In this episode we call up two Epic Outdoors members who killed awesome Arizona bulls and were featured in our January 2025 magazine. If you want to go on more hunts like the ones talked about in this podcast and have the most up-to-date information available to help you be successful, become a member of Epic Outdoors and level up your hunting opportunities.
Disclaimer: this text was produced through an automated transcription service and likely contains errors. Please listen to the original audio for exact content.
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You are listening to the Epic Outdoors Podcast. Check us [email protected].
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Hey everybody, Jason Carter outta Bronson and Logan Marshall, just the three of us here in the podcast room today. Logan, thanks for turning on the heat for once. We appreciate
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It. You’re welcome. I thought a little much, I don’t know, was, feels like July 24th in here.
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It’s warm.
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I like
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Bring on truck head season. I’m ready to start scouting aren’t you Bronson?
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Give me a month.
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Okay. Alright. Anyway, we, we just wanted to get back on the podcast here. We are going to call a couple friends of ours, Nevin Jensen. Craig Sanchez both killed Great Bulls in Arizona this past year. The January, 2025 magazine is out. I don’t know if you’ve got it, it’s your house yet.
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You should, if you haven’t Yeah, you haven’t checked your mailbox. It’s, it’s there.
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Well check online. It’s always, it’s always been on there for a minute.
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Couple weeks early.
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I would say way early. But anyway, Arizona elk and antelope. It’s covered that deadline of February 4th and Wyoming elk. Of course that was interesting with the deadline day print dates, all of these things dealing with the printers as well as Wyoming coming out with exact regs on the other species. We went with elk only this year. Bronson?
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Yeah. Yeah. We’ll cover the other species in February the, as far as moose, sheep, goat, bison in Wyoming. We wanted to wait for their up updated hump planter to be updated. So we actually covered the units that are actually available for non-residents to apply for in 2025. So we waited a month, threw it in there, maybe shifted Oregon a little bit. Yeah. Oregonians don’t get too
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No, we get too wound up
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May we’re You gotta tell May 15 for
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Sake. We gotta tell. We got and then Wyoming Elks do January 31st. Always is. And then of course the other species will come way after that. And so it wasn’t a huge deal. We just did it. Guess we get to choose Hum Bronson. Yeah, there’s no, no red tape here. So anyway, we did it and it is out. So January, 2025 issue. Here we go. It’s out. We got Nevin on the cover with a freaking giant six point. We wanna call him, get the story and, and see what he thought of that particular hunt. What kind of information we can glean from him.
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I have an idea what he thought.
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Well you got a good one, but that doesn’t always mean it was a great hunt.
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Who knows? Well, it was like the first or second day. How bad could it be? I mean it’s got, well, I mean, yeah,
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Here in Utah we’re a little spoiled. I don’t know. All right. Here, let’s talk to him. Devin’s a good dude. Been a friend of ours for years and years. Him and his dad dealt with them great hunters and just
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All the giant
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Freaking good guys. Here we go.
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Hey, what’s going up man?
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How you doing?
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Good. How’s it going?
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You got a few minutes to spare in your busy, busy schedule. Yes. For us talk. Yeah, of course. Talk about this giant bull that’s brought back to Utah last fall.
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You can always make time for Big Bulls
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Brought back to Utah where it belongs. Exactly.
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Yep.
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Well we appreciate it. It, yeah, we teed it up just a little bit and talked about, you know, January mags out and Arizona’s antelope and elk are teed up here first and obviously point out that you’re on the cover with just a giant from last year with your bow. So yeah, I don’t know. I guess take it away a little bit. Just tell the story. The story’s in the magazine, but I mean,
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And it’s titled when you least Expect it so it’ll be interesting.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just still super grateful for that bowl and grateful for you guys for putting that on the cover. But yeah, just still, still on cloud nine today. Think about it pretty much every day and honestly you just can’t believe it still. But yeah, it works out. So as everybody probably knows, Arizona’s about the first state we put in for and so I just had 10 bonus points this year. My dad, he actually had 28 so I guess last year And we’ve been talking to Jeff Lester, Jeff, he’s the owner of Hunt Hard Outfitters. We started talking to him, it’s been a long time ago about New Mexico flying with him for the guy draw out there and just one of those things where he’s from Arizona, so kind of just keep in touch every year and touch base with him. And so mainly it was just from my dad’s point, so I was just kind of an afterthought, you know. And he, his son had a tag in Arizona in 2023 and they just saw a bunch of big bulls and you know, multiple 3 73 83 90 type bulls. And my dad hated to use his points on an archery. Huh. But
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I know that I’ve talked, I’ve talked, how long have I talked to him? Nothing about,
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Same thing for years, the
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Utah and Arizona points. It’s like every 15 years it feels like.
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Yeah, it’s up. So now long story stories up to 29 for Utah and Arizona
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And you got a big bull and he hast gone.
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He has a gun, you’re well aware. Yeah, exactly. So you know, decided to put him into that same unit that his son hunted in. And with me I put that as my second choice. I put in another, you know, kind of hard to get archery hunt as my first choice.
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23 south or something. Who knows?
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Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Just seeing if I could get lucky. So I never really ever even thought I had a chance to draw on. We kind of figured he was pretty much guaranteed. So we knew we’d be hunting Arizona. And like I said in the story, just February when the results come out, I got a text and it was from my credit card telling me that I had that charge from Arizona Game of Fish for 650 bucks. And I got lost it. I was like, no way. So I called my dad and tell him, did you check your credit card? And his hadn’t got hit yet and mine did. And we were both just pretty happy obviously.
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So then he ended up also drawing. But kind of make a long story short in between, you know, the time when the draw comes out until the hunt. I had shoulder surgery, had that in February. So by about May I was May, June back to shooting my bow, getting ready for this hunt. Obviously building up strength, nothing like I would like to be doing, preparing for a hunt like that. And then kinda later on down the summer, I had a surgery five years ago on my wrist for a torn ligament and just happened, I was leaving clinic one day and my wrist was just killing me. So I thought it was tendonitis or just something with that. So I went to the doctor to get a steroid shot and he decided to take an x-ray and ended up being one of the screws from that previous surgery had backed completely outta one of my bones into my joint. That’s gotta be rare. I was like,
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Doesn’t the bone calcify in and around the screw
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Or something? Yeah, yeah. So my, the surgeon said that he’d never seen it and probably never see it again.
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Really? Wow.
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That’s unlucky. So he
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Sent me not
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Like you have bone density problems or like some kind of a degeneration of the bone.
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So they had like, we gotta get rid of that basically. Right. He said
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That’s, I’m getting old, I’m breaking down.
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What are you 30?
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I dunno. Did you cre 30, 35?
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I’m 33 but I don’t like to admit it. So I ended up going back to the guy who did my surgery and he decided before he took the screw out he might as well take some more x-rays and just another bad luck deal. Don’t know how it happened. One of those bones was also completely broken half in my hand. What?
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Geez
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What that you, you don’t know how you break a bone in your head and had screws.
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He shot it. He’d been broken for a little over a year just ’cause I don’t know, kept using it and just didn’t know it was broken.
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Working out or lifting or whatever. You’re doing
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A prime prime candidate for a crossbo
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That was also talked about. But I said no, I’m better
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Do that. Im proud. I’m proud of you in 2026 that’s
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Going away. If I’d have known that would Yeah,
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I saw that yesterday.
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Yeah, it’s going away. Yeah.
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Yeah. So crossbow was obviously talked about, but I didn’t want to, so talking with the surgeon, I told him, well man, I can’t get surgery now. I got, and he’s, he’s not a hunter obviously, but I told him kind of what the deal was and kind of explained to him the, like the significance of this tag. And he didn’t really get it. But I was like, so look, we can put a cast on it for a few weeks. ’cause the hunt started mid-September and this was like the first week of August. Oh my gosh. And I was like, well we can see if, ’cause he didn’t want to go in there and take the screw out before he knew if one the bone was gonna heal or two if he had to go like surgically, you know, repair the bone. So reluctantly I got him just to put me in a hard cast.
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So I was in a hard cast from like that first week of August up until two days before my hunt. So September 12th I got that cast off and geez, just my luck still didn’t heal. So then he wanted to his surgery. But, so I ended up getting that cast off on September 12th in Provo. Drove down to where I live in Cleveland, shot my bow a few times. I mean it was obviously my wrist was pretty stiff being in the Casper, you know, five, six weeks. But everything kind of checked out. Bow was still tuned up. What about
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The bone? Was the bone healed enough? I mean it just doesn’t feel
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No, the bone, bone didn’t heal one bit.
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What’s going
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On? And it’s okay to use it like you’re using it. I
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Mean, I mean no, he, he didn’t want me to, it was, he was, he didn’t understand. But I told him, well
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You got a random mail tag. Yeah. That’s the emphasis of this. This is not like your dad’s tag where okay, yeah. You turn it in point guard it and we’ll do this again. You got a random, you don’t want to give away.
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Exactly. And you don’t want to use crossbow.
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No, no. So I mean, yeah, like you said, definitely, you know, turning the tag in wasn’t an option. And I mean there’s nothing wrong with crossbows. I just didn’t want that experience and I just kind of wanted to do it, you know? Yeah,
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You always had everything else in you.
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Yeah, exactly. Jesus. So yeah. So
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Is this screw still like
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Floating around
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Like half backed outta bone and,
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And so kind of the ending to that story, his surgery schedules backed up. So I actually had surgery on this hand the day before Thanksgiving this year and two days ago I ended up getting the hard cast off and the bone healed. So Good, good ending to the story. Geez.
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Well, okay,
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So when you pulling the bow back, I mean, are you stressing out this broken bone? Like is it hurting or is it,
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I mean it’s just stiff. I mean, yeah, it was just, you know, didn’t have much mobility in that hand and, and no strength. ’cause there’d been that cast. I, it was the
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Driveway. Is it jaw hand or the, or the release.
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So I, I’m a little crazy. I’m right-handed, but I’m left eye dominant so I, I pull my bow bag and I shoot lefthanded. Yeah. And so my broken hand,
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It sounds like you’re a rifle hunter, you just need to resort to rifles. Yeah. You’ve
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Got all kinds of maladies.
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Wow.
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Okay. So you
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Hopefully 2024 was the year to get ’em all done though.
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All
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Right. Wow.
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Okay. Well so you did that, you got the cast off and yeah, you’re not gonna do surgery in a day or something, you’re just gonna have to go hunt back to the hunt. You’re just going to Arizona. Yeah. And your dad decided he wasn’t gonna hunt. Right. At some point he decided you guys, this
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Is all about
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You guys talked and like, hey, I can get this tag again. Maybe we shouldn’t have two such elite tags and try to kill two giants basically. Right. And he turned his back. Yeah,
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Exactly. So yeah, so I mean obviously 24 was, you know, wet year leading up to it. So we all thought it was gonna be pretty dang good. But like you said, we just knew that, you know, trying to kill two big bulls is pretty hard at the bow and he obviously can get it anytime he wants. So yeah, he ended up turning it in, which worked out for me because then we still had Jeff kind of on the hook plan on
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Guiding and now you get all the big bulls to yourself. Yeah,
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It worked out great. The plan was now
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Jeff’s thinking I got a hunter with broken wrists, I’ve got a left eye dominant left eye, right eye right-handed, yeah. Wreck going on. Yeah.
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Yeah. A little bit goofy. But yeah, it worked out for me. So my dad turned his tag in point, guarded it and then so obviously I was left. Yeah. So that kind of worked out. But, so then we ended up going down, you know how things get, everything’s always so busy. So Jeff went down three days before the hunt and started looking and then my dad and I, we started heading down just the day before the hunt. And we plan on going in the morning, getting there at night, you know, settling in, doing some glass, but I could, that never goes to plant.
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I could totally see your dad’s tied up at the shop. It’s like you just, you know, you’re leaving business going and Yeah,
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Exactly.
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Cabinets.
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And then we ended up stopping in Richfield and doing cabinets on our way down there.
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There you go. I knew it. We can write the whole trip off now.
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Exactly. So we ended up pulling into camp, like I think about one in the morning probably. And
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Hunt starts at about five hours.
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Yeah, yeah. Yep. Wow. And, but like I say, luckily Jeff, I mean he’d been there and his son had that tag, so he kind of had an idea of where we wanted to go. So I mean he was awesome. Great guy. Loves elks hunting elk,
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Hard hunting. Yeah.
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Felt hard hunter. So I mean, felt pretty good about it.
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Yep.
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Okay. But then, so that first morning we just planned on the same thing. We got outta camp probably like, I don’t know, two hours before daylight and just gonna kind of drive the roads, listen for some bugles and it was pretty slow. There weren’t many bugles and so this would’ve been September 14th and you know, not much running activity, it didn’t seem like. So we ended up just going to this spot where it has this big kind of circular kind of rock outcropping that just overlooks this big, this like Ponderosa valley down below. And we hiked up there and I mean instantly there’s elk everywhere. There was probably like four different groups of elk all had probably 10 to 15 cows and each had a bull. And those first, I don’t know, 10, 15 minutes of daylight there was like, I don’t know, a couple, 3 40, 3 50 bulls, you know, good bulls, but just kind of not what we were looking for at that time. And my dad and Jeff kind of picked up and walked kind of around this rim to look over on the other side of it. And I stayed back and about five minutes after they left I could kind of hear ’em, you know, you can tell when somebody’s pretty excited.
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So, so I picked up my tripod headed over there and I mean you could see, I mean those big bulls, you know, they’re just bright yellow it seems like out in the sunlight. And he just stood out like a sore thumb. He was probably like, I don’t know, eight, 900 yards away. And yeah, when I got my binoculars on him just about craps, you know, it’s over
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Back end and fronts that hook up. I mean, what does, he doesn’t have good looking, looking
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Black. Yeah, good looking sucker.
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Yeah, just, I mean, like I said in my story, like all year long I talked about like, I just want this perfect Arizona bull and to me like a big typical, you know, great big backend wide and yeah, when I, when we focused in on him, it was just unreal, you know, just 25 inch fourth and 18 inch fifth and big front wide and just kind of knew that was a bull kind
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Of had it all. Yeah,
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Yeah. And so at that time it was probably, you know, we watched him for, I don’t know, maybe like an hour, but up on that thing, the wind was just horrible. The wind was kind of coming through that valley right at us and we just didn’t wanna spook him out the first day of the hunt. So we just kind of sat back and watched him. And then that there was another bull, we call him a seven point, he comes up and he actually gets in a fight with my bull and just kind of a weird thing, we’re sitting there watching him fight and all of a sudden, you know, the bull we were looking for my bull, he just disappears. So we don’t know what happened. And so I’m, I’m still just kind of glued on that spot, trying to pick him out. Don’t
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Know if he took a sword,
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The seven point in the cows
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Took a so guy threw through the ribs maybe, you
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Know? Exactly. Did
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He, do you think he chipped that third, his left third fight?
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You know, I shot, I have, I have video of him fighting and when he leaves the fight he still has that third, so I think he did it later that night when he went and got more cows.
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Okay.
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But, so he fought that seven point probably, I don’t know, four or five minutes, seven point ends up taking his cows and and coming right under us. Well I mean is he big?
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Is he a pretty big bull but he’s not as big as the other one? Yeah,
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He’s a good bull 3 50, 360, but obviously just kind of decided that the big bull was the only one that I wanted. So I’m still looking around and in the exact spot those bulls were fighting probably like two minutes after the last time we saw him. There was another hunter and a guy on a radio, which I pretty much figured was a guide and my heart just dropped. I was just like, no way. You know, ’cause that bull disappeared and the seven point took the cow, so didn’t know if they shot
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Him, did they shoot him? And Oh
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Geez. So yeah, I just kind of sit and so we sat there for probably another, I don’t know, hour and a half, two hours and never turned up the big bull again. So, you know, like I say, not really knowing what happened to him and we ended up going back down to camp, just kinda regrouping for the day and getting a plan and that’s when we started looking at video and putting some numbers on him and just like, yeah, this is a pretty much a 400 inch boat, we gotta kill him. Yeah,
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Geez.
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So same thing we decided well just gonna pretty much stick it out for him. And so that night we decided a little bit different thing. We sent my dad up on the heel of glass and Jeff and I just kind of went in where we saw the bull last hoping, you know, hear a bugle, just get lucky’s, you know, you can’t really glass down in there, you’re basically just listening and still hunting. Listen down there. Yeah,
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In the jungle. Yeah, it’s a, it’s a jungle.
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So that night it was slow, we never didn’t hear a bugle and then we actually didn’t see any elk that night. My dad, he glassed up one of the bulls from the morning before, like a 3 46 point, he had cows and then that seven point was also in there and he still had all the cows. And then there was another hunter and a guide on our out rock, kind of that rock outcropping that my dad was on. So it was obviously picking up and we kind of figured that, you know, we kind of figured as every day that went on more people would kind of, hopefully not, but I mean odds are they’re gonna hear about the bull and people are gonna start talking and gonna get busier and busier. So we kind of knew we had to make something happen. But, so no big bull that night and I mean now that we know what we know, I think he just left, got his cows, broke his dang horn and, and came back.
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But anyway, so we went back to camp that night and kind of just planned on the same thing for the following day. But we wanted to be there early because we just wanted to be the first people there. And I also just wanted to be there and see if we could hear bugles. So that next morning we probably woke up, I think it was about three hours before daylight. Geez, that’s perfect. And for, yeah, for, from the camp to where we were hunting was probably like 30 minute drive. Just got there, like I say probably two, two and a half hours for daylight. And my dad dropped Jeff and I off again. And like I say, our plan was just gonna cut a steel hunt. The wind was perfect again, kind of going the same way it was that morning before. And so we were kind of had it in our face all morning and then my dad was gonna go back up to our glass and point just see if he could pick something out, see the bull. And I mean it was probably five minutes after he dropped us off, there were three pickups coming down the road with all their headlights on where it’s like, holy cow, everybody’s
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Early here come,
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Yeah, pretty much kinda had to, you know, guess that was gonna happen. But, so we had some competition so we just kept going in there, you know, at that point we didn’t wanna turn our headlamps on or anything, so we’re just kind of going step by step listening and I mean there were a few bugles that morning, we could hear four, two bugles, we could tell were like together. One bugle was by himself and then one view was across the road from where we’d come. So we just kind of kept going right into where, you know, the three bulls that we could hear were up where we were hunting and I mean, time went pretty quick. We did hear some other peoples come in and those bulls, there were three of ’em and they wasn’t like crazy rut, you know, it was still pretty, pretty sparse.
00:20:39:23 –> 00:21:23:27
But they would bugle, I don’t know, once every 10 minutes or so. And as we got closer to daylight, you could tell the tube bugles kind of got together and they were kind of going back and forth with each other. But then there was that still one bugle? He was pretty sparse like once every, I don’t know, 20, 30 minutes. We heard him probably three times that morning. But so we’re getting up there and we figure we’re probably like two, 300 yards away from the single bugle and like same three, four oh yards away from those two bugles. And at this time it was kind of getting light and luckily my dad was up on that hill, so he glass the two bulls and it was that same six point from the day before, like three, I don’t know, 40 ish bull. And that seven point, he couldn’t see these other bulls.
00:21:23:27 –> 00:22:32:16
They were kind of in a little like thick little spot of just those pins down there. And the wind was perfect for us. It was right at our face towards that one. So I mean, Jeff and I figured, well we might as well check this bull out and then if, you know it’s not our bull, we can go across the road and try to see if that bull that we’re hearing over there is him. So we just kinda, same thing, just keep crapping up there and we didn’t wanna call, let him know that we were there. So we kind of knew the general area they were in. And just like I say, him sparsely bugling, we just kept kind of working our way and then everything just, you know, when you get in there it just happens quick. So we were still moving up and all of a sudden you could see elk legs like underneath those pins. And at this point, I mean it’s thick so we’re close, we’re probably 60, 70 yards from ’em, but it’s just too thick to tell. And so we kind of still work up there wind’s perfect. So we’re not worried about ’em smelling it, it’s just going super slow so don’t pick us off. And we probably cut it another, I don’t know, 10, 15 yards and just crazy still all of a sudden this bull, I mean my bull now feels good to say, but you can see his antler tips. This
00:22:32:16 –> 00:22:33:10
Bull’s in my house
00:22:33:13 –> 00:22:41:00
Got tips. Yep, exactly. Yeah, his antler tips. We could see him above the opinions and just, we looked at each other like, no way
00:22:41:03 –> 00:22:54:18
That is it. You were going blind on a bugle you heard three times that morning. Yep. And knew it wasn’t the other two and just, it’s awesome. One of the chances. And you know, you got other people converging, you know? Yeah. Geez.
00:22:54:24 –> 00:22:58:22
It was just, I mean we, we keep saying it, but I just keep saying it was just meant to be. Yeah.
00:22:59:06 –> 00:23:00:07
And stuff like that is
00:23:00:09 –> 00:23:01:24
Just Jeff was living right.
00:23:04:03 –> 00:23:06:06
Well you don’t live a terrible life, Nevin. Yeah,
00:23:06:12 –> 00:23:46:00
Yeah, yeah. So something went right. I mean then just, it seems like it never works out too. Elk are crazy, you know? Yeah. They get one sniff and they’re out of there. Those cows pick you off and they’re out of there. But yeah. And it seems like the bull is always right in the middle of them, or always seems like he’s on the far end of them. Well he was the closest one to us. Wow. And he was kinda working back and forth, but where these bulls like the cow and the bull was, it was just super thick still. So he started coming left and he started raking this tree and just this tree about broke breaking in half, he’s just raking the crap out of it. And then he stops bugles once more. And just crazy, you know, when you’re that close and they bugles, it’s kind of the hair on your neck stands up.
00:23:46:03 –> 00:24:26:25
Oh yeah. But where he was going, he was kind of working to our left and we weren’t gonna get a shot. And just kind of how it goes, I’m sitting there thinking, dang, well it was cool to be this close, but he’s gonna have to pull a miracle for us and basically do a 180 and walk about 20 yards the other way. Well that’s what he did. He turns and I’m just like, well there’s the first miracle and eating, I just keep walking. So at this point we still, we can’t see his whole, his whole antlers, you know, we just see his basically like seven inches of his fourth, seven inches of his fist. But they’re just so dang big. We knew it was him and the way he’s walking, there was kind of a roll of, I don’t know, like 10 pins, just thick.
00:24:27:09 –> 00:25:06:25
And then there was one where it kind of didn’t grow. So we had about a three foot gap there. And I was like, well if he can get to there, we can shoot him. And so I get ready and I mean Arizona, luckily you can use the the garment still. And I think those things are awesome. So I didn’t have to worry about range and dial anything. So I just kind of got ready, obviously had an arrow knocked and Jeff was to my left. And then this bull, he just starts slowly, you know, those bulls and they get that stiff legged walk. He’s just slowly walking and I’m like, dang, he’s gonna, he might just make it to that opening. And like in between me and the opening, so after the fact, the opening’s 56 yards, but probably like at, I don’t know, 20 yards.
00:25:07:03 –> 00:25:54:15
There’s like a, a little stunted pinon that was dead. And so I knew my air would go over it. So at this point I’m just worried that, ’cause I’m kneeing down, I’m worried if I’m gonna be able to range through that. But anyway, that’s on the back of my mind. The bull keeps walking and then it’s obvious he’s gonna go right in this little gap. There’s a tree behind the gap left of the gap, right, of the gap. And like I say, it’s probably three feet wide and crazy. I tell my dad all the time, like I just, I wasn’t nervous at all. Like my heart wasn’t beating, I was just thinking clearly just, just ready. Luckily and that bull, we could see his nose come in and so right when his kind of front shoulder gets in, he’s still walking. So I kind of simultaneously just kind of get, kind of stand from my knees and draw Jeff whistles.
00:25:55:04 –> 00:26:31:15
And at this time I’d already pushed my little button to range, you mean it was 56 yards. So my pin comes up and Jeff whistled and he stopped on a dime and instantly I sent in that arrow. And I always use fluorescent yellow veins so I can, you know, you can see where your arrow hits and you can watch it fly the whole way. And I mean, I’ve shot a lot of things and you just know when you, you know, you hit something good and watch that arrow and it buried what I thought was perfect. I mean, and we, that bull took off and just kind of one of those things, you just don’t believe it. I kind of looked at Jeff and tried to tackle him a few times and we were just pumped. Just honestly he thought it too,
00:26:32:01 –> 00:26:33:07
He’s like, that’s a money shot
00:26:33:08 –> 00:27:20:05
Right there. Yeah. Yeah. Just same thing, just thought of bull one of those things you think you’re gonna have just like a fire hydrant blood trail and he’s gonna be 50 yards piled up, you know? Yeah. So we kinda sit there for, I don’t know, probably 10, 15 minutes, let my dad know what was going on. Then like I say, just this one spot of this little flat, so thick and my dad just can’t pick up these, this elk just ’cause it’s so thick. So we ended up tracking him about 15 minutes after the shot we go up, the arrow didn’t pass through so we didn’t find the arrow. And just, you know how bow hunting is, you think you’re gonna have a, a big bull up there dead and there was just like drops of blood. I mean some places would have, you know, like a baseball size drop, but I mean it was just like quarter drop of blood, blood, blood,
00:27:20:29 –> 00:27:23:03
Nothing like where you’re expecting crazy.
00:27:23:08 –> 00:27:28:12
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Frustrating. And, and on the kill photos it looks perfect like everything.
00:27:28:18 –> 00:27:49:18
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, no problem. Thought it was gonna be perfect. Like I say, thought he was gonna be dead. So then, you know, boha and you’re just thinking, holy cow, what did I do? And so then you get replayed in my mind and I’m like, well maybe I hit him too far back or because I knew I didn’t hit him forward in the shoulder. So I’m like, well maybe I hit him in the liver or maybe guts, I don’t know. But I’m like, there’s no way I saw that arrow. It was perfect.
00:27:50:01 –> 00:27:54:00
Even liver, he had been a lot of blood and dead fast. Yeah. So I don’t know. Yeah.
00:27:54:20 –> 00:28:35:16
So we, we tracked him that morning for probably, I don’t know, a hundred yards. And luckily that dirt’s pretty soft kind of a sand, like dirt. So when we could pretty much dry track him and there was blood too, but just not a lot of blood, you know. So we ended up finally, my dad calls us probably about five minutes after we had started looking for him and he saw him walking. Well the, the, the wound was on his right side. My dad was looking down in the valley so he could just see his left. His left was clean. So he says, well his left side’s clean, but he’s walking barely like every step like an effort. And this bull from my dad’s point of view is just like he’s
00:28:35:16 –> 00:28:37:07
Hurt one labor intensive one
00:28:37:19 –> 00:28:41:22
Yeah. Head. Yeah. Nose is straight down the dirt just like barely moving, you know,
00:28:42:25 –> 00:28:44:27
So just hold up basically stop
00:28:45:02 –> 00:28:54:22
Yeah. Track. Yeah. So we decide to get outta there, not worth, you know, pushing him. So we regroup head back to camp and I’m obviously just, I’m sick.
00:28:55:19 –> 00:28:59:23
Your, your dad’s still on the glass watching or, or did he head back to? No,
00:28:59:23 –> 00:29:40:03
So we, at that time we actually all climbed up on the hill. Yeah. And we spent probably an hour glass and didn’t pick up the cows, didn’t pick up the bull and so we just decided to get out of there so our truck wasn’t in there. And people, you know, knew we weren’t in there looking, go back to camp, just like I say, still thinking about the shot. And we had ourselves talked into, well I must have hit him low and back. And at the same, I’m, I’m just sitting here thinking the whole time like, geez, I watched those yellow fletching and it’s right where I had my pin. Yeah. So we ended up sitting there for probably three hours and like I say, just bow hunting. Just right now I’m on the lowest of lows
00:29:40:03 –> 00:29:41:12
Eating. Gotcha. Yeah.
00:29:41:14 –> 00:29:44:12
Promise that I’m never gonna pick up one of those stupid bows again.
00:29:44:18 –> 00:29:46:29
Yeah. With the cracked drift and pins, like
00:29:47:00 –> 00:29:51:07
Bow and crossbo or nothing, just stick
00:29:51:07 –> 00:29:52:10
With the rifle. Yeah,
00:29:52:10 –> 00:29:52:24
That’s right.
00:29:54:24 –> 00:30:17:24
But we ended up heading back out probably at two o’clock. Same thing Jeff and I, the plan was we were gonna go to where we had hit the bull and just kind of restart. My dad climbed back up on the same point and just kinda the same thing as, you know, that morning just dry track name and I mean, I say dry track and every track had blood but just, you know, just like a quarter drop. Not a lot of blood, none. Those was looking at
00:30:18:22 –> 00:30:19:27
Track and running. Yep,
00:30:20:03 –> 00:30:37:23
Exactly. And so we just keep tracking that. And it was probably, I don’t know, maybe 45 minutes to an hour of just kind of slowly picking our way through. And at this point I’m just, ’cause we’re, you know, getting 4, 4 50 yards away from where I shot him. And at this point I’m just sick just thinking we’ve
00:30:37:27 –> 00:30:38:10
Been there
00:30:38:10 –> 00:31:18:23
Trying to, thinking where the yeah. Where the arrow could have went and what happened. But you know, Jeff, he always stayed pretty positive so that was good and he just kept going and we kind of split up, we kinda lost the track. So I kind of walked, kind of veered to the left. I was probably like 30, 40 yards to Jeff’s left and all of a sudden I heard him say, here’s your bull. And I thought he was joking, I didn’t know what he was doing. So I walk over there and sure enough that bull was just laying dead as dead and it looked like he died in his feet and just fell over and that was it. But Wow. It looks like he died early too. I mean he was stiff, but yeah, we walked up there and as you can see in the kill pictures, you know mean that arrow I, if I could have went up and stabbed him and placed it, I don’t that’s
00:31:18:23 –> 00:31:19:15
Where you would’ve
00:31:19:15 –> 00:31:23:23
Changed it. Yep. Just elk or crazy and tough bull wanting to live and
00:31:24:00 –> 00:31:25:23
Big bodied sucker looks like
00:31:25:24 –> 00:31:32:11
Don’t know if I, you know, missed, just had the perfect little spot where I miss lungs, miss hard, didn’t get a big vest. Sometimes
00:31:32:11 –> 00:31:36:28
I wonder if you hit ’em right when they exhale or something. Put word like that
00:31:37:03 –> 00:31:54:21
Or Yeah, you have a, it goes in there and you have a slight, you hit a rib, it hits and it kicks, kicks back a little bit further than going straight through or forward just a slight. So the entrance hole’s perfect, but maybe the arrow angled through him a little bit different. Little went further back. Yeah. You know, I don’t know.
00:31:55:10 –> 00:31:59:04
So then he ended up, so what did he ended up what? 3 94 broken?
00:31:59:25 –> 00:33:00:29
So yeah, we, yeah, we sing based on our video and so he obviously broke that left third from the day before. And the bad thing, it was the, he’s kind of flip flop, but it was the bigger third of the two. Yeah. Oh wow. His right third was like 15 and a half and that left one broke was 11. So we’re thinking it was 15 and a half, 16. And then his long sword he broke, looks like about an inch off of it. And then his left beam about an inch. So we’re thinking anywhere from you know, 5, 6, 6, 8 inches, seven inches, eight maybe. You know, just depending on how that stuff measured out. But I mean, walking up to him just giant, you know, I was just ecstatic. Just couldn’t believe how big he looks on the ground. Yeah. You know, the only time it reminded me, so when I killed that rocky, we knew he was big and then when you get to him he is just unbelievably big, you know? Yeah, yeah. And then my one bull buck, same thing. We thought he was big, but then you, when you see how big they are and that was what his bull was like. We had him guess basically to the inch of what he was, but just when he is actually there on the ground, just it’s unreal.
00:33:01:04 –> 00:33:04:15
A 400 inch bull is just really, yeah. An
00:33:04:26 –> 00:33:39:05
But he ended up, so his G ones were 21 and G twos are like 18 and a half and 19 and a half. G threes, like I said, were like 15 and a half on that unbroken one. And then that broken one ended up being 11. But then his royal, so his four on his right is 24 and I think, was it three quarters or seven eights And his left was 22, right? G five was 18, the left one was like 16 if I remember I 54 and 51 inch beam and 46 inches wide. So it was just
00:33:39:11 –> 00:33:43:23
46 inside. Huh? 46 inside. That’s great. That’s, that’s
00:33:43:24 –> 00:33:47:24
Wide good. Solid average is 40. I mean, so that gave you a gift right there.
00:33:48:18 –> 00:33:49:18
Yeah. So just
00:33:50:04 –> 00:34:17:24
Lot of hugging and high fiving and hooting and hollering and, and all that. Especially, it doesn’t matter if it went 50 or a hundred yards and you walked up, but especially after that little bit of agony, three, four hours, whatever it was of what replaying it. We’ve all been there with bow and sometimes a lot of times they don’t end it good, you know? Yeah. When you don’t find something in four, 500 yards you think’s a perfect shot. No, it’s usually doesn’t. A lot of times it doesn’t. No.
00:34:19:08 –> 00:34:26:17
Sometimes a rain, you know how you get a rainstorm or something that washes some of that out. It could have been a long go. Although your dad only blasted up, so he
00:34:26:17 –> 00:34:27:28
Did glass him away down. He
00:34:27:28 –> 00:34:31:00
Knew the last, I mean that did help. We kind of knew his direction he was headed at.
00:34:31:00 –> 00:34:36:16
Did he go very far from that spot or could your dad tell Like from where I last saw him and then did
00:34:36:16 –> 00:34:39:28
He go very did happened to where he was, was it half mile or mile or what was
00:34:39:28 –> 00:34:47:22
It? Yeah, from where I shot him, he ended up going 495 yards. Okay. So I mean it wasn’t a crazy distance, but still more than he’d like. Yeah.
00:34:47:22 –> 00:34:48:28
Especially in thick country.
00:34:49:20 –> 00:34:58:16
Yeah. But yeah, after being so, you know, low all day and ending good. I mean just high roller coaster. Oh yeah. And just bo hunting for you.
00:34:59:09 –> 00:35:02:05
That’s right. You love it and hate it and then you love it, you know
00:35:02:07 –> 00:35:04:11
Exactly when, when it worked out. You love it.
00:35:05:14 –> 00:35:09:15
You mentioned, you mentioned your rocky, that was back in the Ruby days, right? Yeah, back
00:35:09:15 –> 00:35:11:06
In Nevada. That was back in the, in the hayday
00:35:11:10 –> 00:35:14:09
Nevada had a giant Rams in the, in the rubies. What
00:35:14:09 –> 00:35:19:13
Were you, 13 or something? 13 or 14. Evan drew the one non resident titles. How old were you?
00:35:19:19 –> 00:35:21:05
Yeah, I was 16. 16.
00:35:21:09 –> 00:35:22:19
Sorry. Well you were young and
00:35:22:19 –> 00:35:24:16
It was, what did he end up going like when?
00:35:24:28 –> 00:35:25:27
Nineties one or something?
00:35:26:14 –> 00:35:29:29
Yeah, he netted one 90 in growth like 1 92. Yeah,
00:35:30:00 –> 00:35:30:09
Yeah,
00:35:30:09 –> 00:35:34:21
That was, that was when they had just John. Yeah. You drew the one non resident tag. I mean we knew you. Yeah.
00:35:34:21 –> 00:35:37:24
That goes back to when John says little kids should draw tags. Yeah.
00:35:37:24 –> 00:35:41:10
You’re probably the in initiated those feelings of John.
00:35:42:05 –> 00:35:54:01
John always. John always says, I don’t know if you’ve listened to podcasts, but he hates it when the kids draw wazoo crazy tags. We’ve all been trying to draw and we’re old. But anyway, you’ve had some great hunts over the course of time for sure.
00:35:55:21 –> 00:36:26:28
Absolutely luck out a few times. But yeah, this bull, that was funny. So that first morning when we were looking at him, I sent some pictures to my little sister, she, she loves hunting too. And she said, is that as big as he looks? And I said, yeah, yeah, he is. He’s big as he looks. So she tells me, well why don’t you go kill him? And I mean, I’m saying, well there he know wind’s bad, don’t wanna spook him out, this and that. And so she says, well, are you gonna kill him? And I said, well, you know, I sure hope so. But doesn’t always work out that way. But this time it luckily did
00:36:26:28 –> 00:36:27:19
This time it did.
00:36:28:08 –> 00:36:30:00
It’s awesome. Well we all right.
00:36:30:06 –> 00:36:30:24
We appreciate
00:36:30:24 –> 00:36:48:01
You coming, telling, making it come to life a little bit and yeah, that’s awesome. I guess when you least expect it, something can happen. I don’t know. And then I again guess, I guess, I don’t know, I don’t know what your dad’s gonna go right back or not or fee’s gonna stick to a gun. We’ll find out here in a month, I
00:36:48:01 –> 00:36:52:24
Guess. I guess you gotta figure out how to, to spend your cover credit on some optics or something. Yeah.
00:36:52:28 –> 00:36:54:09
So yeah, I’m gonna have to,
00:36:54:24 –> 00:36:59:00
They’ll be thinking you’ve got about everything already, but they also invent new things
00:36:59:00 –> 00:37:02:12
Every day. Yeah. They sell new guns, new optics every day. So
00:37:02:15 –> 00:37:05:00
There’s new stuff coming out all the time. All
00:37:05:00 –> 00:37:09:18
Right, well Nevin, appreciate your time and hope you’re doing well. We’ll see it in Salt Lake or something next month.
00:37:09:24 –> 00:37:11:10
Yeah, sounds good guys. Alright,
00:37:11:10 –> 00:37:13:11
Congrats again. Just a James,
00:37:13:18 –> 00:37:14:24
You’ll see next month I’ll be expo.
00:37:15:05 –> 00:37:16:27
Congrats man a lot. Talk
00:37:16:27 –> 00:37:18:07
To you soon. Thanks. We’ll see you guys later.
00:37:18:20 –> 00:37:19:04
Bye. Bye.
00:37:20:16 –> 00:37:25:18
Pretty awesome. Yeah, I’m glad he brought up that sheep. That was a long time. Oh, and then it was just a couple years after that we were
00:37:25:25 –> 00:37:32:13
Salivating when he killed that round and And you think those things are gonna last forever? Last forever. And everything changes. And now here we are.
00:37:32:15 –> 00:37:35:03
Did that have a date on that picture? Logan probably
00:37:35:13 –> 00:37:36:25
Find it. We say 16 minus 33.
00:37:36:26 –> 00:37:38:04
Yeah. So 17, 18,
00:37:38:04 –> 00:37:40:06
He posted that one in Yeah, 20 years.
00:37:40:18 –> 00:37:41:10
What year was it?
00:37:41:10 –> 00:37:46:19
21 20 20 2005. I thought I said 15 was when he posted it, but he also said it was a throwback, so
00:37:46:25 –> 00:37:48:13
Oh, okay. Yeah. Nevermind. Yeah, I know
00:37:48:19 –> 00:37:49:07
That was killed.
00:37:49:15 –> 00:37:53:04
2000 fiveish. Yeah, they didn’t have, let’s put it, they didn’t have Instagram when he killed that.
00:37:53:21 –> 00:38:02:15
No, they had MySpace. I don’t even know if they had that actually. Yeah, no, no, exactly. And that was before digital. Remember the digital pictures? I mean that was, that was, that’s
00:38:02:18 –> 00:38:15:17
Ram there. They desert sheep. I guy vin on right there to the lower right. Yeah, right there. That was, I don’t know what year that was. That might have been a throwback too, but that was an awesome, awesome ram out in the Utah ante. All
00:38:15:17 –> 00:38:18:11
Right. Anyway, let’s, geez, let’s,
00:38:18:27 –> 00:38:22:28
Let’s talk about another big six. I want a big elk. I mean, I’m fired up. Four,
00:38:23:09 –> 00:38:25:21
Six is what you want, right? That’s, that’s kind of,
00:38:25:21 –> 00:38:26:22
Let’s make it happen this year somehow.
00:38:26:28 –> 00:38:41:29
That’s kind of my goal at some point in life when I get big. All right, let’s, let’s call Craig Sanchez, super good guy. He is retired from the New Mexico game and fish. But one of those guys that just is a hard hunt and sucker and he had a lot of points.
00:38:42:03 –> 00:38:46:06
He missed a lot of points too. And it was, he retired. He retired and then used them
00:38:46:17 –> 00:38:56:05
Every year he, we’d go over the options and just one of those things, you wanna make the right choice and you’re always nervous to use them and anyway, finally just did it. So let’s call and get his story.
00:39:06:04 –> 00:39:06:19
Hey man.
00:39:06:26 –> 00:39:07:21
Hey. What are you doing?
00:39:08:19 –> 00:39:10:09
Oh, just trying to earn some gas money.
00:39:11:19 –> 00:39:11:28
Yeah.
00:39:12:02 –> 00:39:12:23
What does that mean?
00:39:12:26 –> 00:39:15:23
That’s called the retirement check. That’s plenty for gas.
00:39:16:11 –> 00:39:24:04
Well you gotta be able to put gas in the truck to go run around through the woods. Right. You can never have enough gas money.
00:39:24:11 –> 00:39:26:05
I always think they made state cards for that.
00:39:26:12 –> 00:39:28:17
Well they used to but you didn’t have one of those anymore
00:39:28:17 –> 00:39:30:01
Used to. That’s right. Right.
00:39:31:09 –> 00:39:32:27
Oh, how you been? Good,
00:39:33:18 –> 00:39:36:21
Good man. Winter finally showed up. It got cold this week and
00:39:36:22 –> 00:39:41:04
Oh it did up here finally. We were 65 degrees until Wow. Last
00:39:41:04 –> 00:39:44:11
Week and then it got cold. Yeah. Last couple days. Really cold. Yep.
00:39:44:24 –> 00:39:48:06
Yep. Same over here. Did you got a whole lot of moisture with it? No. Cold
00:39:48:06 –> 00:39:48:13
Weather.
00:39:48:26 –> 00:39:53:21
We were watching some radar and it looked like it hit a little bit in central New Mexico yesterday day before. Yeah,
00:39:53:21 –> 00:39:55:04
A little bit. Little bit. Yep.
00:39:55:25 –> 00:40:03:18
Well good. Well, all right, so we want to hear the story on, on your Arizona bull. It’s one of those things, you’ve had a lot of points saved up for many, many years.
00:40:04:06 –> 00:40:22:26
Arizona. Arizona. It’s kind of a bittersweet deal, man. You know, you, you start applying for Arizona and you’re excited and you really wanna go hunt these premium units and then 28, 29 years later you finally draw the tag and it’s like, man, am I excited about this or not? Or
00:40:22:26 –> 00:40:23:12
Am I nervous?
00:40:23:12 –> 00:40:24:12
There’s some pressure. This is
00:40:24:25 –> 00:40:25:10
Three decades.
00:40:25:24 –> 00:40:28:14
Yeah, you got three decades riding on
00:40:28:14 –> 00:41:07:16
This. Yeah, it’s a long time. Long time. And I, when I started the process, I was really wanting to hunt unit nine. Yeah. And I kind of here in the last few years, I’ve kind of stuck to that unit, unit nine and 10 early rifle is what I’ve been applying for early bus loader and finally drew the tag and never set foot in the unit. So I started doing all my research. In fact, you guys also provided me with a list of past clients. So that was helpful. Yeah. Talked to a lot of people. Learn, learn the unit virtually. And I decided I was just gonna go out there and just go do it, do it on my own and go hunt.
00:41:07:22 –> 00:41:13:08
It’s hard to scout the rut without being in the rut. Yeah. It’s hard, you know, so then you kind of just do it as you go,
00:41:13:15 –> 00:41:20:12
Roads and glass and points and that type of thing. And it’s what March when you find out you draw ’em because it’s like spring and you’re, it’s pretty
00:41:20:12 –> 00:41:23:12
Flat, maybe you need them talking to you.
00:41:23:12 –> 00:42:40:00
Exactly. Yeah, exactly. So I kind of went in with the mindset that, you know, I’m going for the experience. I love to kill a giant bull like everybody. And you know, that’s the goal. But at the same time, I just wanted to go do the Arizona experience and no matter how it turned out I was gonna be okay with it. And like you said, it’s thick and flat in that country, right? Yeah. And sometimes you can’t look at all the bulls ’cause they’re bug in, but you can’t see ’em. So, you know, the bull I actually shot, it was kind of a, I didn’t have a but a few seconds to decide if I was gonna shoot him or not. Just for the simple fact that it’s so thick and when you put eyes on him, you may not see him again. Yeah. So it was, you know, I guess I went out four or five days early to go scout and learn the unit and I was fortunate to meet some good people out there that even turned me on with some tips and information. And opening day started and there was a, a big bull that some guys I met were kind of turned me on to and we were actually trying to kill that bull. And I got to experience the, the Arizona caravan hunting, I guess is what I’ll call.
00:42:40:18 –> 00:42:41:10
Oh yeah. Could,
00:42:41:12 –> 00:42:44:03
Could, you could put Utah in front of that too, or Yes. What
00:42:44:03 –> 00:42:45:04
About New Mexico Orx?
00:42:46:15 –> 00:42:47:21
Yeah. Well, yeah,
00:42:48:00 –> 00:42:51:01
That, did you have a starting, did you have a starting line down there in unit nine?
00:42:51:01 –> 00:43:28:04
No, I mean they didn’t have a checkered flag that went off, but it felt, I drew the early, I had the early rifle tags, so there were only 20 tags in the unit. Yeah. Which is good. Yeah. And the opening morning there was about, I don’t know, 10 vehicles that, that I saw come through into the area where we were at and kind of come to find out another, or I guess some other guys or an outfitter had also seen this bull that we were looking for. And it’s hard to compete with an army. Yeah. And they, it is. And they, they killed, they killed that big bull opening day, which is fine. It’s public land. That’s, that’s how it goes. Do you
00:43:28:04 –> 00:43:33:06
By, by yourself Drake? Like literally by yourself? I, I might have missed it. Are you literally alone?
00:43:34:05 –> 00:43:42:06
Well, I was alone, but I, I hooked up with some guys out there. Okay. That, that were very helpful that, that knew the unit and hunted it a lot. Okay.
00:43:42:08 –> 00:43:45:07
And kind of were a couple glasses or so and put you onto a Yeah, a couple.
00:43:45:21 –> 00:43:48:19
Yeah. They, they were helping me out with their information on this bull,
00:43:49:13 –> 00:43:55:23
The bull that got killed, the bull that got killed. Just real quick that, you know, that you were kind of after, what did he end up going?
00:43:56:27 –> 00:44:09:12
I don’t know what he scored, but he was, he was a big bull. I saw a picture of of him dead and he was a big bull. I, I don’t know if he had eight or seven, eight by seven, something like that. But kind of broke him up. He was, he was a good
00:44:09:12 –> 00:44:11:06
Bull. Like three nineties in tech or something.
00:44:11:21 –> 00:44:25:13
Probably. Yeah, probably. So, yeah. Now he was a real good bull. So the, you know, so that kind, that kind of hurt a little bit like the bull you were hoping to to to kill got killed. So what you do is you move on and you find another one, right?
00:44:25:24 –> 00:44:31:10
Yeah. Well and there’s a bunch of people that gotta leave now. So hopefully frees up a little space in the forest.
00:44:31:10 –> 00:44:33:15
Hopefully the caravan exits the area
00:44:34:07 –> 00:45:16:28
And they did. Yeah. And they sure did. So now you got the place to yourself. Right. Yeah. So with that being said, I looked at a lot of bulls and what I was seeing is bulls are starting to break and I almost feel like some of the bigger bulls were almost pulling off some of the cows. Just ’cause you weren’t seeing those giant bulls with cows, just good bulls. Yeah. And ultimately, I think it was the third day of the hunt, I probably should have waited. My, my wife was kind of mad that I didn’t hunt the full seven days, but on day three I was in on a group of bulls. And as you guys know, when they’re heading to their bed bedding areas, they, they travel a few miles. They almost
00:45:16:29 –> 00:45:19:28
Can’t catch ’em. Well you, you get behind them and you can’t catch ’em. No,
00:45:20:03 –> 00:46:01:07
It’s, well I caught ’em, but you’re right. You get behind them and they’re just moving. Yeah. Yeah. And there was, I don’t know, five or six bulls that were bugling and moving off into their bedding areas and I snuck in on four of ’em, looked at ’em and when I say snuck in, I’m talking like 20 yards sneaking in. Wow. Because it’s so thick in there. Nice bulls, you know, probably 300 to three 20 class bulls. And finally one bull caught my eyes, I got a glimpse of him going through the trees and he had, he had a lot longer times than those other bulls I’ve been seeing. And I kind of kept staying on him and, and I’m, and I probably shouldn’t tell you this, but I’m going to. Okay.
00:46:02:06 –> 00:46:02:16
It’s gonna
00:46:02:17 –> 00:46:07:19
Be good. Keep you juicy unit, unit nine borders. The Grand Canyon National Monument. Yeah.
00:46:07:23 –> 00:46:09:25
Park, it’s actually called Park. Yeah.
00:46:10:07 –> 00:46:11:10
Or park called the park
00:46:11:15 –> 00:46:12:12
Monument. We call it the hard park.
00:46:12:16 –> 00:46:24:25
You know, basically you can’t hunt it. Yeah. So you can call it whatever you want. Off limits. Got those. Yeah, that’s right. They’ve got those helicopter tours. Oh,
00:46:25:00 –> 00:46:25:07
Oh
00:46:25:14 –> 00:46:41:09
Yeah. And those helicopters would swing down south and make a loop and they’d come over unit nine and then they’d loop back around, back into the park and every time one of those helicopters would fly over my head, I’d close the distance on those. Yeah.
00:46:41:09 –> 00:46:46:26
Make noise. It’s kinda like Jets. Jets. When you get a loud jet move, you make a move on a bed of deer. Yeah.
00:46:47:09 –> 00:47:07:05
Right, right. And keep in mind, I didn’t have a clue what this bull was or how big he was. So finally I got in position and I could see his legs coming through the trees and of course the wind’s Right. Otherwise he would’ve blown out a long time ago. And he walks through this opening and I could just see he was really, really long.
00:47:07:24 –> 00:47:10:06
He’s long everywhere. His hit fours and
00:47:10:06 –> 00:47:22:06
Threes and yeah, he was really long and you know, you either shoot him or you let him walk and you never see him again. Yeah. Yeah. So, so I decided to kill him and I don’t know, the shot was like 45 yards
00:47:22:14 –> 00:47:24:24
And just in the thick pj, just thick trees even
00:47:24:29 –> 00:47:27:04
Even Adam six five Creedmore could do that. Oh
00:47:27:04 –> 00:47:27:09
Yeah.
00:47:27:29 –> 00:47:29:28
Yeah. I bet it this
00:47:30:02 –> 00:47:31:22
Guy over here, you know, geez,
00:47:32:28 –> 00:47:35:00
We’ve been teasing him about that. But anyway, keep
00:47:35:00 –> 00:47:39:24
Going. Well yeah, yeah. You know, make sure he takes pictures of that so you know, he’s not lying about it. Yeah.
00:47:41:09 –> 00:47:42:25
Morgan’s got a video, whatever I kill,
00:47:43:02 –> 00:47:44:23
We cover the bullet. That’s right. Alright.
00:47:45:04 –> 00:47:45:24
Right, exactly.
00:47:46:04 –> 00:47:53:21
So you smoke him at 45 and now you’re like, okay, I’m gonna walk up on what, what I was looking through, through my scope and hope he is as big as he looked.
00:47:54:06 –> 00:47:58:19
Pretty much. That’s exactly how it is. And, and you can’t have any regrets when you pull that.
00:47:59:00 –> 00:48:03:06
No. And when you look at him at 45 yards on any kind of power optic, you’re
00:48:03:06 –> 00:48:06:25
Also trying to govern your brain. And what you’re really seeing,
00:48:06:25 –> 00:48:10:24
You’re looking, looking at bloodlines and they look big, you know? Right. I mean, it’s just, Ugh,
00:48:11:11 –> 00:48:27:12
It’s hard. Exactly. So, you know, I made the, I already made up my mind that when I pulled the trigger, I’m not gonna have any regrets. Yeah. I’m there, I’m there for the experience and, you know. Yeah. He didn’t go, he didn’t go 10 yards and, and was expired there. Yeah. And walk up to him and
00:48:28:08 –> 00:48:28:21
He’s awesome.
00:48:28:26 –> 00:48:54:12
You know, he, he’s a good bull. He is an old bull. He is probably eight and a half based on his lower jaw. So, I mean, he was an old bull. Yeah. Yeah. And, and yeah, I was happy with him. I, I was fortunate to have those guys help me pack him out, you know, we had to pack him out about a mile. Yeah. So it was, it was bittersweet. It was bittersweet. But I went and got my Arizona bull, so that’s a good thing.
00:48:54:27 –> 00:49:05:28
Well, and he’s awesome. Would you, do you, would you do it any different, looking back on it, would you, you know, choose some different unit or a different weapon? Would you go archery? I mean, you, you’ve thought about everything over the years.
00:49:06:03 –> 00:49:25:09
Yeah, yeah. The, the unit is exceptional. It was, it lived up to the hype of the high bolded cow ratio for sure. Luckily, there was a lot of bugling activity, but, you know, looking at it, I think, granted, I’ll never draw that tag again, but an archery tag in that unit would be off the charts. Really would. Yeah. Yeah.
00:49:26:02 –> 00:49:32:08
So you’re the only, yeah. Maybe you’d have said, well, you could have hunted 10 years sooner, probably. Maybe, I don’t know. Roughly. Yeah.
00:49:32:18 –> 00:49:33:02
Probably could have
00:49:33:09 –> 00:49:44:16
If you did a bow. But I mean, you’re also retired last, last year, whenever. And so it’s, you can’t really complain about that either. You had all the time you wanted without any other Yeah. Pressures of work or things like that.
00:49:45:06 –> 00:49:59:29
Yeah, exactly. And I think if there was anything that could be different, I think I would’ve went out there. I, I had intentions of going out there in the summertime just to learn the unit. Yeah. And just never made it over there. And so here we go. What did
00:49:59:29 –> 00:50:10:09
You, how did you feel about the Antler Grove last year in nine? I know it kind of varies unit to unit in Arizona, depending on when the, when and where, you know, the moisture falls, but what was your thoughts on that?
00:50:10:11 –> 00:50:49:16
What, what I saw and just in talking with, you know, local game wardens over there and people, and there was really strong antler growth on the front end. Right. You know, spring had good moisture, and then everybody I talked to and, you know, I talked to several guides out there that were looking for, for elk for clients, and everybody told me that they just don’t have the top ends that they normally do in that unit. Yeah. And I, I almost, I almost turned my tag back in and then I thought, you know, let’s, I’m getting older and I just, I just wanna go hunt. And sometimes, you know, just going hunting in a great spot is, is worth it. Good
00:50:49:16 –> 00:50:52:13
Stuff can happen. Yeah. And a good unit. And it’s not like you had
00:50:52:15 –> 00:51:23:03
A average. I think that’s a good average unit. And I think that’s a good perspective. As we, Adam and I get older too. I mean, we’re the, you know, Craig, what we’ve known each other 20 plus years. Right. I mean, it just, you, you do change a little. You have an appreciation for the hunt, and it’s not just, you don’t just say the results hunt. This is about the experience. So I don’t feel guilty when I, if I underachieve or if the public perceives that I underachieve and all this pressure. You do feel that way. Like you feel like it is more about the experience or the kids or whatever it is,
00:51:23:13 –> 00:51:56:17
You know what I mean? Exactly. Yeah. That’s exactly right. And, you know, you guys have killed a lot of animals and you know, for me it gets to a point, like, I’ve shot a lot of elk in my life and it’s, it’s just another elk and it’s another elk hunt that’s gonna generate those memories for you. And any bull that’s three 30 or bigger, they’re all big, you know, it comes down to time length basically. They’re, they’re all big mature animals and just getting to be able to, to hunt them and have that experience, it’s, I kind of put in perspective, don’t get me wrong, we all wanna kill that giant, but yeah.
00:51:56:21 –> 00:52:34:19
400 or something crazy. But you, you’ve had a lot of great experiences in New Mexico and you’ve, you’ve also done it on some of those odd seasons. Right. You know, and different things with, you know, and then of course, I mean, you just put in, put in your time and really, and a lot of effort into that. What’s your opinion changing states a little bit? Like what’s your opinion about New Mexico? We’re a little nervous. Obviously it’s dry here, maybe a little bit dry there, but New Mexico’s just such an awesome state. You and I’ve talked a lot about it and Adam as well, just, you know, as far as, you know, drought sensitive, but, but yet there’s a lot of big country and bulls that aren’t named like we have here in
00:52:34:20 –> 00:53:02:22
Utah. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. No, New Mexico is still a, a fantastic destination for big game hunting across the board. And, you know, you do have certain areas like the, the Gila where you’ve, people are just pounding it, shed hunting, scouting, all the above. But there’s so many other units that can produce giants and like you said, there’s, there’s critters out there that nobody knows about, and then they just show up randomly and it’s like, where the heck did that guy come from?
00:53:02:29 –> 00:53:05:22
Yeah. And in crazy places, wide open desert stuff.
00:53:06:00 –> 00:53:06:18
Yep. Crazy places.
00:53:06:28 –> 00:53:11:29
Low, low densities, produce giants. It seems like weird. We do odd units producing giants.
00:53:12:21 –> 00:53:25:04
That’s exactly right. And anymore these darn elk are so habitual to things. I mean, you could find elk almost anywhere in the state anymore, and it’s just crazy where they turn up. Yeah.
00:53:26:06 –> 00:53:35:27
A little bit like Arizona too. I mean, it’s some great elk habitat and a lot of good to marginal, but elk are like cotes. They, they can live about anywhere and so That’s
00:53:35:27 –> 00:53:36:09
Exactly right.
00:53:36:13 –> 00:53:40:03
They’ll figure it out and where they want to, where they go and be left alone for a bit. They’ll call it
00:53:40:07 –> 00:53:42:11
Elk out in that orx country. I mean just
00:53:42:19 –> 00:53:44:09
Oh, I know. It’s insane. Yeah.
00:53:44:20 –> 00:53:55:06
And even southern Arizona, they push way deep down in like 28 and I mean, you got, Cho is six, eight feet high and they’re living in bad stuff down there.
00:53:55:24 –> 00:54:06:01
I can’t believe even the places you’ve got big mul deer, two in New Mexico, like yeah, we’ve got the traditional unit tubes and fives and sevens and all that. But man, there’s a lot of countrys, there’s a lot of country in that state.
00:54:06:01 –> 00:54:17:25
There is. And then, you know, you, you hear a giant buck turning up and, you know, unit 15 or even farther south and 23 or 27. I mean, it’s just crazy. We’re, we’re a big mule can, can turn up in this state. Yeah.
00:54:19:17 –> 00:54:30:09
Well, well it’s pretty awesome. I sure appreciate the story and a little bit of feedback. Yeah. I mean it keeps, it’s just dawon, the bull’s incredible. It looks like he has big old fours to me big thirds, big front
00:54:30:16 –> 00:54:30:27
Heavy.
00:54:30:27 –> 00:54:31:06
He does,
00:54:31:06 –> 00:54:36:16
Doesn’t look, look like maybe some flaking chips, but nothing, nothing giant. Yeah,
00:54:36:16 –> 00:54:37:29
He’s a little broke on the left side.
00:54:38:19 –> 00:54:40:22
Yeah. Soar in a second maybe looks like a little
00:54:40:22 –> 00:54:41:22
Bit. That’s exactly
00:54:41:22 –> 00:54:57:17
Right. But I mean, not missing half the time or anything, so he’s still pretty intact for units like that, which, you know, after an oral archery hunt and deep into the deeper into the rut and a lot of, a lot of bulls like, like you’ve talked about, fend off and fight and all that, he’s pretty
00:54:57:17 –> 00:55:00:22
Intact. You, you probably know a pretty good tax service that could fix some of that.
00:55:01:02 –> 00:55:03:10
Yeah, I know a guy, I probably do that. So
00:55:04:18 –> 00:55:06:13
Craig’s a man of all trades. He does
00:55:06:15 –> 00:55:12:00
A little everything. And here’s, here’s the sad thing, he’s just went into the stack of antlers that need to be mounted someday.
00:55:13:13 –> 00:55:20:04
Well, that’ll pick up a lot of room in a house. Elk, not like deer. Yeah. I mean, ope or COOs deer. You can stuff them about Anyway, I
00:55:20:04 –> 00:55:22:07
Mean, how many elk can you hang in your house? You know, six
00:55:22:07 –> 00:55:27:24
Well upside down on a bar. Quite a few. Yeah, that’s right in your that’s what I’ve got. I just Well that’ll,
00:55:27:24 –> 00:55:28:16
That’ll do it.
00:55:28:20 –> 00:55:37:15
Yeah. Yeah. No big old pipe bar hanging down. Yeah. Well anyway, good stuff. We sure appreciate you and appreciate the time. Yeah,
00:55:37:19 –> 00:55:45:28
I, I I can tell you the bugling was off the charts. Those bulls screamed all night long at camp. Really? And it was just, it was pretty intense. Yeah.
00:55:45:28 –> 00:55:48:11
That’s awesome. That’s awesome. Well that adds to it. It’s, there’s
00:55:48:11 –> 00:55:52:10
Times times when nine doesn’t have a lot of bugling. Those years are rough on guys. Yeah,
00:55:52:10 –> 00:55:58:19
It is because it’s flat and thick like you, like you found out. If they’re not talking in there, they can be pretty tough.
00:56:00:04 –> 00:56:04:00
We appreciate the little insight on the, on the hard park boundary and Yeah.
00:56:04:06 –> 00:56:07:10
Huh. Huh. Let the helicopters be your friend. That’s what I’m hearing.
00:56:07:24 –> 00:56:08:00
Absolutely.
00:56:08:02 –> 00:56:11:10
Yeah. You could’ve been cussing them, but man, it helped out. Hey.
00:56:11:27 –> 00:56:12:06
Yeah,
00:56:12:23 –> 00:56:13:07
Exactly.
00:56:13:18 –> 00:56:15:17
You got a lemon, turn it into lemonade.
00:56:16:14 –> 00:56:21:23
Don’t be, there you go. Don’t be mad at all the survey helicopters up there, everybody. Right. That’s right. Never know. Might
00:56:21:23 –> 00:56:23:22
Help you use them to your advantage. Yeah.
00:56:24:08 –> 00:56:28:12
All right. But overall you feel like things are good in New Mexico, all tons of species.
00:56:28:14 –> 00:56:45:10
Oh yeah. Things are good. You know, I think the game department reduced some pronghorn, northeast, immature and yeah, immature and, and dope tags this year. ’cause the numbers are dropping, but other than that, you know, everything’s still going, going strong as far as opportunities. Well, and
00:56:45:10 –> 00:57:29:00
They, they were saying like, it looks like, you know, the, the Fondo ratios and and whatnot are, are down the, the fond survival’s really low in that area and part of it’d be drought and grasses aren’t growing and hiding. The fa and the coyote predations high and all of these things are adding up over the course of time, you know, and then they do. And then I guess, you know, of course we have the over the counter private land issue tags and they put a cap on that and July 1st you can, you know, it’s first come, first serve. So trying to limit some of those tags too with just, I mean, as you have decreasing populations overall, maybe decrease the buck take as well. But anyway, there was, seems like there’s a few challenges feels like drought related, you know, long term drought related, but
00:57:29:26 –> 00:57:43:19
Right. Anyway, well predation, even with that being said, I mean there’s still giant pronghorn that are growing each year in this state, so Yeah, opportunity’s still great. Yeah. Guy can get a tag and go chase him and think Adam’s a pronghorn guy. Right?
00:57:44:01 –> 00:57:47:29
He is, he is just, he always complains that New Mexico doesn’t give enough non-resident tags.
00:57:48:10 –> 00:57:50:13
I do not. I do. Yeah, we do.
00:57:50:15 –> 00:57:51:28
We, you and I complain about that.
00:57:52:02 –> 00:57:53:13
Well, yeah, but I mean, we want
00:57:53:15 –> 00:57:55:11
More non-resident tags down there,
00:57:55:25 –> 00:57:58:10
Down there. Well we, we just want tax. I’d
00:57:58:10 –> 00:57:59:13
Be complaining too if I didn’t
00:57:59:13 –> 00:58:00:19
Leave, just want tax. That’s all.
00:58:01:01 –> 00:58:06:24
Is is that, would you say it’s one of the top states to be a resident of just regardless of the politics?
00:58:08:09 –> 00:58:16:16
Yeah, politics aside is, I mean the, he opportunities are off the charts, man. I mean, you got so much stuff you can hunt here and there’s over the counter stuff and
00:58:16:16 –> 00:58:21:07
You’ve even brought stuff in from Africa to just keep hunting in the wintertime. I mean, you got barbre
00:58:21:14 –> 00:58:22:04
Take up space
00:58:22:12 –> 00:58:23:21
And I mean, geez. Yeah,
00:58:24:01 –> 00:58:27:01
Exactly. And if you haven’t hunted an orx, you really need to, because
00:58:27:10 –> 00:58:28:22
I’m gonna find out in about 10 days,
00:58:29:23 –> 00:58:31:03
You’s got a tag, we just,
00:58:31:03 –> 00:58:33:09
Just about time. Yeah, you’re gonna love it. Yeah.
00:58:33:16 –> 00:58:35:23
Him a turbo charged truck so he can beat the competition.
00:58:35:25 –> 00:58:42:19
No, we’re gonna just, we’re gonna let the dust settle and just ease in. Or drinking a, drinking a coke and yeah. See what we can
00:58:42:19 –> 00:58:55:18
Find. Yeah. Yeah. My, yeah, I was gonna give you my advice was when they do the checkered flag and everybody goes, just sit there and wait till everybody leaves and then mosey on down the road. Stop. And then they’ll shoot what they, then you can shoot what they drove by.
00:58:55:19 –> 00:58:56:23
Yeah. There we go. Yeah.
00:58:57:02 –> 00:59:00:12
Do you feel like that’s one of the best, the best hunts New Mexico offers? Really?
00:59:02:02 –> 00:59:11:00
It’s one of the funnest fun. Yeah, it’s, it’s easy. It’s fun. I mean, you’re not hiking through the mountains all day. You’re driving around glassing. Yeah,
00:59:11:16 –> 00:59:11:23
I’m
00:59:11:23 –> 00:59:19:21
Looking forward to it. My daughter and I drew together, you might have heard before. So yeah, I’m really looking forward. She’s wanted one of those, I actually put in the car for the last two years. We said we better go try that
00:59:19:26 –> 00:59:20:09
Adam’s
00:59:20:09 –> 00:59:26:21
Bad luck. And then, then this year I’m like, she’s been wanting, she just thinks they look cool and I’m like, all right, I’ll put in with you. And we drew
00:59:26:26 –> 00:59:30:03
It must be my luck. It’s just, it’s so unfortunate. Good. So
00:59:30:03 –> 00:59:30:22
Looking forward to it.
00:59:30:25 –> 00:59:31:01
But
00:59:31:05 –> 00:59:37:09
What range are you on Adam Roads? Oh yeah. You’re in a good spot. Yeah. Hit me up if you want some spots.
00:59:37:27 –> 00:59:39:00
Yeah, looking forward to it.
00:59:39:10 –> 00:59:41:09
I got my, I got my favorite spots over there.
00:59:41:22 –> 00:59:42:12
Oh my head.
00:59:43:08 –> 00:59:46:27
This is a timely podcast here, Jason. Thank you. Teeing this up.
00:59:47:03 –> 00:59:53:12
Conversation. Craig would’ve been first guy, he’d be the first call. I don’t care what species or anything, he just knows the state.
00:59:53:12 –> 01:00:00:22
Looking forward to it and you know, hopefully get a, bring a couple home, bunch of awesome meat. These guys are around the office. You’ve heard so much
01:00:00:22 –> 01:00:02:20
About it. It’s best meat on planet Earth, isn’t it? And
01:00:02:20 –> 01:00:05:01
I’m, I’m gonna It’s great. Gonna ration that
01:00:05:10 –> 01:00:06:15
So makes you realize what’s,
01:00:06:15 –> 01:00:09:12
Yeah. Don’t, don’t share that with Carter. Don’t share that with anybody. Yeah,
01:00:10:11 –> 01:00:10:18
The
01:00:10:18 –> 01:00:19:26
Meat you can have. Yeah, I’ve got some elk and deer meat in my freezer. Plenty. But I might just offload that so I can fit the orcs in there if you want into that. I’ll bring it
01:00:20:11 –> 01:00:23:20
The French love horse for a reason and it’s just, it’s probably awesome.
01:00:26:17 –> 01:00:27:02
Come on
01:00:27:17 –> 01:00:32:21
Anyway. Alright. Kay. We appreciate you. Have a great day, Craig. Thanks for everything. Yeah,
01:00:32:21 –> 01:00:33:06
You guys take care.
01:00:33:17 –> 01:00:50:01
Adios. Congratulations. Take care. Alright, thanks. Bye. Let’s be done. Yeah, I, I like just a few stories once while. That was awesome. We don’t have to talk about much. We’ve talked about a little bit. Lots going on in Arizona January, 2020. Fiveish issue. Of course E mag’s online. We also have online draws. See
01:00:50:01 –> 01:00:52:00
Both those guys bowls in that magazine. Yeah,
01:00:52:09 –> 01:00:55:19
It’s great. So anyway, all right, everybody have a great weekend.
01:00:57:15 –> 01:01:46:22
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