56:07 –> 00:48:57:02
If not most of ’em.

00:48:57:02 –> 00:48:59:28
Yeah. So, so get your stuff in early. Yeah.

00:48:59:29 –> 00:49:01:24
Get it in early. Best chance you got,

00:49:03:05 –> 00:49:44:19
Let me give a shout out to one of our advertisers, St. James Sporting Properties. If you’re in the buying or selling of, of hunting ranch or recreational properties in the western United States, Colorado, Idaho, Kansas, New Mexico, Oregon, Utah, or Wyoming. Give the guys at the St. James Sporting properties a call based in Colorado, (970) 596-6089 or sj sporting for St. James sj sporting We know Blaine very avid hunter. Again, if you’re selling or buying ran recreational or hunting properties, give ’em a call.

00:49:45:05 –> 00:50:12:05
I wanna throw a little shout out to our own little hunt giveaway. You know, we’ve, we’re giving away doll sheep, Yukon, moose, Alaska, grizzly, Nevada, Muller, New Mexico, elk, Utah, mountain Lion, Hawaii, and then we have some bonus items. And so we also have an exclusive hunt with us. We’re gonna guide it Nevada, if for referring your buddies, you cannot buy your way in. The only way you can get in is be a member, be a current member, and refer your buddy. The current member that referred him. It’s gonna be in for this. That’s

00:50:12:05 –> 00:50:43:23
Right. Or if you want, it’s, you know, coming up on Christmas time of year. If you wanna purchase a gift subscription to a family member or a, a buddy, maybe he’s still in your magazine and you can’t find it and ’cause he’s taking it from you at work, taking it home. Maybe this is the time. All right. You’re gonna get your chance to be in for a fully guided $20,000 guided package landowner tag included, guided by the epic crew, November 1st to the fifth, 2020. That’s right. We’re we’re, we’re gonna be there. Some, somebody else is gonna be there too. Might as well be you.

00:50:44:17 –> 00:50:46:02
Yep. Do your buddy a favor.

00:50:46:11 –> 00:50:51:07
That’s one of the most premier tags you could have, Chris. That’s

00:50:51:07 –> 00:51:01:05
Right. You’ve, you, well, you and Jason have both hunted the unit that we’re gonna be in and smoked giant deer. 30, what is your 36? 34 and a half. 34 and a half. Might as well be 36.

00:51:02:23 –> 00:51:09:18
Unbelievable. Yep. So, yep. Do your buddy a favor, help him feel like he’s not such a cheapskate and buy him a membership. How about that?

00:51:09:22 –> 00:51:22:19
Anyway, just wanted to, you know, but all the other hunts that hunt specifically, you cannot purchase tickets for it. The only way to get it in, like Jason said, is to refer somebody that joins or if you want to, you can purchase a, a gift

00:51:22:26 –> 00:51:29:14
Subscription for, and you can buy a couple of ’em. It’s not like you one guy, you know, one guy obviously gives you one name in the hat, but if you buy three, you all have three names in the hat. That’s

00:51:29:14 –> 00:51:59:18
Right. So the other hunts you can actually, you know, buy tickets for. They’re all on our [email protected] or they’re obviously in the magazine. Some of the hunts are for this year, some are for next year. Wide variety of them. This is just, we we’re tag junkies ourselves. You know, we apply for some of the other state raffle tags and things like that. Great response to these. We like to maybe throw some hunts in there that a lot of people view as bucket list items, but you know, they’re 20 to $30,000 hunts.

00:52:00:02 –> 00:52:20:26
They’re hunts. We would want to go on ourselves. In fact, some of these you can’t buy your way in and Adam, I mean, we could go on for four hours and I don’t want to, let’s just go real quick. You’ve, these are hunts that are booked two and three years out. We cannot, some of the quality hunting opportunities, I don’t know, I I call it Trump money. The economy’s good and, and the, if you

00:52:20:26 –> 00:52:21:05

00:52:21:05 –> 00:52:23:22
The money sheep, anything, you can’t buy your way in right now.

00:52:23:26 –> 00:52:31:06
Some of these, if you had 20 grand burn your horn in your pocket today and said, I wanna call and buy the hunt. Sorry. Sold out out for 2020. Yeah, you’re two to three years out. Yeah.

00:52:31:23 –> 00:52:32:14
Unbelievable. Dollar

00:52:32:14 –> 00:52:41:26
Sheep putt in Alaska. That was, I killed a great ram there in, you know, 2018 ultimately outfitters, that’s one of those have a hard time getting your way into that hunt.

00:52:42:05 –> 00:53:06:24
New members can choose, they can be in one of these hunts or you can purchase tickets for those. I wanna throw a little shout out to outdoor edge knives. They’re a good, great partner of ours. You know, replaceable blade knife that we’re using on every one of our hunts. They’re sturdy. They’ve got kind of a backbone that you, you know, attach a long razor knife to. Awesome, awesome hunt knife that you can get here at Epic Outdoors. Part of the ticket package.

00:53:06:27 –> 00:53:09:23
Yeah. You spend $200 or more in tickets, you’re gonna get a knife.

00:53:10:02 –> 00:53:16:07
So, and it’s and edged etched with our logo, so it’s awesome. Anything else Chris?

00:53:16:15 –> 00:53:34:07
Yeah, it’s one of those things we always talk about how hard it is anymore to get a tag and how valuable these opportunities are. And it, this is just one more chance to be able to get in on something that gives you a shot to get that once in a lifetime hunt. So definitely get in on those hunts. Let’s,

00:53:34:07 –> 00:53:36:02
Let’s give something away. Yeah.

00:53:36:16 –> 00:53:43:00
We got a whole bunch of pyro putty we can give away. And we just talked about these outdoor edge knives. So let’s, let’s do a couple.

00:53:43:12 –> 00:53:45:28
Yeah. Throw it out there. Chris, what are we gonna do? All

00:53:45:28 –> 00:53:56:11
Right, we’re gonna do, we’ll do three different winners and we’re gonna give you a package of one of our custom outdoor edge knives with our logo on it. And then we’re gonna give you a little pyro, putty kit

00:53:56:11 –> 00:53:59:08
10 of the pyro putty, pyro putty and, and outdoor knives. And I, I’ll

00:53:59:08 –> 00:54:07:29
Plug this. We just did a video on this, but Jeff and I were out hunting, we were hunting with you guys in, in Nevada and we got hiking up. We’re in Nevada, we’re not expecting it to

00:54:07:29 –> 00:54:08:24
Be cold. Oh, this was

00:54:09:02 –> 00:54:09:12

00:54:09:12 –> 00:54:12:11
Late November. Yeah. Five inches of snow. Yeah.

00:54:12:11 –> 00:54:13:17
We’re, we were not expecting

00:54:13:24 –> 00:54:16:24
Snow desert sheep. This is mid to late November. We

00:54:16:24 –> 00:54:23:20
Got up in this pass and it was just bitter cold. The fog moved in and Jeff’s like, I’m building a fire. Well, well everything’s soaked and

00:54:23:27 –> 00:54:25:06
He’s kind of a pyro man. Yeah,

00:54:25:21 –> 00:54:38:10
Yeah. That wasn’t the first fire I saw him build. He starts working on it and, and he used the can of pyro putty, but we were able to get the fire going. Everything is just saturated wet.

00:54:38:16 –> 00:54:42:18
It had rained for two days, three days straight and then snowed five inches

00:54:42:20 –> 00:54:44:26
And wouldn’t have happened without the, the

00:54:45:01 –> 00:55:01:29
Pyro putting No way. Stuff stays burning. It’s not like it’s just a dry piece of, you know, paper towel from your pack at a Ziploc. Yeah. This stuff has a flammable substance within the, you know, you know resin there that you’re lighting up and it burns for, I don’t know, five, 10 minutes at least. It’s

00:55:01:29 –> 00:55:06:08
Been awesome. Anyway, there’s not been a time, we haven’t started a fire that it doesn’t go. Yeah. With

00:55:06:13 –> 00:55:06:25
Pyro putty.

00:55:06:26 –> 00:55:22:12
So with that, we’re gonna give away some packages of pyro putty and Epic Outdoors knives. To do that, we’re gonna have you go to, we’re gonna do a post with this podcast. Go to that post and tag two friends and you’ll be entered to win that package. Okay.

00:55:22:12 –> 00:55:26:07
Post will be on our Epic Outdoors. Epic Outdoors Instagram, right? Yep. So, okay.

00:55:26:08 –> 00:55:27:05
Instagram only

00:55:27:05 –> 00:55:28:17
Details, details on

00:55:28:17 –> 00:55:48:01
There. Anybody that’s listening that doesn’t have Instagram, you should a, it’s a good, it’s great scouting tool. Lots and lots of people post pictures, they shouldn’t. And so you’re gonna see some things and learn some things, so go do it. It’s a free way to learn a few things. And then you can also follow Epic Outdoors. Epic Hunts is our official Instagram and hey, you might win something. We’re even getting away. Ken Trek boots right now.

00:55:48:01 –> 00:55:58:26
Yeah, right now actually. But yeah, go to our Instagram page, epic hunts and look for the post about this podcast. And you can enter there to win.

00:55:59:01 –> 00:56:01:22
How about that? All right, we good? Let’s go eat.