In this episode we dive into Western Big Game management strategies especially in the state of Utah. The last few years, the Mule deer population has been dealt a tough blow. With public opinion and state organization strategies differing, hunters have been frustrated to say the least. We discuss the Muleys Matter Movement, how you can get involved and how to enter your unpunched tag in the drawing for some awesome prizes. You can find all the details about the Muleys Matter Giveaway at!

Disclaimer: this text was produced through an automated transcription service and likely contains errors. Please listen to the original audio for exact content.

01:28:28:01 –> 01:29:47:14
Anything to do with Western big Games. Welcome to the Epic Outdoors Podcast, powered by Under Armour. Well, pr pretty awesome. You know, there’s just, yeah, we’re just kind of coming to the end of that. We’re jumping into some of these late bull hunts. There’s just, you know, some late rifle hunts, Utah, Nevada, other places, you know, air Arizona and whatnot, New Mexico. They’re right in the middle of, of some of what they’ve got going on. And then, you know, they’ve got a, a November hunt timeframe as well, even some December hunts. And so anyway, it’s kind of fun with that. We’re right in the middle of a milder season. We do have this mules matter thing that we’ve got going on. This was, you know, this was interesting. We’ve, we’ve had a ton of donors and we’re gonna, we’re gonna call them out and, and talk to ’em a little bit and, and whatnot. Really appreciate everybody that’s donated to that MUEs matter. Basically, if you’ve, if you’ve got a deer tag and, and we’ve got a list of the states on our website, the MUEs matter website, which is embedded in epic, as well as a standalone, but you can go on and, and check out and register. So, John Logan, you, you basically, if you wanna be entered, you have to register plus send your tag in. It’s a two part process. Yeah.

01:29:47:14 –> 01:30:53:05
We got so many prizes that you need to register for, which prizes you’d like to be in for, and, and you can select all, like I would, you can select all if you want, or, or you can just click the ones that you’re interested in being, and you their name for that drawing. They’re gonna get the prize. If the prize that’s left with the most, that’s the most valuable. Yeah. Right. Yep. And then we’ll just go down the list. There’s only five of them that they want, and they don’t necessarily want a tattoo, or they don’t necessarily want whatever it is. Right. They have starlink. They don’t need a starlink. They might not select that, but they would select everything else. Yep. Right. Yep. Or, or a rifle. There’s all, you know, there’s rifles, bows, all kinds of prizes, and so you select it and then we go from there. But there wasn’t another way to do it, really. Yeah. I think it, it’s, yeah. Good way to do it. And you’ll get your preference on, on prizes too, so, so yeah. Okay. Alright. So we’ve got that. And then you submit your tag, send your tag into us. I don’t know, Josh, should we talk a little bit more about some of our thoughts, the lack of support for certain DWR personnel?

01:30:54:20 –> 01:32:07:23
I just, I, I just guess, I guess what the reason we started this and, and I’m gonna start it off and then I’m gonna, I’m gonna draw off Josh a bit and anybody else that wants to chime in, obviously, but I just, I guess when we started this, it was, you know, it was because we’ve come on, you know, off of a, a heavy long drop, and it’s not necessarily off of it. We just had an incredible year, and then we’re forecasted for another good year of moisture. And so when water equals life here in the west, especially parts of Utah, you know, Nevada, Arizona, New Mexico, let’s just say it, you know, water equals life. And then you could also say, wa water or snow or whatever, winter conditions equal death up north. And so we had this coming off the drought and, and a little bit of excitement, but also a lack of game. There. We have, our populations have struggled, quality has struggled. There’s a number of factors. And, and maybe some departments apathy to cutting tag numbers in a timely fashion. They wanna wait for trends. And there’s certain times that, that makes sense. We need a trend here. We don’t want to just take a, a random sampling and, and what if our samples off, or what if we just didn’t have a good count or whatever.

01:32:08:03 –> 01:33:11:06
And so you don’t want to just jump the gun and, and kneejerk reaction on some things, but there’s sometimes when, you know, it’s staring at you in the face and you know, you should be doing something about it as best you can from a biological management perspective. And so you just can’t beat the weather in many cases. And, and you could categorize this extreme drought in that same thing with winter kill. There’s only so much you can do when they’re all dead. When they die, they die. And, and there’s only so much you can do to combat that. But our perspective is, is maybe over the counter tags don’t make sense. And maybe you should be able to combat it a a bit and help the resources as much you can to, to even out those ebbs and flows. So, you know, you, you, you end up doing a MUEs matter movement, which basically just says, just if you decide not to harvest, you don’t see the buck that you want. Don’t just do a smash and grab on date on the last day to say you, you were successful. And a lot of people, if you buy a tag, you know, the success of a hunt is, did I get one or not? Did you, did you kill a buck?

01:33:11:06 –> 01:34:27:27
Well, yeah, I got one last day was a, you know, not what I wanted, but, but I smashed him and went home or, or you could not smash him, leave him to mature and, and, and, and, and help out where, and, and where the departments maybe were slow to react. It was just our way as sportsmen to negate that a little bit. Yeah. Even if you say no matter what any wildlife agency did with permits, tags, whatever they were doing, increase in decreasing whatever. There was no, we wanted to do something. The thing is, we, we love mule deer. I mean, we love all species, but we, we love mule deer and we wanted to do something ourselves personally. And so it had in a way nothing to do about all that as a group of sportsman. Yeah. As just us. So we decided let’s do something that’s gonna take a whole lot of work, a whole lot of extra stuff and time that we don’t have, and to make absolutely zero money on. And let’s do that. Because that sounded fun. But the reason why we did it, we were, but it was frustration Yeah. Of, of not of, of the slow to react mentality. Yeah. And so we thought this is something that we can do as sportsmen and doesn’t, doesn’t have anything to do with anything they’re doing. Whatever.

01:34:28:01 –> 01:35:43:09
This is something that we can do and we felt like we could have an impact on. And, and who knows, you know, maybe, maybe save some deer, whether it’s some mave deer, maybe buck, whatever, whatever. It’s, we just wanted to try and do something. And then also, once we opened it up, we didn’t go beg for a single donation from anybody. Like the amount of donations of stuff from people that were just like us, that were so excited to say, man, this is awesome. I like this. I want to do something. I mean, people came outta the woodwork that just want to help. Because that’s how much, that’s how much sportsmen, hunters, people want to have resource out there to hunt. And, and is this gonna, Josh, I, is this gonna fix the deer? Absolutely not. Okay. It’s not necessarily gonna fix the deer. No. I think what it does do, it leaves a bunch of deer on the landscape, who knows how many, we don’t know yet. It’s gonna leave a bunch of deer on the landscape to either mature or be bred such as a dough. Right. So like, potential of of us doing that versus not versus otherwise. Yeah. Or it, it, which is helpful, but it’s not gonna totally be a, an entire fix. And so it, it’s just something that we can do. Not saying we’re gonna fix the whole thing, but it also brings a level of awareness.

01:35:43:20 –> 01:36:52:01
People are talking about it. People are, you know, it is like, Hey, this does make sense. All of a sudden it’s like, you know, maybe I didn’t realize the winter was that bad. I didn’t realize the drought affected populations. Like it’s done. And all of a sudden, again, it gives us something to talk about, to continue to bring in awareness to people. Yeah. Is your voice matters. If you care, go to some of these meetings, you know? Yep. And bring it up. Yep. And whether you intentionally or unintentionally kill a deer, whatever. As far as like, what do you mean? I just mean far as, dunno what you’re talking about unintentionally. Whether you willingly don’t kill a buck or you just don’t fill your tag, you can still send it in. I see what you’re in. Yeah. You can still send it in an unpinched tags an unpinched tag. Yeah, exactly. That’s a, it’s a deer. That’s, that’s still out there. And we’re, we’re willing to give you something in return for that we’re willing to reward for, or Yeah. Or the donors are. Yes. And we’re just, we’re just facilitating. We’re helping facilitating, facilitating it, facilitating. I mean, we’ve donated plenty, but we’re just facilitating that. And it’s awesome and it’s fun. Yep. It’s fun for us to do in, in a time that’s somewhat trying for Mulder. It is honestly the, the toughest period of time for Mulder to exist.

01:36:52:28 –> 01:37:58:13
It feels like It really is. It really is. It’s, and I think it’s been, it’s very extremely noticeable. I don’t think any of us knew. Okay, yeah. We got a bad antler. ’cause we, let’s face it, we, we predominantly look at weather and think antler growth predominantly. Well, at the same time, if you’re having bad antler growth, you’re having reduced v survival in the same thing. Like they really do go hand in hand. So I think we just, ah, that’s another bad animal year. Let’s ride it off. Well, no, there’s probably several thousand deer that no, didn’t make it this year that aren’t going to be there next year. And then again the next year, those other several thousand. So, and they’re easier to predate on because they’re congregated water because it’s a drought year, or they just died because they couldn’t exist through the snow conditions. You know what I mean? And icy conditions that persisted and never gave up. Yeah. Right. So like mean, that’s, yeah. And so those are hard to quantify too. It’s hard to quantify why, why is this population dying and gone? You know? Like why is it a fourth of what it once was? And, and yeah, we had some dry years, but there were still springs to water out. Like I don’t quite, you know what I mean? Or there was feed, maybe it wasn’t premium, but there was feed.

01:37:58:27 –> 01:39:03:11
But there’s so many different variables that go into it. Maybe even intangibles, you know, fond weights, body conditions of those, all, all kinds of things predation on top of all that. There’s a hundred different things. And so then you get, you do have some people that are in power and they go and, and make it to where we can kill, you know, Utah’s never been done before, but you don’t necessarily have to live a lion tag to kill a lion. And, and, and you know, there’s a lot of people that don’t agree with it, and there’s a lot of people that agree with it. But the bottom line is, is there was people in powerful situations that did not come from the DWR division of Wildlife Resources. There’s people with powerful people that decided to do something. Try something. Yeah. Right? Yep. And, and maybe it didn’t go through the right, what most people would call a correct channel or a correct procedure, whatever, maybe it goes through the legislature or whatever, but people are just, there need to be doing something. We need to be more proactive as a division agency, people in general industry. And so anyway, that’s all we can do. Our little corner of the world, we do a MUEs matter.

01:39:03:26 –> 01:40:05:26
Well then we hear through the grapevine and you, you know, this is to be expected that, you know, maybe certain biologists say, well, we’re gonna go ahead and double down and give more tax just because these guys think they’re gonna make a difference. And they’re not. And they, they care about two, you know, they’re trophy hunters and they don’t care about the resource. And we’re gonna, we just think, you know, if a if a buck is born whenever he’s killed throughout his life is fine and we need to just go ahead and make sure that happens. You know? ’cause the longer he’s alive, the longer he’s ed on by maybe a lion or something like that. And so they wanna go ahead and issue more tags to thwart thees matter movement. I, I guess I have a problem with that, Josh. Oh, I do too. Yep. I do too. Because it’s, it’s pretty stupid, honestly. It’s pretty immature. It, that’s probably someone who’s just graduated college and in their twenties and thinks they know everything, know something, you know, they went to college and they learned something and, and they, they lack a lot of real world experience. And that’s probably someone that’s similar to that, I would think. I would think. And then, and then, and maybe also just not understanding the public, you know, the, the public’s perception on some of this.

01:40:05:26 –> 01:41:07:09
And like, you kind of, you, you work for the sportsman, you know what I mean? There’s a process and for you to just take exception to something we’re doing to, and that would be a change in the way you manage wildlife or maybe just your opinion. And of course it’s gotta go through your superior and it’s gotta go on down the chain or whatever. But it would be easy for a division agency to, to ratify those quota recommendations. You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. And so you did, you, you won maybe on, on your unit. You went ahead and issued more tags, took toward the mules matter movement. You know what I mean? Which just seems ridiculous because if it, it’s almost like well do, do you even, like, do you even like the resource that you’re trying to manage? You know, like we’re, we’re just trying to save some beer help. They like it, they just don’t like us. It’s benefited because, or they don’t like the sportsman general. Exactly. That’s just it, it’s a personal thing, but it’s like we’re, we’re literally trying to help you get to your buck to dough ratio so that we can increase tax. And if your buck to dough ratio’s good, and your quality’s good, and the sportsmen are happy with you Yeah. Wouldn’t that help you? What’s wrong with that? Yeah. I don’t get it. Yeah. Wouldn’t you be happy with that?

01:41:07:09 –> 01:42:21:07
Because, because in your mind, you know, you are right and they’re wrong. And that’s all there is to it. That’s what it kind of feels like. So yeah, there’s some interesting, there’s gonna be some interesting things happen and some, and potentially interesting proposals on game management. And I think, and same thing with the technology and, and you know, the muzz order thing. And, and there’s a hundred other things going on. And I think people are, people, division agencies, whatever are hypersensitive when deer are struggling and deer seem to be struggling pretty regularly. They’re, everything wants to kill ’em. I want to kill ’em. Okay. Yeah. Lions want to eat ’em, coyotes want to eat ’em. Bobcats wanna eat ’em, bears want to eat ’em. They’re, they’re just, they’re like, elk wanna kill ’em? They’re like, they’re Yeah. Where elk do good deer don’t. So we’re, I mean, everything feeds on mule deer. Mule deer are the big rabbit. Yeah, yeah. For sure. They’re a rabbit with more meat and it actually tastes good. Yeah. And so, you know, that’s, it feels like everything feeds off of mule deer. And when mule deer are doing good, everything’s doing good, predators are doing good, we’re doing good. Division agencies are doing good. They’re issued, they’re able to issue tens of thousands of tags, maybe even more tens of thousands more than normal by having wet years and good management practices.

01:42:21:12 –> 01:43:40:29
And so I just struggle, I think that, that some of these smart people that are in powerful positions, other than the division agencies, okay. People that we know who are out there, who are making a significant impact, I think sometimes their energy could be better spent on coming up with new landowner tag programs or landowner compensation programs. So we, these landowners don’t, aren’t able to have the dose killed just because they ate some of their alfalfa. And I understand, I get it. But, but the, but the wildlife isn’t owned by the landowners. And, but at the same time, they have to deal with landowner, wildlife conflicts. And Josh, you’ve dealt with a lot of this. Oh yeah. But I just, I think there’s a way to compensate landowners, so by the private sector where they’re making their landowner tags transferable and, and, and able to sell. And so, you know, even on a general unit here in Utah, which you can’t do necessarily, well may what if it was transferable in a, in a private sector, you and I, the industry could purchase those and, and bypass the draw or whatever. And a landowner’s like, ah, I, I guess I don’t mind having a few more dough on my property instead of saying, kill ’em all. They’re eating me outta house and home. Yeah. And then division agencies go and kill ’em. And I know it’s easier said than done.

01:43:41:06 –> 01:44:34:03
I just think there’s some smart people in powerful spots that could make a difference. Something, something could be done with that, because I’m gonna be straight up straight upon us. And it was awfully frustrating. And, and a lot of it with a lot of landowners, and I’m not saying they’re all this way, but there were a lot that they didn’t like the deer, because if they don’t like the deer eating their alfalfa, then they don’t get their check for their kids’ Christmas. Meaning from what, where did that check come from? From the Division of Wildlife? Because be, and I, and like I said, that’s just, that’s just the honest nature of it. Some of them, there is a program out there that says, okay, if I have these deer on my place, I can actually get paid to have them there. But, but then I’m gonna complain. I have to be, I have to be. So give me the check, but get the rid of the deal. I have to be terrible. I have to be mean. I have to be a thorn into the division side in order to get that check. So I’m gonna have to do that every, every year. I literally had talked to landowners before that said something about like, ah, that’s my Disneyland check, you know? Yeah. Take my kids to Disneyland every year. Yeah.

01:44:34:15 –> 01:45:38:11
And it’s that when you’re, when and when you’re a biologist trying to help thinking that you’re actually trying to help them to reduce the impacts from the stuff that they’re losing. And it’s just, it doesn’t really matter in some ways. It’s their extra check, it’s their extra money on the year. Yeah. And it’s the deer Yeah. That are ones that are paying for it. And you’re, you’re doubling up and stacking up deer, trying to get ’em off of there. Whatever it does, it does get hard. So biologists are in a hard spot as far as that goes. But definitely it’s not about tags and whether we increase tags this year or decrease tags this year. Like we, we gotta do something to help deer. And that’s quick killing. I think quick, we could quit. We got the meales matter thing going. Okay. And we’ve got some, you know, there’s other, other things that are being looked at, but we, we should quick kill and deprecating those. Yeah. You know what don’t you think? I mean, we need to, we, we’ve got figure out a way. We need a high fence on 56 right here out of town. Yeah. We need a high fence with, with with the bridges, you know, the wildlife crossings. Yeah. That they’re working in other places. And so, and we’ve done worked on the scon and, and, and had the wildlife crossings.

01:45:38:25 –> 01:46:46:15
I saw, I just saw a thing today that they were actually a, a news report, a second one. It was the second one on Utah Mule there at YI don’t know, there was just one the other day on KSL. And this one was talking about how I, I don’t remember the year, but they did a study and they said something like 10,000 deer got killed on the, on the highways and stuff. And they estimate like 20,000 deer get killed during the hunting season. And it’s like, we’re worried about 1500 permits on the unit. We go out how we see dead deer. Dead dose. Yeah. Dead dose. Yeah. I mean, okay. And she has twins. They have twins, whatever. On, on every night. Yeah. Every night. And, and I’m just saying that that would be Pine Valley, one of the major sources of contention. Yeah. And, and the, and the lack of deer, which there’s, there’s there, when you go out compared to Nevada, I think there’s a lot of deer. Yeah. But, but having said that, there, there’s a fourth or a fifth of what there should be or could be. Yes. And, and if you want that, you know, a good way to get that is to take care of your dough. Take care of your dough when they come to the winter range in these general units and, and not just go wipe ’em out because they’re creating this damage.

01:46:47:06 –> 01:47:55:19
Maybe make it to where landowners are okay with them. And, and Matt might be a slight tweak in the program and a land tech program that might help. It might not fix everything, but it just might help. Because in a lot of states, someone like Nevada, they want the deer there. Oh, we got landowners making, making cultivated properties for the landowner tags. They’re mad when their counts are low. They’re mad. Yeah. They’re, they’re, they’re, I wish I would’ve five more. They’re doing everything they can to increase their numbers one way or another. They don’t care how it happens. Maybe that would, that would be all right. Yeah. And when the quality’s better because of a, maybe muley matter was a small part of that, but maybe when the quality’s better, the tags are worth more. When the tags are worth more thelens want more of them. When thelens want war of them, they’re not gonna kill those precious toes, which that in turn all benefits a brown bean eater from Minville. Right. Like, whoa. Like literally, like how is that gonna affect Logan? It trickles, it trickles all the way down to that. Right. Like it, he killed a deer on the last day. Well, because he can’t get into the meal. Can you, can we, can we participate in the meales matter? I was told no. I was told the people that can’t that work here. What about my spouse? You work here, you can’t.

01:47:57:25 –> 01:49:08:23
Good grief. Well, this is not about profit or, or membership drives. This is strictly about saving, dear. So anyway. And that’s, we’re all about giving That’s right. To what muley matter. So Yeah. Sorry. That’s why we pay, we pay you to work on it and we lose money. But even if you could’ve participated and you can’t, but even if you were to participate, you would’ve still smashed that boat. Oh, a hundred percent. That’s that’s the idea of it. Yeah. Yeah. That’s the idea of it is not to, if you want that deer, like you should absolutely harvest a hundred percent. It’s just at the, it’s just to stop a guy from just se just filling his tag because he could. That’s all it is. I think also, like, I’ll get on a soapbox. It’s, even if it has no impact, it creates awareness for let, let’s say a kid. Right. And it gives them a reward for making a choice to pass something. Yeah. And so it, it may be just right now this, but, but it, it creates awareness that I can let something walk and I get a little bit of satisfaction outta that. And that could last the rest of his lifetime. And maybe it’s a learned, it’s a learned, I think it’s a learned skill to know how to pass something. Yeah. Nowadays, you know what I mean? Yeah.

01:49:08:23 –> 01:50:15:11
Like a 14-year-old kid, or 24-year-old kid walks out there, you see an 18 inch three point or whatever. You get excited to see a deer. And it’s, and it’s telling people that there’s, it’s okay to do it. There’s pride, right. There’s pride in having an un punch tag. Right. Where normally people are like, did you get your book? No, I didn’t. Okay. That guy, he, he sucks. I’m not that good a hunter. Well, and it’s, and it’s not that, it’s not, there’s actually pride in not filling a tag at times. Yeah. And it’s hard ’cause when you spend thousands of dollars and you drive to Colorado, and this isn’t just a Utah thing. Like when you drive to Colorado, I’ve drive to Nevada on the daily drive. Yeah. Driving to Nevada early 60 days in a row, whatever, Josh, 63. There’s, there’s a little bit of something that says, I need to make this worth it. You know? Yeah. Right. In, in the back of your mind, there is a lot of guys. And so a lot of guys struggle and you go do that and you spend all this money and, and if you don’t come home with something, your kids, your wife, your neighbor, everybody thinks that maybe you’re loser, whatever they don’t like, it doesn’t matter. Your kids can do that. You don’t have faith in you anymore. Yeah. You don’t. Dad like, yeah, we’re gonna kill something.

01:50:15:11 –> 01:51:36:26
Hey, hey, you throw it out there at 1100, lemme show you what’s up. This is not about just smashing something. Right. So, so yeah. There’s, there’s some of that that you can, you don’t have to kill something. You’re, you’re still okay. And this helps, like John said, to bring that awareness like, hey, maybe you know, it’s okay. And this year, especially if you win a gun, if you win whatever John did, you freehand that. That’s our logo, our skull from our You freehanded that just sitting here. Yeah. You have skills dude. Have you ever done, I made our logo. Have you ever done any And I drew it. Any painting or, or I mean, that’s a stencil. What do you call these? You know, I, I went to art school, so I didn’t know that written necessarily. Oh. I haven’t paid attention. I did too. But I was just the nude model. They always wanted, like, we need something. We need a, a heavy detail on shading and shadows and crevices. I’m a significant human in the art world. Yeah. Got some mustache. Go ahead. Put the detail in the mustache. Like there’s lots of rolls and folds to, to shadow around. So good grief. Alright. Anybody, anybody that gets this right. Got a for the quarters. It’s gonna take me a minute. Lemme get there. Okay. I, this went off the rail. Yeah. I don’t think that we said anything though that she can delete.

01:51:37:11 –> 01:52:49:18
No, no. I think we’re still good still pt. Maybe we’re solid cut. I think we’re solid. Even the bean eater. Jeez. We’re good. Miners will sandwiches for lunch. Right, right. Alright. Well I just think, I think there’s powerful people that, that are in the position to help the, and, and I just see the, I wish we could have, Deon has, he, he, he has a significant opinion as we all do, Adam. It’s not here. Why it’s not here. Everybody has a significant opinion. Devin, I know the biggest, one of the biggest places that we could make a huge difference. Somebody could, they don’t want to hear from us necessarily, but somebody could is a, is a landowner type type program or working with landowners too. ’cause right now, Josh, there’s plenty of those that are being smashed because they’re deprecating. Yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? And, but it’s, it’s, it’s not as bad as what it was. You know, back, back when I was a biologist, we had a, because there’s less significant amount of deer, Josh, we have a significant amount of, when you have, there’s no deer to kill it anymore. And don’t get me wrong, there are, there were some landowners that had some legitimate concerns. I mean, you roll up and a dude’s got 700 deer in his alfalfa and he’s not getting compensated whatsoever. And he’s, yeah.

01:52:49:18 –> 01:53:40:23
And he’s trying to save, save some of that like last cop cow cows that are gonna come off the mountain and that’s free feed for him for a month. He’s not gonna have to go out and feed it. Totally understand that. They’ll push ’em in there. Like it’s, that’s understandable. That’s, that’s, that’s when programs like this are very beneficial so that we don’t have to go kill all 700 of those dolls. We can say, Hey, look here, you’re being compensated for ’em. Please let ’em live so that they can continue to live because then we go kill ’em all and then we could run into five years of straight drought. It’s significant. And I, you know, just this year I’ve noticed a lot like antelope. There’s, I’ve, we’ve, I’ve been hunting in some areas that I haven’t hunted before with some of the tags that my kids have had and that sort of thing. And I was anticipating seeing all kinds of antelope. I had a friend that had an antelope tag and I like, oh sweet, I can help find him. Maybe find him a buck while I’m out here and give him some points or whatever. No, I didn’t see any antelope. And you’re coming back to the office early, you’re like, Hey, good luck to you. Yeah, I got some, I got some emails down. Yeah, yeah.

01:53:41:04 –> 01:54:54:12
You know, it’s, it’s not just deer, it’s elk, it’s antelope, it’s everything that, like we’ve, we’ve struggled for the last five years here in southern Utah for sure with the drought. And I think the drought has a lot bigger impacts than anything else in this state for us. We’ll, we’ll get a bad winter, but usually bad winters are followed by good moisture. And so the year, if you don’t have another bad winter for another five years, it’s just that one bad winter. But when we get significant drought for years on end, it’s, it’s more significant than anything else for us. I think the local biologists, yeah, they’re not the final say and they, and they can say, oh, this is just my recommendation and whatnot. But heavily, the division heavily relies on what the local biologists say. And, and you know, some of these boards and racks and whatnot are made up of, you know, division appointed people. And so you end up with this whole movement, you know, from a, from a, you know, maybe A-A-D-W-R in all the states, you know, A DWR slant and whatnot. And so I think it makes it, I think it, there’s, it makes a difference on, on who the, who the biologists are and what they think and just don’t wanna be at odds with them, I guess. Yeah. You know. Well, and there’s a significance, like in science, A buck’s a buck a buck.

01:54:54:23 –> 01:55:54:01
So he doesn’t need to be a four point, he doesn’t need to be eight years old. He doesn’t need to be a six point. He just needs to be able to breed a dough. And that can occur as a yearling if he wants to. Really. So it doesn’t, there’s, and then you start seeing a lot of the science that says, well, CW D’S passed in mature deer. And it’s not just Utah, it’s a, it’s all of our surrounding states. And so it literally is a war on like mature deer. It’s a war I’ve, it’s a war on mature deer. Like there’s absolute no value, a mature buck. And you could say, well we have a, a harder condensed rutt when there’s mature deer, you know, mature bucks and that’s good for a population. And then, but then they’ll fight back and say, eh, now conclusive evidence to Yeah. The, a mature buck will eat twice as much as a yearling buck, all that kind. So then they say, well then that’s twice as much then that should be a mom and a baby eaten. And so literally like a lot of, a lot of western states, a lot of, of the scientific data, a lot of that stuff is, it literally is a kind of a war on mature bucks. Like having a mature animal in your species isn’t, doesn’t benefit. That’s what they’re their, their contention. The landscape. Yeah.

01:55:54:21 –> 01:56:52:21
Honestly, in in any, any species, whether it’s sheep, ’cause then it’s just an old sheep that dies, well, he just died. Well, they feel like died a waste. That was a waste waste of space. That was a waste deer. Well, every deer hoofs up in the back of trucks. Some guy just died with his points instead of that he could have killed that ram or whatever. So there’s no reason have, could have been killed as a spike. It, it literally could like a spike out instead of a branch bull mean kill ’em all as spikes. They, there’s generally to, there’s not a big love of mature animals in a lot of state agencies. There’s just not because Yeah. They don’t look at it and see it. So that’s how management’s, that’s how management, and I think there’s a, I think there’s a disconnect between the public and state agencies in, you know, with different theories and, and perceptions and what the public wants. And in theory the, you know, the division answers to the public to a degree, but it just feels like there’s a, a huge disconnect. That’s all. And we don’t, and we don’t think that every animal should reach the age of eight. Like that’s, that’s not, I don’t think we need to make for, I don’t think the entire state needs to be a pons experience. Heck no. We don’t want that.

01:56:53:05 –> 01:57:56:07
I like, I actually like, I actually like the system absolute in Utah. I don’t think the system’s necessarily broken. It’s not, there’s nothing wrong with it. I, I think, I think when a guy here, the residents have to choose, right? We have to choose deer, elk, and antelope on say our, our limited entry type options, our premium limited entry type option. But we can all do a general deer. Yeah. We could all do a general deer. So we can choose an elk and a general deer. We can choose antelope and a general deer or something like that. I don’t think that’s necessarily a bad system. You know, and there’s two different point systems. So you can do a limited entry deer and a general deer. And, and so I don’t, I don’t think, I think it’s unique. It’s very unique considering other states and provides lots of opportunity. I just think the, the management style and, and the, you know, waiting for a trend to, you know, we know we had this major drought. We know we have a fourth of the deer on the landscape, but we want to increase tags because we had an, an abnormal amount of, you know, fawns live this year. We had a, you know, our our, our survival rate was, was better than expected.

01:57:56:20 –> 01:59:11:06
And so we want to just, you know, a knee-jerk reaction instead of waiting for a trend there, we want a knee-jerk reaction to go ahead and increase tax even though 90% of the public are vocal and that they, they didn’t want to increase tax. I just think there’s a disconnect between the public and the division at times and, and that that creates, you know, major contention, which then you’ve got powerful people wanting to change the entire Yeah. System. And I don’t know if the system’s broke necessarily. I just think we need to be, maybe we need to work on tag numbers and save and do, and a few of these other projects, landowner conflicts high. You know, I’d like to see Les dead Deere on 56. Yeah, exactly. You know what I Exactly. And one of the biggest sources of contention in the entire state. Yeah. Here on General Pine as just a heads up, you’re gonna be seeing here in a couple weeks. There’s some wild stuff gonna be coming down the path. All because they want to fix the deer because, because they wanna fix the deer. There’s some guys that are fed up and they’re the guys that have power and then they push power on people that might be, let’s say at will, whatever. And so they, and of forcing the general public to, you know, to look at some of this and potentially adhere to a new, you know, programs.

01:59:11:09 –> 02:00:19:29
I, I would management programs that they didn’t ask for, they might be fine over there on the other side of the state or the other side of the southern region. They might be fine, but because we’re mad at, at, at, at droughts and, and maybe the apathy of, of, of the division to, to react, then we’re gonna go around ’em and we’re gonna come up with new programs. Yeah. There’s gonna be some significant changes. I imagine we’re gonna go over those when that stuff comes out, when we see the final recommendations because it could severely impact your deer hunt every year. The unit you’ve been applying for, you may have to go buy an at lateral. I don’t know how deep it’s gonna go. If you want near in Utah, who knows? Because there’s, I’m gonna, I’m gonna, although it’s gonna be fun, hey, bring it. Let’s go, let’s go, let’s go do some weird stuff. Let’s go’s you said it, let’s use some weird weapon ties at lateral and loin cloth, just saying, well, I mean that’s for your art school. John. John. John. If you were in art school and, and they said you’re gonna be drawing a Joshua Pollock today. Did you ever have to do the whole nude thing in the new, did you ever have to draw a nude Dude? I didn’t. I you stopped that. That’s in the master’s program. No, I don’t, I don’t know.

02:00:19:29 –> 02:01:37:17
They, for some reason they, they chose female models. I don’t know. Anyway. Oh, did you have to draw a new check? Yeah. Oh, art school. Yeah, man, Josh are, do you have an art major? No, I don’t. But I, i, as much time as I spend in that art class, shoulda had good stuff. All right, well it’s kind of fun. All we’re saying is, is MUEs matter and there’s some, you know, it’s just a fun lightweight l light conversation piece just to, you know, just lets us talk about some things, give away some prizes for saving a few deer. And it’s probably the only thing we can do here in the private sector, you know, mean we, we have an opinion here and there, but nobody caress about it. People ha having a, you know, an adverse reaction every time we talk about some of this stuff we’ve, you know, compromised someone, someone right now just turned the podcast off, just so you know. No, when we started talking about it. Well, oh. So I guarantee you, I guarantee there’s, they know it’s recorded and in a weak moment they’re gonna go back and listen. Maybe even on company time, state time. Yeah. Driving around. They’re in the state truck right now. Picking up, talking about how dumb we are. Whatever, whatever. I just wanna see mature. A few more mature here. Well, and Muley matter, we have a section for bombs on moms. Yeah.

02:01:37:17 –> 02:03:04:15
Like, it’s not just about bucks either. No. Alright. The whole population just about bucks. So we’re gonna divvy up the prizes too. We’ve had a few questions. We’re gonna divvy up the prizes. We’re gonna see in percentage wise to the tags sent into the, sent into here at Epic Outdoors. So, you know, percentage wise does matter. Every dough matters and, and Bucks matter too. And so if you send in tags based on general or limited entry and then, and then the dough tags and the, and the limited entry buck tags, then we’ll divvy up those in relation to the, to the number of tags we, we have submitted. And so anyway, that’s how we’re gonna do it. More details will be coming. It’s kind of fun. There’s a lot of hunts happening right now and we’ve already had quite a few submissions, but we know a lot more submissions are coming as the rifle hunts are just getting started. Generally hunt rifle deer in October, November, and they usually end right at the end of November. There’s a few hunts that’ll be wrapping up, but nevertheless, go online, submit it as as the Hunts Fi or finish out. And if you’re not successful and you want to, and, and you want a free entry while you’d go and you’d register online, epic, you can go to the Meales Matter website from there. And then you need to submit your tag.

02:03:04:20 –> 02:04:32:00
We’ve gotta see it here in the office and we’re gonna put ’em in a bin and roll it around and give out some prizes. So we appreciate everybody that’s gonna, that is participating in that. We also, you know, both from the hunter’s perspective as well as the donor perspective, wanna throw a little shout out to St. James Sporting properties. Super good people there. SJ sporting Blaine St. James, personal friend, I’m not working with him necessarily ’cause he’s a personal friend. He runs a great business. He’s a hunter himself, killed some great animals and looks at sporting properties, properties in general from an outdoors man’s perspective and, and can enlighten you whether you’re selling or buying properties. He’s very well connected. Done it for many, many years as, as his main focus and, and just, just is really good at it. So anyway, we endorse him a hundred percent He’s also got great employees and, and just runs a great business. Proud of him and and grateful to be, grateful to be associated with him. Kind of fun to just kick around on his site, see what’s available, see the, yeah. You know, dream a little bit, even if it’s outta your price range. It’s kind of fun. We need to have an epic property. Yeah. Yeah, we do that. We work with Blaine to acquire to acquire. That’d be awesome. We manage it the way we want. Save the doughs, save the bucks.

02:04:32:24 –> 02:05:37:26
How about a non-hunting property? It’s, it’s a buck knife. It’s just hunt only. I just wanna, I just, I wanna grow, I wanna grow a, a low, a low fence. 300 inch on a Epic property. Well just to do that we need porcupines so we need to start. There you go. Boost that down. We also wanna thank phone scope, chest and up there from the potentially proposed finger of Nevada. Maybe it’s coming. What do you mean Beaver County? Yeah, everything good comes from Beaver County. Yeah. There in Logan Beaver County’s right. He’s made some awesome stuff. Be able to throw, throw cases on your phone, put on any optic you want. I mean, he’s got stuff for GoPros. Anything you need, I mean he’s got it there. He can manufacture it for you. That way you can get some video of anything you might see out in the woods. Maybe even take a dark class. I don’t know. You might see something. It’s that low offense 300 entry. But go to phone, check ’em out. They, it’s pretty awesome. You go on there and you can actually, there’s a custom builder so you can make sure you can get a case for the exact phone you have and, and a portion an adapter for the optic that you have. It’s, it’s pretty awesome.

02:05:37:29 –> 02:06:46:20
So we should give away a free phone scope to, to people just to embarrass Justin to go on to at phone scope P-H-O-N-E-S-K-O-P-E on Instagram. And just put like a comment, Justin rolls or something like that just to embarrass him. Free phone scope for anybody that goes, goes on phone scopes Instagram and says Justin and rules hashtag Justin and rules. Do you go look at that hashtag and see if it’s taken. Justin and rules are, oh you gotta be careful. I love teasing Justin. Yeah, be careful. Might be something we don’t know about. Be careful. But I highlight teasing him. They’re a very innovative family and just, you know, good friends. Is it No results on Justin rules. We’re set. Justin rules. C-H-E-S-T-O-N rules. R-U-L-E-S do a hashtag cheston rules on a, on a phone scope on the phone scope account. We’ll go look at that. We’ll throw, we’ll give you, maybe we’ll give away a few of ’em. I don’t know. We all, we got ’em here in house and we can do ’em custom to your phone. So anyway, we’ve got ways to do that credit. One of the cool features is you just have your one phone case and then you have an adapter that can put on your binos and one on your, one on your spotting scope. And so you just, you can my BTX switch back forth.

02:06:46:24 –> 02:08:06:03
Of course I didn’t see anything to BTX, which I could have, but you could have. Yeah, I could have. Yeah. So same, same my kids dropping that coyo 900 yards. They could have, they could have phone scoped it. Yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. Alright. Phone scope is also a donor to the muley matter giveaway too. That’s awesome. I’m gonna put that out. They’re really supportive of that. So, sweet. Are we doing chest and rules? I’m just, just like, why not? Yeah. Okay. So how do they enter for chest and rules? Yep. So you’re gonna go online and comment on any post on the phone scope page, hashtag chest and rules. C-H-E-S-T-O-N-R-U-L-E-S. And then if you wanna make it easy on us, give us a tag. Epic hunts in that, in that comment, or we’ll just go search through the hashtag and find it. So the phone scope page on Instagram? Yep. Phone scope page on Instagram at phone scope. P-H-O-N-E-S-K-O-P-E. Okay. Okay. Justin Rules, Justin and rules. Just, hey, he, he’s one of the main founders. Their family came up with the idea, kind of, kind of a, the entire industry, the entire videography industry. Justin’s a good dude. We really like his family and appreciate them and their support and their partnership with us here at Epic Outdoors. I also wanna throw a shout out to Red Rock Precision that came out with a, a new rifle, a mountain hunter rifle.

02:08:06:09 –> 02:09:33:17
Anyway, I’ve got one, one of the first two or three that were built and it’s awesome. It’s incredible. Been to the range. Shot a thousand yards with it, huh? Oh yeah. Pretty odd. You were there. Oh, it’s legit. It’s, it’s legit. And so anyway, I got it in a seven PRC. They, they loaded ACU coupons. I’m an AON guy. You, I, it’s like the first loaded ACU coupons I’ve seen for the, for the seven PC seven prcs. A relatively new caliber. And, and so, you know, a lot of times we were, we were buying box ammo for ’em in different, in different rifles, different seven PRCS and, and whatnot in a like a 1 75 ELDX or whatever. And they, and they, they’ve performed killed plenty of game, but I’m just, I like an Aon, I said, Hey, let’s load up Aons. It’s unbelievable. It’s a tack driver shooting one 60 aons for the seven PRC. Just a great rifle. Has all kinds of integrated features. Has a rail on the stock, you know, removable eyelets for, for your sling and also has a archis built into it so you can slap it on a tripod. Thought about everything and I topped it with a Z eight. I swirl Z eight i stupid. It’s got integrated rail system on it. Just everything about it is state of the art. And so, anyway, proud to have it.

02:09:34:08 –> 02:10:33:08
Got it here, went out, shot it and it’s in my truck right now. So back up just a little bit on you shot it. How many shots did it take you to be within like an inch at 725 yards. The first, the first shot, one shot and we shot again. And it was stupid. The quality of the gun speaks to that. Yeah, right. Well those guys that, yeah, they, I, I sent ’em a Z eight I how a Z eight I here and he’s like, what scope you want? I said, I’ll send you one. I’ve got it right here. Pulled it off another rifle. So anyway, sent it to him and, and they put it on, went out, shot it. They they built it, shot it, five boxes of ammo, show up with the rifle and they said it’s, it’s ready to go. It’s dialed here. By the way, here’s what the data you need to put in your range fighter for these new smart range fighters. They’re, they’re dumb. Those smart range fighters are dumb. But anyway, if you wanna see ’em, if you wanna see ’em, shoot those first couple of shots. A little bit more of that rifle, the video’s on our Instagram. Yeah. Yep. Anyway, so yeah, I get it.

02:10:33:24 –> 02:11:52:15
Put that, Stu put that data in my smart range finder, which a lot of these range finders they’ll take in temperature angle all basically you just hit it tells you what to dial to, you dial to it and you squeeze the trigger. You might have to adjust for wind depending on your situation. But anyway, yeah, it was as unbelievable. Went out to the range and geez, it just makes a killer out of a guy except for can’t find anything to kill. ’cause Neely’s mattered. I tried to be selective, but, and then Josh hammers me for it. ’cause I suck at hunting. Right, Josh, go ahead. Just say it. Our, our our model of the year. Go ahead. You do not, you do not our our art model of the year. Joshua Pollock. I was like the final boss on, on any video game, you know, I was like the final exam. That’s when they’d bring me in. Okay, y’all think you’re good? Yeah. Y’all think you’re good? Yeah. Here you go. Yeah, if you can draw this, you get an A. Oh man, these are visuals. I’ll never be able. It’s like you said, when you’re walking down the little piglet aisle, you’re welcome. Like, these are visuals I’ll never get out of my mind. But hey, we’ve also talked about it enough. It’s impossible to cut otherwise it’s integrated. Podcast does not make sense. But now you guys know why Jan hates me.

02:11:52:22 –> 02:13:12:24
No, you make editing difficult. All right everybody. Well, good luck out there. There’s a lot of hunting going. We haven’t had a podcast. I, I was, I was getting on Logan. I was like, these, these podcasts aren’t showing up on, on my feet. Like, where, where are these podcasts at? And he goes, boss, every podcast we’ve done is on there. I’m like, oh, it’s just been a little while. We need to go to the podcast room. It’s been a month. I think it’s the longest stint since we’ve done a podcast. Yeah. It’s just telling you we’ve had a lot of hunts. They’ve come and gone fast and furious. Most of ’em haven’t ended. Happily Bronson’s in the field working his guts out, you know, hunting sheep and, and different things. And so, you know, Devon’s up in Nevada right now, Wyatt Wyatt’s got a new kid, but he just came off of a, of a, an extensive brown bear hunt that I can’t wait to talk about on the podcast. And so anyway, everybody’s going a hundred miles an hour in different directions and yeah, no, we’re going to, we’re gonna do podcasts on the regular. No issues. Don’t worry about it. Just, it’s just been a minute. We’ve been in the field and you know, we’re crank, we’re doing as much office work as we can, as we can when we’re here and when we’re cranking hard selling optics like crazy and whatnot.

02:13:12:24 –> 02:14:28:23
But just haven’t had a chance to do a podcast. And then you also have a few tough hunts and you’re like, well, I don’t really wanna do a podcast, don’t wanna talk about it. But hey, it’s been fun. We, we really appreciate everybody submitting photos, stories, hearing about your successes being tagged on social media. Also had epic failures, people that have struggled and whatnot. And we like talking about that too and visiting with you about, about that and, and whatnot. We just, everybody’s doing their best, working their guts out. It’s been, it’s a warm environment right now out there. It’s warm. I mean, they’re saying on the Gila was 84 degrees yesterday, so, you know, down in New Mexico, so it’s makes for some tough hunts and, and I’m getting ready to head out, do some of that myself, and we’ll see how some of that goes. Anyway, it’s just tough. Also gonna be heading to Iowa, Colorado after that. Canada after that, New Mexico after that. I mean, Josh, what do you got going? You got a lot coming up too. Yeah, yeah. Same kind of thing. Gonna be got at the Utah deer hunt starting tomorrow again. Trying to keep grinding away on that thing. And then, yeah, same thing. Going to Colorado the end of the week wanting, gonna be able to finish that one for it to go to Colorado and then basically get back from that.

02:14:28:27 –> 02:15:40:25
I mean, we’re going to Canada, so Yeah. I’m excited for that. Cash. What do you got going? Just getting ready. Gearing up to go to Colorado. So you got a significant hunt in Colorado. I’m super excited for you. Oh, I am. I’ve been itching more and more as it gets closer. It’s gonna be fun. Grandpa. Jason’s in your corner boss, but if it wasn’t for grandpa, Jason, I don’t know where I’d be. No, what do you mean? I, I’m just here to, I love people burning tags and burning gas, so I’m here to support you and I hope you kill one. Gonna be a grind, but I hope you kill one. I’m ready for it. I’m excited. It’s the only tag I’ve got for myself this year, other than something over the counter. But I’m excited. So yeah. John or John? Yeah, we’ve got already the December magazine we’re cranking on and so that’ll be coming out and maybe even a little early. And then a lot of that is because we’re in the field heavy in Colorado and November. Yeah, of course we’ll be in Canada too. But then you’re also dealing with Yep. Your own hunts. Yeah. And then I’ve got a third season, so how about that? Yeah, it’s pretty awesome. You’ve gotta do a little overtime here and there to Yeah. Clear up some space. Logan, he’s got plenty going on. His family, of course.

02:15:40:25 –> 02:16:49:20
He’s still trying to get a turnback tag or something. Working on it. Working on it. Like it, as of right now, I’m in full helper mode, so Yeah, I like it. It’s all right. No, you’ve got, you got plenty going on and I, I know your dad’s got plenty and he’s gonna need your help on. Oh yeah. How much weight can you pack? I, so I wanna know, like, I mean, me personally, do you have a freighter frame? Like, I want to know, like can you, if we kill a spike or you know, small Mulder, how much can we count on you for? I’m pretty, I’m pretty good. I pi I’ve packed out significant amounts of meat. I like it. You you’ve heard it pushing 40 pounds. Yeah. Should have called no cash. Just kidding. Should used Logan hundreds. We’re Logan. We should have brought him as a decoy too. Cash should have done it. Yeah. Bring an orange vest. Come to a point. We could, we could have had him hanging on the back of the pack wheel. Dragging you up the hill. It’s true. We left that out, but holy crap. One, one last thing before we wrap up. Yeah. We are doing a muley matter pre giveaway. Giveaway. So just to generate a little bit of more interest in the actual muley matter on what are we doing giveaway we’re giving away. Some pretty cool stuff. It’s an Instagram giveaway.

02:16:49:27 –> 02:18:10:15
You gotta like the post, if you’re following us on epic hunts or mules matters, you’ve seen it. Like the post comment, what state you’re hunting from. What post? What post? We posted it. Posted it earlier today it’s posted to the prize that you’ll be getting. Very good. It’s on the mules matter and epic hunts page. Okay. Like it comment what state you’re hunting from, or what state you usually hunt from. And then share it on your story. And tag lys matters when you share it onto your story every day. You share it onto your story as an extra entry. You get into this giveaway. Holy cow. So even if you were successful, but like Drew, who conjured up this, Josh, this is not something that you could’ve done. This is what happened when me and John had it’s way above my pay grade. John, will you explain this slow? So just to support the movement and to possibly win something, then, then you can enter this one and you, you enter it on anybody’s Instagram? On Instagram. Instagram post on neely’s matter. Yep. Anybody is eligible. We just wanted to give an opportunity for everybody to win something and generate a little bit of interest. So what, what’s in this specific give? Well, there’s some swag. Some, yeah, let’s call it. Okay. Yep. From the new Epic merch storey’s underscore matter. Yep. Okay. You’re gonna be winning pair of Diamondback HD 10 by 40 twos.

02:18:10:21 –> 02:19:13:29
I like it. You can choose any two shirts off the new Epic merch store. Not at all. I’ll ship those to you. Epic headlamp, epic outdoors, epic outdoor edge knife, and a lighter pyro putty combo along with a hat and decal. Nice hat and truck decal. Dude, this is legit. That’s a pretty good package. Geez. Have we talked much about this? The store that we put up yet? Little bit. A little bit. I don’t know if it’s super public. Is it? Yeah. Talk about it. Cash. Throw it out there. Oh, I don’t, I don’t know as much about it as Logan does yet. But I mean, there’s a, we have a merch store. There was, I, when I first started here, there was people, where can I get, where can I buy a hat? Where can I buy a shirt? Do you guys do it? And I’m like, well, I don’t know. I just started, but you know, not too long ago we started this epic merch store and man, there’s some cool stuff on there. There’s a lot of stuff. I’ve gotta do some shopping on it myself. Really? You have blankets, mugs. Yeah. All kinds of stuff. John. Yep. John’s Art School came in handy for that. Yeah. Yeah. T-shirts. We’re gonna be adding sweatshirts real soon on there as well. So just trying to get the sizing right. Lots and lots of stuff.

02:19:14:02 –> 02:20:31:12
I, I think, I mean, mugs, mugs are flying off their shelves. I don’t know. Lot. Lots of good. Lots of people drinking. I hate the word merch. I do too. We know you do. I do too. Logan. How? Check out my merch star. I mean, it just seems so Gen Z, that that can be found in our Instagram bio or on our website. There is a merch section in our website. It may soon be changed to apparel. I’m fine with, I’m fine with it. Merch, gen Zs are gonna support Epic. Hey, have it. You can, you can start running some epic merch. Running some epic merch. We’re gonna tweet about it. We’re gonna, what else? What do we do? Oh, snap it out. You’re gonna snapchat it. Oh, every day. Or what else? What other things do put it on MySpace. TikTok. TikTok. How’s our TikTok doing? Our TikTok is doing good. We bss. Do we have stuff going out? Yeah, I post on it pretty frequently. Come on. Yeah. Tell us about TikTok a little bit. What? What do you wanna know about TikTok? Like how do do you find it? Our TikTok is Epic underscore Outdoors. You gotta download the TikTok app and yeah, we post highlights of our YouTube videos on there. We post podcast highlights. Sometimes Do they call ’em tiktoks, right? Yeah. He post out some tiktoks. Yeah, exactly. This is where Logan can post whatever he wants.

02:20:31:23 –> 02:21:45:18
’cause none of us have TikTok but Dev Well, he does. And then Devon’s like, Hey, I’ve, I, somebody told me there was a TikTok about my hunt, and this is weird because tiktoks aren’t normal videos, right? No, no. They’re very different. And shoot, it’s, it’s one of those things where if you’re not in it, it would look really weird and IAnd that if you’re not in a meeting, if you’re not a Gen Z, you’re gonna look not if you’re not on TikTok, you’re gonna watch a video that I’ve made and say, what the heck is that? But they work. That’s what we do. They work. They work. Yeah. Okay. I try to keep it, I try to keep it pretty, you gotta cater to some of the teenagers, right? I do. I I try to find the middle road between what would please, this is how people lose control of their business. Right? We got a merch store and tiktoks going out that we don’t have any clue what’s what’s out there. That’s why we hire good people. We trust everyone. Right. I’m, I’m over. Okay. I’m over this we, how long have we gone? We are one hour and 40 minutes. Wow. Wow. Good grief. Let’s go have some lunch. Hey everybody, smash a giant. If not, go to Muley matter and you can figure out how to enter. Go to epic Also, you can submit, register, and send in your tag.

02:21:46:02 –> 02:23:03:08
We’re talking your own punch tag. We’re thousands and thousands of dollars in prizes, cash, prizes, rifles, bows. I mean, you name it, it’s there. And if you kill one, I shouldn’t say kill. Guess you harvest. Do we? Do we have to be proper on? No, we there you smashing. We do a smash and grab of a giant. We wanna see it. Yeah, we want stories. We whatever. Send in your photos, stories, whatnot to [email protected]. Email and we’ll go from there. We’d love to hear from you. Appreciate y’all. And yeah, we’re gonna do, we’re gonna do some more podcasts and when we’re in the office on a regular basis, they’re gonna come out. We on the weekly. They’re gonna come out on the weekly. All right everybody. Bye. We’d like to thank all of our sponsors here at Epic Outdoors. For top of the line hunting, clothing, and apparel in every environment, visit under We’d like to thank Under Armour for being our title sponsor and making this podcast happen. Visit our website epic for discount codes to Under Armour Hunting apparel, handcrafted quality precision rifles from start to finish. Red Rock Precision is one of our sponsors and many of our staff uses Red Rock rifles. Visit Red Rock to find out more. If you’re in the market for a hunting property, our sponsor at St. James Sporting Properties specialize in premier hunting properties throughout the west.

02:23:03:16 –> 02:24:18:09
Check out available hunting properties at st. James sporting Good looking comfortable. Camo describes KU U, the new bush pants from KU U. Keep your legs comfortable while walking through the thorns and bristles. Visit ku for sizing and prices. Kenna Trek makes great boots for any situation. Most sheet punters in the high rocky altitudes. Use these boots to keep their ankles in. Check on the rough terrain. Visit ken and to learn more. We at Epic Outdoors are a fierce firearms dealer and have many popular models in stock and ready to ship. Call us if you would like help deciding which options are right for you. Fierce long-range Rifles are a great rifle and many of our employees here use them. Visit fierce to learn more. Triple S Polaris specializes in custom setup hunting side byside. They deliver right to your door nationwide. Visit ss to learn more For affordable, long range rifles and shooting schools, visit thompson long Hoyt is top of the line archery equipment. Hoyt is the official bow manufacturer of Epic Outdoors. Everyone on our staff shoots a Hoyt bow call. If you’d like to visit about their different models or visit Thank you to Phone Scope, the best camera optic adapter out there. Phone scope makes high quality phone cases and optics adapters. Visit phone to learn more. Stealth Camm has high quality durable trail cameras that we all love to use.

02:24:18:17 –> 02:25:07:24
Check them [email protected] or call us to order today here at Epic Optics. We are a verified dealer for Swarovski Zes, Leica Vortex, stealth cam and more. Call us today to visit about the available optics we have and what would be right for you. Or visit epic for only 150 bucks a year. You get nine issues of the Epic Outdoors Magazine and unlimited access to our Hunt consultant, as well as access to our verified research website. To see all the other member benefits, visit epic If you hunt multiple states, our services are essential. The Epic Outdoors license application service is for you. If you ever miss deadlines or would like help developing your long, medium, and short-term license application goals, give us a call today at (435) 263-0777 to learn more.