Talking Nevada with Jack Robb. In this episode we talk with Jack Robb, Deputy Director of Nevada Department of Wildlife. We discuss the draw system in Nevada, Turn back tags, wildlife projects, game transplants, and more.

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00:00:02:29 –> 00:01:21:13
A lot of deadlines coming up due, kind of get what’s going on over in Nevada. They’ve got a lot of, a lot of options over there. Last year there was some tremendous fear taken, anything to do with Western mid games. Welcome to the Epic Outdoors Podcast, powered by Under Armour. Hey everybody, Jason Carter, Adam Bronson, John Peterson coming at you from Southern Utah. It’s warm right now, but it’s supposed to be cold. Bronson. It’s getting down to about 32, which they want to kick you off the golf course. It sound like unless it’s 40, at 40, I don’t, seems wrong. Let’s change the subject. I’m real raw about that right now. So, so bron and golfs, you can, you can let people golf all winter long or all winter long crushing the greens and everything else. But by heck, if it drops below 40 degrees when the, when something start turning green, they got armed marshals there. Well, and they, and, and, and they had to come up and talk to Bronson and, and say, tell him, Hey, when nobody’s here and the facilities are locked, that means we’re closed. Bronson’s finishing up, packing up everything in the, in the truck and driving away. Had to make it to work by eight. Well, I, dude gonna chest, I I might have got here and John and Jason fired me. I mean, is I gotta be here on time? No, no.

00:01:21:14 –> 00:02:22:05
You might get a pink slip, but it ain’t gonna be but to your a firing. But to your, but to your point, we might ride him up, right John? We might ride him up. But to your point, it is spring weather, it’s 81 day and the next day it’s 50. So it is, it’s hot out there. I was out there plugging and playing with the, you know, with the side by side trying to get it ready for the weekend. And Bronson, you know, we both got broke a sweat trying to get it serviced and unloading, loading. And it’s that time of year starting to get gear ready’s. But it’s also a lot of, lot of deadlines coming up due a lot of, a lot of happenings in May deadlines, due results coming out. And one of those is the silver state, Nevada. Yeah. I wonder if they really have a lot of silver in Nevada. What do you think? Pretty sure that’s why they got their name. Carter’s, it’s probably, it’s probably originally a lot of silver there. I don’t know. Who knows? Not the copper state or gold, but it’s silver. So I wonder if there was ever a silver rush, like the gold rush. Is there ever a silver rush? Like I have no idea. Weep silver. They’d Google for that. I dunno. We need to Google that. Chris was here, he’d Google John.

00:02:22:05 –> 00:03:46:17
Yeah, you know John, you’re a poor replacement unless you start Googling stuff. I know you on the fly. Like those other, like Joe Rogans got that kid that Google stuff, man. Like does he immediately? Yeah. Does he? Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. That’s our Chris. Yeah, Chris does that and he’ll start reading about something right there. Just 20 seconds after we talk about it. But anyway. Well, we got the following. Joe has, that’ll be at least half, don’t you think? Yeah, at least half. Alright, well anyway, well, Bronson, I think we should call Jack. Rob. He, we always like to give him a hard time this time of year and kind of get what’s going on over in Nevada. They’ve got a lot of, a lot of options over there and they, and you know, it’s a great state to apply. We’ve, we’ve never missed a year long as I can remember and maybe we just kind of check it out, see what the options are for 2022. What do you think? Let’s give ’em a call. All Jack, what are you doing? Oh, trying to catch up with a week. Oh, I thought you, where you supposed to get off of an airplane earlier today? I woke up in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Spent an hour and a half in Denver today and been in my office for about the past hour and a half. Wow. Well what were you doing out there?

00:03:46:19 –> 00:05:01:13
Is it something we can talk about or No, was it Nevada related or was it jack robbery related? No, it was, it was Nevada related. It, I truly believe we have the best draw system outta everybody and the best license and application system. It is awesome. I’m not gonna lie. We like, we like, like Bronson, Bronson went on there. How many, how many years ago did you apply for 2022? It feels like 14 years ago. I’d love, I I was on there again this morning, Jack. I, I mean, my priority, I get hungry. My, I want every tag you can give me. And then by the time deadline comes on the 10th, I, I, I realize I was, my appetite was sometimes a little bigger. I’ve got my wife kids, all that and I’m reigning in the wild choices just a little bit on women and children left and right and he’s applying, which is kind of nice. It’s $15 hunting license fee for nonresident youth. How cool is that? And that’s, it’s, it’s to get those kids addicted to coming here, get, get the parents addicted to get their sons and daughters in and build those points up too. Well, it’s a no brainer from 12 to 18. I mean, $15 license is, you know, a lot cheaper than the adult. So, so then Adam’s on there this morning and he’s already making adjustments on his choices free of charge.

00:05:01:16 –> 00:06:10:24
You need to charge people for that, Jack. No you don’t. No you don’t. Jack, you don’t, you’d make another four or 500 bucks on Broing along. No, don’t do that. I like, yeah, I, I I got on the connectivity on the airplane and started playing on my dear choices. I’m still not done, I don’t think. Yeah, see you just, you wake up onry certain days and you’re like, I don’t want to go get my butt kicked here. I thought you weren’t deviating from Tono paw. Well that’s, yeah, yeah. But but remember you get five choices. So it’s, it’s what goes along with tone Ofaw as he is worried about, Hey, I, hey, I, I truly, in the past, I don’t think I’ve ever disclosed exactly what I was doing talking to you two. Well, or or else you were lying, but Yeah, go, go ahead. Go ahead. But the problem is he could see what we do and we can’t see what he does. That’s right. He’s got, you know, I I, to be honest with you, I could see what you do, but I I don’t You don’t care. You don’t care. No, I I I’m gonna do what I’m gonna do no matter what. And I’m coming down into some of that country you like is my first choice. Yeah. Down in Lincoln. Lincoln County. Lincoln County, 24, 23, 22 13. Yeah, I’m, I’m starting there.

00:06:11:04 –> 00:07:36:03
The tag numbers are down, but that’s some of the appeal to me is less competition. Yeah. It’s gonna be a harder draw. Yeah. But there’s less competition. So I’m truly gonna start there. And then I’m skipping right over Taw and going towards Northern Washoe and with the same thought process, I’m putting in three areas up around Northern Washoe. Just the tag numbers have been down so low the past few years. I know there’s older h class bucks on the landscape. It’s gonna be a tough draw. Yeah. With, with low tag numbers. But Well, this may date you, this may date you and I and we’re good enough friends, we can do that. But do you remember when the Sheldon was good for mule deer? Clear up oh three three country, like that was the place to go. Oh one five had that late hunt antelope, antelope ender. Yeah. And they were incredible. And, and then it’s been forgotten about. And you’re, you’re telling me you’re considering going back. He didn’t say oh three three, I don’t think. No, he didn’t say that. But I I mean whether it be 12, 14, whatever, all that. Yeah. Some, some, some of those numbers are in there. Hey everybody, the genetics are there and you two know that the genetics are there and Yeah, with the load tag numbers that are being put out, we have older age class bucks on the landscape.

00:07:36:28 –> 00:08:54:11
It proved out in a couple of those areas last year, there was some tremendous error taken. So, well it’s, I I don’t have any firsthand knowledge of what’s there. I, I did spend nine days up there on a California big orange sheep hunt, didn’t run into any bucks. It would make me want to go back on that sheep hunt. But just knowing how, how low the tag numbers have been, and, and I think we got some older age class deer up there and I, I’d love to go chase ’em. You might, you might look a long time in between seeing Deere, the, the numbers are down, but with that big area, it’s gotta hide some of ’em that we can go chase. That’s one thing we like about Nevada is when you get a tag in Nevada in general, you guys in general manage fairly conservatively when you compare your state to across all the other states in the west in terms of tag numbers. And part of that has to do with habitat. I mean, you are the driest state in the nation, I believe. I think that’s true. I think Utah’s second dry. So you, but you make, make great stuff with what you have habitat wise, all that. There’s a good balance of opportunity, but also quality on almost every species. Deer, elk, antelope. I mean, all three of those when they’re on, they’re as good as anywhere.

00:08:54:11 –> 00:10:00:16
And then of course your sheep, you have more sheep tags than anywhere, you know, California and desert and, and even a few Rockies. So I mean, when you get a tag in Nevada, that’s what we like, you, you got something in general, you got something you really wanna sink your teeth into. So we’re always excited about Nevada just because hey, that’s what we like. Yeah. And it’s nice to be out there with very few people. And that’s the one thing Jackie mentioned and, and we, you have seen with this drought who hasn’t been affected, right? Like we’ve all been affected and you can’t control the weather. Like you just try to be as reactive as you can. And you know, you guys, I know I’ve seen, you know, I went from 10,000, you know, sheep on the landscape or over 10 to just over eight it seems like right in the last, what, three years or something. And so it just shows you how hard this drought can be. But at the same time, you still have tons of sheep, you still have great quality and, and you are reacting the department’s doing a good job at at reacting to that and trying to manage for that. And of course you’ve been doing water projects recently, you know, as of just a few weeks ago, if, if not sooner, more recent. Yes.

00:10:01:10 –> 00:11:24:00
We were at 10,000 desert sheep just deserts and it’s coming down and, and some of our managed at strategies to bring it strategy is to bring it down. We just, with the prolonged drought, you guys see it in Lake Powell, we see it in Lake Mead, we see it on the landscape, we see it in our guzzlers flying over a hundred thousand gallons worth of water in the guzzlers last year, building new guzzlers this year, trying to accommodate some, we actually had a couple sheep areas that we flew prior to the season in 2 82, 2 83, 2 86, that country. And we were worried about the numbers we saw on survey and, and we contacted our hunters and said, Hey guys, it’s not looking good out there. We did see a couple decent rams, but you might wanna consider turning that tag back in because we don’t think there’s enough animals on the landscape. And we had hunters turn their tags back in and we held those tags. We didn’t let ’em go to an alternate, we didn’t let ’em go first come first serve or anything like that. A couple of guys that took that chance and went hunting, they killed tremendous ranch. Oh, there was one. I talked to a guy and his wife smashed basically a 180. Yeah. You know? Yeah. And, and got that particular, got that particular letter from you and yeah, it wasn’t easy.

00:11:24:12 –> 00:12:10:25
It was tough finding, tough finding sheep, but ended up with an absolute giant and and that’s the chance you take. But if, if five people took that same chance and there was only one of those, it paid off for one person, but it wasn’t gonna pay off for five. Right? Right. So one person took the chance that paid off the rest of ’em. If they all took that same chance, it it, they would’ve burned a lot of points and, and we would’ve had disappointed customers. And, and we wanna make sure that when you do draw one of those COBIT tags, that you burn a lot of bonus points and have a lot of dreams about that. You get what you’re after. Yeah. And if, if we run into those situations, we’re gonna communicate with those hunters and make sure they, they have informed decisions to make. Yeah. Well that’s pretty awesome.

00:12:10:28 –> 00:13:42:24
And so, and then, you know, one of the things people are talking about too is, and it’s, it is just kind of, it, it, it’s interesting stuff on, on the deer tags, some of the deer tags in these, you know, some of our favorite country and maybe the most, you know, notable trophy, potential trophy producing units as of the last five years or whatever, 10 years, you know, maybe even longer, you know, is, is kind of a, a, a slash in tags, you know, in regards to obviously resulting from prolonged drought and whatnot. But like you said, it’s gonna provide an incredible opportunity for those that draw. And, and, and I know we’re still applying, you know, it is gonna be tough to draw, but man, what an incredible experience they’ll have. It, it’s going to be a, a good year to get a tag. It, it truly is. What’s the lower numbers? We, we do have, if you’re in Washoe County through central Nevada, down into southeast Nevada, our numbers are down and our, our tag numbers reflect that. But that country up there around TTUs, Aurora, Wells, Elco, that stuff north of I 80 east of Battle Mountain, those weather systems don’t come through the Sierras. They primarily come through that Oregon country. So they, they have had some different precipitation up there. They’re, they’re still drier normal, but it’s not as bad as the rest of the state.

00:13:43:13 –> 00:15:03:28
So if we look at our stage end numbers, we look at our bobcat numbers, we look at our antelope, deer, elk numbers, that, that northeast portion of the state is fairly stable on tags and even some increased tags in a couple of those areas. Yeah. Seems like areas the 1 0 1 to 1 0 9 increased. 14, correct. 15 oh sixes oh seven. Yes. Some of ’em just looks like, you know, increases up there, which is kind of a good sign too. But those, those weather patterns, they do come through the state different, they, they don’t come across the Sierras like that Central Nevada stuff and the Southern Nevada stuff. It comes in iron down through Oregon and, and they’re not as bad as the rest of the state. Yeah. What else you been working on here recently? Front burner stuff, Jack, within the department? I know you are like, Jason alluded out on some guzzler projects for sheep here in the last week or two. But I mean, I, without talking about the obvious, hey, the draws upon you in application season that’s coming to an end this next Tuesday. But what, what are the things you got on the front burner that you’ve kind, kind of been working on as a department? Well, I, a lot of it has to do with habitat and water. It really does. And I was down in Valley of Fire State Park two weekends ago building a guzzler.

00:15:05:06 –> 00:16:23:00
That’s where we fly a lot of our waters right out of Valley of Fire State Park. And we just can’t continue to hit that same habitat with limited water resources and ha So we’re trying to spread that out. We put another guzzler down there, actually tapped off the water system from Valley of Fire State Park. It’s not a guzzler that we plan on keeping in use every year, year in and out. It is kind of an a, an emergency valve. It’s something we can turn on and off with the system we can drain out. It’s going to be a heck of an addition. When I was down there in the Valley of fire, we probably saw 25 rams. A lot of them were older age class rams. No boomers, but just pretty rams. And I actually, they’re, they’re hurting for water bad enough down there. And they’ve, they’ve been educated how to get to water. I actually picked up a video of, in the group Bruce’s campground, a ram going over to a drinking fountain and smacking it with his horns and actually broke the drinking fountain start squirting to, to, to start a leak so he could get a drink. Ah, hey, well they got the head, Gary might as well use it. Gee, wow. I I I, I watched him use it a couple times. I was lucky enough to get it on video once at just out of his cell phone.

00:16:23:02 –> 00:17:41:06
But geez, when you, when you see that occurring and, and a learned behavior by a wild animal for something like that, you know, that things are pretty drastic. Better fix, better fix something instead of break fixing broken pipes and over and over now Yeah, the park people probably been blaming campers for doing that and now they’ve got proof. It wasn’t, it wasn’t them. Yes. And, and I, I I’m gonna tell you the second part of that story of building that guzzler down there, it was named after Eddie Pri and the pri crew. And Eddie Pbil is one of the founding members of the fraternity desert, big orange Sheep is in his mid eighties. And just, he’s done more for wildlife than state of Nevada than anybody I know probably been on between building Zers and g rebuilds over 200 guzzler projects for big game and, and primarily big orange sheep. And he and his, his boys and grandsons. And that project was named after him. And it was, it was, I, my boys came down ’cause of our friendship with Eddie Ble and the BLE family. And it was one of those special times to be able to, to pay tribute to some of his giving so much to their life, to the betterment of wildlife resource in Nevada. Oh, cool. Is that, that’s awesome. Yep. Well, good.

00:17:41:15 –> 00:18:58:24
So part of this you were saying is, you know, maybe with this drought and the drought conditions we’ve got, as, as you said, it’s kind of a plan thing to take some of the animals off the landscape and to, to maybe to reduce population so you can, you know, so they, you don’t have to provide so much water in it. And if we’re not gonna, if we’re gonna be in a drought, that’s kind of the nature of the beast. You can’t have as many animals as a re on a regular basis on the landscape. And so if you adjusted, you know, some of the objectives, population objectives and whatnot in some of these different units, we’re, we’re at 2 68 where we just built that goes, or we’re, we’re really trying to bring that population down through U hunts, through heavy ram harvest. But like I said, there’s a lot of old age class rams in there, but something else, and, and not just the state of Utah, but everybody that relies on desert bighorn sheep to repopulate or, or grow their existing herds, the, the muddies are still a clean population and no disease is what I’m eating. And we’re going to take some sheep outta the muddies here this summer and they’re going to go to Utah in an area that was, has a high fence around it.

00:18:59:12 –> 00:20:28:14
And it’s going to become a nursery herd for Utah and pretty much any other western state that needs clean sheep in the future. The, the way that it’s set up, it’s, it’s not going to be like a farm. It, it’s big enough that they’re, it is almost free-ranging and, but they’re gonna be protected from predation and from possible disease contact and, and we’re just going to have a place that’s an insurance policy with cooperation with our sheep and, and the state of Utah funding the project is it’s going to be a heck of an asset for everybody going forward. And we, we really look forward to those opportunities, cooperate with other states. Some of our sportsmen have actually called me and say, I can’t believe as hard as I work on those projects and stuff, you’re giving our sheep away. And the only reason we have Rockies here is ’cause other sportsmen and other agencies have given us the Rockies, our elk, a lot of our antelope, our California bighorn sheep. It it’s the generosity of, of others that allow us to have the opportunities we do here in Nevada. So it’s just our turn again to, to fill, fill in and, and give some animals to another state. But what comes around goes around. And we may be looking for animals outta that exact enclosure years down the road to repopulate an area that we lost because of disease.

00:20:29:10 –> 00:21:39:05
Well, and with, with sheep, you know, more than any other, it’s hard to say that you can’t just stockpile ’em and you know, you guys have done a great job in your own state of moving ’em to about everywhere you can suitably have them that doesn’t have threat of, you know, contact with any kind of domestics. They’re too close to town and there’s places that already do have some of those in existence that you can’t use as source herds and things like that. So it, it’s, it’s a harder concept for some people to understand. We spend so much time to grow and build sheep and as fragile and as valuable as they are, why do we just give ’em away? Well, sometimes you’re doing the best thing for that herd by keeping it productive, having turnover in that herd, reducing densities so you don’t saturate the landscape so far that now they’re just being displaced and wandering out into more fringe habitat. And that’s when you’re gonna have the likelihood of them interacting with backyard sheep and goats or something else that then you’ve got a catastrophic, you know, a true waste die off. You know, you can’t keep put the rabbit back in the, in the, in the box. It’s out now. You’re never, the the muddies are dirty forever more so. Yeah, we appreciate that as sportsman, Utah, it’s not the first time.

00:21:39:16 –> 00:22:36:25
Jason and I have both been involved in transplants and picking up sheep from you guys and bringing them to our state. We’ve had several herds, you know, and most of those have been all now met, met their objectives and so yeah, this nursery herd that’s been used in other states and, and this is a big enough enclosure that at in time, after several years, if all goes as planned, they’ll be able to then just take the surplus every year as a source herd for whether it be within Utah or yeah. Like you alluded maybe in other states. So appreciate you guys being able to do that and hopefully solve some of your problems. It doesn’t, you’re gonna have to, you know, make, you know, you still have new hunts and things like that, but overall it hopefully solve some of your short-term problems for, you know, habitat degradation and overuse in places and water dependency and all that. These big, because the muddies have had the density unlike anywhere I’ve seen in my life. And in terms of sheep number, Jason, last time we were doing the transplant, it was out of the muddies. Oh it was like the muddies is a factory, it’s just you crank some out.

00:22:36:26 –> 00:23:47:04
So we appreciate it and we’re recipients of it as a state here, but that, you know, we’re you the big sheep, take the big picture to see kind of, you know, the past, present and future because it’s, you know, what you got in front of yours right now is just no guarantee with sheep. It’s kind of a cool program too to augment that, you know, and to get that started and cranking and I don’t know, it’s kind of, it’s not like we’re taking your sheep and killing them. We’re taking ’em and then, and it’s, and it’s working, you know, developing a new project so to speak. So, and, and we used, you know, everybody thought we were just transplanting sheep in the past to grow more herds. That was half of the equation. Other half was, we had populations that were getting to densities that they scared us for being susceptible to disease. So it, we used trap of transplant as a release valve to bring numbers down in areas. And if we didn’t have this opportunity to give sheep to Utah, you would see our tag numbers higher in that unit. Well, ram and you, you tags, you’d just be higher than they’re correct. Yep. Well it’s pretty, pretty awesome. There’s a lot of, like Adam was talking about you, you know, you as well as far as the different species across the state, just incredible opportunities from sheep to elk.

00:23:47:09 –> 00:25:06:29
Elk are elk are doing great. I mean, obviously, you know, there’s not that many tags especially considering, you know, non-resident tags, but, but the quality is just, is off the charts and doing very well. And then antelope as well, not, you know, kind of, you know, maybe even somewhat the forgotten species, but I can’t believe the quality of antelope coming out of the state of Nevada last year we actually knew of a a a, a gentleman and a and his wife and they both smashed like 86 inches and it’s just, just incredible the opportunity for, for antelope across your state. We, we did see in our, in our checkout summaries, we, we asked for horn length on antelope and, and we did see a, a reduction of the 15 inch and longer antelope being checked in or you know, not checked in, but harvest report on them. But there are still just tremendous antelope and I, I know people that hunt Montana, Wyoming, and Utah for antelope and they just smile when they draw a Nevada antelope tag. They’re like, you guys know how to grow big antelope. Well, and I think part of that, when you’re seeing those reports, it’s not like they’re getting scored by Boone and Crockett scores. You’re having guys arbitrarily tell you what, how, you know, the, the length of the antelope porn, right? Correct.

00:25:06:29 –> 00:26:23:09
So it’s it’s not, I mean, you gotta kind of take it with a grain of salt. Well you figure that every, every year the same cross section of people are doing the same way and bias every year. Well you can kind a, you kind of compare as apple’s now, but I’m telling you, we knew, I mean, Wyatt and Devin killed great antelope last year. It was, it was kind of a good year. I mean from, from guys we talked to, but you know, definitely. So, but definitely population numbers too in many places are down. We’re seeing that. And your proposed, your proposed proposed tag reductions is your commission meeting what? Today? Today, tomorrow, when is that? It it, it’s tomorrow and Saturday. The, the quotas will be done Saturday. So the next couple days between end of application period, commission meeting, getting ready to pull off the draw. These are the, the two weeks around here. We, we really don’t sleep much. Yeah. As, as you’re aware, we, we have people in the office seven to seven, seven days a week to answer phone calls to, to help people get into the system or Yeah. Or get their hunter safety validated. If they’re new Hunter Nevada, they do have to have their safety card in. When we get down to those last couple days, it’s not seven to seven, it’s seven to nine, seven to 11, seven to midnight. Yeah.

00:26:23:09 –> 00:27:44:03
If the phones are ringing, we stay. Yeah. And we’re here Sunday and, and it’s not picked up by Calie. We want you talking to our staff. We bring people in, whether it’s from game fisheries, diversity, our conservation education, staff, staff, even even some of the staff in the director’s office and fiscal that have done the phones in the past, they all take a turn getting on the phones and, and we make sure you’re talking to Nevada person. So you’re getting up to date and accurate information. Not that it’s inaccurate coming from our vendor. They’re a great vendor, but we want you talking to somebody in Nevada. Well, that’s pretty cool because we deal with a lot of states and I, I gotta tell you, I don’t feel like I could pick up the phone and talk to somebody. Most, in most ins instances, most of ’em it’s a vendor and it’s 14 layers of press four, press one, press zero, you know, got a, you know, high call volumes, you know, long way expected wait time at 30 minutes. I mean, it’s just, it’s just brutal. We, we don’t have wait times. What what a wait time means to us is throw two more people on the phones. Yeah, I like it. Yeah. It’s pretty, pretty awesome customer service oriented. Well, and it is coming, you know, going through that sequence of events here. Yeah.

00:27:44:03 –> 00:29:05:28
You’ve got your commission meeting proven quotas, that’s, they’re probably doing other things, but as far as what we’re talking about today, they’re ratifying the quotas and then your draw deadline is Tuesday the 10th to get your applications in. And then you guys have kind of ramped up the expectation and and whatnot over the last several years of we wanna know a quick turnaround. We wanna, we know we wanna know the next day we’re gonna get our results on the 11th. Right. But hey, I, why can’t we do that? Yeah. I’m gonna tell you exactly why we don’t do that. And, and I, I think you have felt the pain, and I don’t mean to pick on other people, but Idaho’s had some bad draw data get out. Montana recently had some bad draw data get out. Right? We, we we’re doing test draws right now with last year’s numbers. This year’s business rules. We do three four test draws before the application period’s done. Is that what you have those Partly, partly to make what changed? What changed? I mean, you just use the same programming, can’t we? You do, but your business rules changed. Your season dates change, bonus points for people change. Yeah. You got people that should be in waiting periods. Were they able to apply? Did did they, if they had 14 bonus points last year, do they have 15 this year? Because they didn’t, they were on six.

00:29:06:11 –> 00:30:13:23
We validate the heck outta it. We have a team that validates and that, and that team comes from multiple div, three different divisions within the agency’s sequence of draw when you add the one horn, you know, management horn Exactly. You horn you used is now after the ram. Yeah. You know, and all those, which I like that you adjusted that. So we got the sequence of draw Yes. Figured out and things like that. Yeah. So there’s just so much stuff to look at and it’s our top priority to make sure when we tell somebody they did or didn’t have a tag, that we don’t have to send ’em a letter or email saying, gee, we oops. Yeah, we made a mistake. Yeah. You know, I’m, I’m not gonna say we’re gonna be bulletproof, but we’re going to go the extra mile to ensure that we’re putting out accurate information. Yeah. Well and it’s much appreciated. We, we kind of joke, you know, about the 11th, Jason wants 11th, we’ll accept the 12th. But, but hey, when you talk about the volume of application that you guys take in, and it’s a big state. I mean, there’s some other state we deal with all western states and we realize there’s some that, that we don’t, that aren’t near as popular for whatever reason from a non perspective, Nevada is one of those, it’s super popular.

00:30:14:00 –> 00:31:33:18
So for you to turn it down within about 10 days is what your goal’s been the last, I wanna say two, three years. Whenever you went down May 20th, midnight madness. Yeah. It always used to be, hey, the Friday going into Memorial Weekend, now it’s earlier than that and it’s 10 days, 10 days from the deadline is, is what your target is. That’s what you’re shooting for. And you’ve been able to meet that the last few years and announce Yeah. The whole late night Midnight madness, you know, 10 10 to midnight or whatever. Everybody’s staying up and are we having a midnight madness or is it gonna be a little earlier when people can celebrate till midnight? Well, I always like to not tell people under, under promise and over deliver. Okay. What’s, okay, let just tell us. So I I’m gonna tell you, I’m, I’m gonna tell you last year, the year before we went midnight and we, we advertised midnight Madness and, and we got ’em out right about midnight last year. We felt comfortable with where our validation was at and we got it out probably about 10 o’clock. Yeah. Your time. I was down in Yeah, yeah. 10 o’clock Nevada time. I was down, I I was down in Tal building the guzzler with QU last year when we let the results out on a Friday, we’re targeting this year with how validation went last year.

00:31:34:06 –> 00:32:57:01
And we might just have to stay up a little bit later doing validation the night before. But we’re targeting that 6:00 PM time on the 20th instead of midnight Madness. I think we’re going to go with let the adventures begin and, and whoa, new jingle. Let let people play, let ’em have a barbecue. And that’s, that’s, that’s our goal. It’s almost like gonna be a happy hour if it’s like six o’clock for everybody getting off work on a Friday. It’s like happy hour six o’clock somewhere. Well that’s, that’s exactly what we want to get to it. It used to come out Friday afternoon of more Memorial Day weekend and, and we had taxi derma shops. We had other people, they would have barbecues at their place and, and basically have a a watch party for, for the draw results. And we kinda took that away from ’em, throwing it out at midnight. But we’re gonna get back to that. I I think it’s a, a great family event. A great event with your, your friends and midnight’s a little late to be doing that. Oh, way too late for me. Yeah. I like the 6:00 PM thought. 6:00 PM your time. Seven mine and I’m in bed by, that’s 30 minutes after. That’s that’s about right. Yeah. But I, I think you know as well as I do you get to right tag you don’t go to bed. Oh yeah. So you I hope I don’t sleep.

00:32:57:09 –> 00:34:14:09
I I challenge you, I challenge you to keep me up all night. Jack. Gimme challenge you. We’ll, we’ll do, we’ll do our best. Tell Akamai I dare him to keep me up all night. If Adam’s up all night, the rest of us are up all night. He won’t let us sleep. They’re all gonna get texts and jingled all night long. You know. So, so tell us a little bit about, so when during the regular application period, we can apply for the silver state tags. That’s kind of an additional thing. It’s like a governor type tag. We get basically an August one opener for most species and you know, everybody just gets one name in the hat. Right. So we can apply, you can add that to your application list there. One name and a hat. It’s available for this year. California for the first time. Yeah. California Big horns you had, you had California. California We switched from the PIW over to a silver state. We historically hadn’t had a silver State tag in that category due to the fact that we, we don’t have the resource. And when you throw a, a heritage auction tag, a dream tag and a PIW tag that was three specialty tags. Well, and the PIW was available to the residents only and, and with this it, it was with the silver state. No, we all can apply. Yeah, it’s open.

00:34:14:17 –> 00:35:28:14
So it, it did allow more people in, but it also extended that season with the PIW it was the same tag as everybody else. September one, you just got to hunt where you wanted. Yeah. But there were some restrictions even on that because we, we didn’t wanna harvest too many out of a particular unit. So restrictions on it wasn’t really a statewide tag. There was restrictions on it, but I, I think having that tag that has a, a little earlier start time is a more coveted tag and, and it would be just you and the heritage auction tag holder out there pursuing sheep that time of year. It when you don’t have competition, they are special opportunities. So, well we did switch that over this year. One of those is exactly what I’m referring to about keeping me up night right there. So now those would, I mean, geez, the only thing is is now you’ve got what, four months to Yeah. To wait. I mean you can hunt literally anywhere in the state from August one to the end of the year for you give one of those for deer, elk antelope. Well, silver State might Desert July Cal one, I don’t remember if it is on Sheep Desert. Might be Silver State. I remember July, isn’t it July one on Cali and Desert. And, and Adam I’m glad you bring that up.

00:35:28:28 –> 00:36:29:04
You say it would keep you up if you got one of those, but I think you would keep you up if your wife got one or your kids got one or somebody even in your office got one to keep you up. And, and that’s what I try to continue to talk about Nevada, our hunting opportunities compared to other states, they’re very limited because we don’t have the resource and we try to keep a quality resource on the landscape. So Adam, my brother and my two boys and I, if we can draw one tag that gets us in the field, we will scout it. We, we will wear one tag out between four of us. We don’t Yeah. Anymore. We really don’t want four tags in a year. If we can get one or two between four or five of us, yeah. That fills our need and it, it, it, it spreads the wealth out a little bit and it it’s basically a team family event. Gotcha. And, and, and that’s how we hunt in Nevada. It’s not, not like other states where everybody, you’re on your own. You may have one on buddy.

00:36:29:13 –> 00:37:33:12
Well the Yeah, well, and I try to convince Jason of that too, to just do points only that if I draw he can come along with me and have just as, as much Well I’m telling Adam to apply his wife and children for points only so they don’t compete with him and I. Exactly. So, you know, but I, I just, I just wanna know if you put your wife and kids into the same units you do or you try to lend your own competition, what you do, it just depends. I do, but, but I also remember, I, I gotta take ’em. So I mean I, that’s what I was talking about earlier about reigning in my school, wild outlying flyers units and for deer and you know, I, any sheep tag is pretty much a gift, you know, as a non-resident. So I mean I, I do apply them for a few different years. I’ve been fortunate enough, Jason too, Jason’s killed two desert sheep in his life. I’ve killed one. So I, I kind of been be a little bit more picky about the units I personally apply for versus some of them, but that haven’t and me too. And it’s from a drying off standpoint, a little bit of an angle. Yeah. But, but hey yeah, they draw something. Yeah. Yeah. It’s, it’s all good. It’s gonna be awesome. You also have jack some, like some raffle tags.

00:37:33:12 –> 00:38:54:18
The dream tag option that would be something totally separate, you know, so different deadline. Anyway. Nevada envy dream and they can go apply there and you got, you know, ways yet, you know, June 30th is the deadline for that. And so definitely. So, so for now we have the PIW tags, which is available for non-residents on mule deer. You’re given seems like three of those. And then you got the silver state tags for the different species and then the regular draw tags as well. And the silver state don’t, doesn’t have preference or bonus points attached. And anyway, so kind of, kind of gives you some, a wide variety of opportunity there in Nevada. Yes. And like I said, the California silver state tag desks new this year. Something else new this year, I’m sure you guys saw it for residents is the one horn rho. Yeah. We do have a number of one horn rams. You guys chasing our sheep in our state. Yeah. You see ’em. They’re never harvested. They grow old that way. Looking that way. They grow old and, and yeah, I think it’s another opportunity we’re giving our sportsmen and there it’s going to be a management hunt just like a depredation hunt. There will be no bonus points for it. It’s going to be once in a lifetime. And you guys could apply for both regular and and the management. Yes.

00:38:54:20 –> 00:39:57:28
And that management hunt will be taken even after you, I I think it’s gonna go ram you and then that management hunt because we always take our management hunts last. Yeah. So it doesn’t hurt you if you’re a resident and you’re fine shooting a one horn ram. Which I mean, trust me, I’ve seen plenty of big rams i’d, Hey if I, if I could apply for it, I would be Carter. Yeah. And if you’re not gonna Yep. You know, if you’re not gonna, if it’s not gonna take my points, what, what, what’s a hurt? What does it hurt? 10 in for 10 or 15 bucks? Some people were saying and, and it, you know, that they were saying, well you couldn’t do both or whatnot. And it’s just not the case. And so no, you, you can definitely put in for both. And if you draw the one horn ram, that means you didn’t draw your your your regular ram. Yeah. Your regular ram. Because the regular ram would’ve disqualified you for your one horn. So just a little disappointed. There’s not a non-resident option there. But Jack, I’m not gonna blame you, but you’re the only person I, we can, you’re just on the, a hold of, you’re just on the phone right now. So we’re gonna look at success rate on that. It’s, it’s going to be a tough Huh?

00:39:57:28 –> 00:40:59:16
Test because you, you guys know that sometimes finding ram is difficult, but finding that one horn ram can be extremely difficult. Well give us a tag. We’ll see how it goes. The one thing, the one thing we noticed is you did unit, unit neighboring unit grouping. So it’s not like you’re just stuck in one unit. It was many ki times 2, 3, 4 units that were all neighboring. And so a lot of room to roam to be able to spread out family friends, trying to find something. Well Robinson, one of the biggest rams you ever saw was one horn, I can still remember. And it, and it goes back to he, he called me and says, gee, I smashed this room. I saw I that thing it had to be 180 5 on the one side and it was unbelievable. It was, it was amazing. Mean doubled if one side was double This was like three, three years ago, two, three years ago. It was not like Yeah. Very long ago. Yeah. Yeah. It was special. And it said one of these unit groupings. Absolutely. So it usually is the older age class rams that end up that way. Yeah. It’s not the young rams that end up that way. So yeah, they get’s sinusitis over the years and then pretty soon one takes a fall and hey, I’ve seen ’em with both of them that way.

00:40:59:16 –> 00:42:03:24
Pretty calm in the muddies places where you have lots of rams and you know, starts to sinusitis. They start banging their horns against stuff, then they get a crack in there and then it gets infected, then it’s banging it harder and then they fight other rams and pretty soon one busts off. And yeah, those units, it feels like we have high ram numbers is where I’ve seen one of our coolest, the fister twister ram that we Oh yeah. We’re in on, he was about ready to lose one side. Yeah. We killed Oh yeah, yeah. Giant ram that sold. He would’ve, he wouldn’t have made it another year with that horn. But the, well, go ahead. The other thing that was new last year that’s of interest to you guys is the archery ram hunt that we put in. I believe there was nine tags on that and seven were successful last year. Yeah. And that, that success rate kind of surprised me. But then when you think about it, if somebody’s sitting on points and they’re throwing in an archery ram tag, they’re probably gonna be pretty efficient with a boat. Well that they’re targeting like Yeah, I want that. Or Yeah. Playing the odds or whatever. And in general, you’re doing it on units where you have decent to, to high sheep numbers. They’re not usually on units. Yeah.

00:42:03:24 –> 00:43:05:21
Where you’ve got really scarce numbers and hey, we’re gonna go give a guy the worst hunt of his life. You’re, you know, so maybe we can hope as an non-residents too, that maybe that grows into an opportunity for us and the near futures well at least attacked. Seems like we’re being discriminated. We we’re being discriminated against here. Jack, I can tell you it’s not an opportunity this year, but I can tell you it is definitely being looked at as an opportunity for next year for an non-resident to get into that archery also. So we’ve got that brand situation. Yeah, we’ve got that. And then obviously the one horn we’ll look at, but then too, I know some of goats, I your, your goats that you guys had incredible surveys and whatnot offering like, you know, 14 total tags. 12 and 1 0 2. Yeah. 1 21 combo at some point, you know, it’s a good sign. I that’s a good sign for us. We, we, I can tell you, I, I feel bad for that right now because I know we do have non-residents sitting on goat points. Well, at one point they were able to apply and they just got parked on their goat points. 10. And then we do have people that were residents in the state that moved outta state that are sitting on goat points.

00:43:06:02 –> 00:44:22:09
Well, and 10% of the, I know the 10, the, the 12 being issued in one unit alone would, would, you know, warrant a non-resident tag, but may maybe the commission will look at it. I know it’s in the commission’s hands. It’s, you know, it’s the commissioners that, that, that make that decision. Well we didn’t, we didn’t set that season so there’s nothing we can do for it this year. But if I could rewind and go back to the commission meeting in, in end of January Yeah. We would’ve pushed harder to have a, a non-res. Well we’re, it’s just nice for us to know that that’s potentially coming down the pipe on the radar. That’s cool. It’s on the radar. And then same thing with the Rockies. It seems like, you know, some of the Rockies there in the rubies seem to be doing good and you know, that’s another thing. There’s, there are some good things happening even in this, you know, drought era, so to speak. So we’re, we’re doing good on the, on the goats. We really are good. Yeah. And the Rockies are coming back a little bit. Yeah, right. There’s a potential down the road that we dive into that too at some point. So, well the rubies will see a rocky tag again this year. Yeah. And it’s, it’s not in the draw for resident or non-residents. And I, I’ll tell you how that came about, kind of a cool story.

00:44:22:16 –> 00:45:42:29
It is, it’s a cool story. And we didn’t talk a lot about it just because there wasn’t even a, a res tag in the draw, but yeah. In the draw ahead, you’re gonna give one and tell us the circumstance of how you’re gonna award it. Well, it was 2009, I believe the Rockies were doing great in the Rubes and the East Humboldts and, and they were killing some just tremendous rams, mid one 90 rams. And we had a, a young gentleman draw a rocky tag and, and he was in the military and he got orders to go someplace else. And in Nevada, if you get military orders to, to go someplace else, you can turn that tag in and defer it and you he turned it in and deferred it. And I actually got to go on the hunt from the gentleman that picked it up as a, a return tag. And we harvested a tremendous ram. And not long after we harvested that ram, there was a die off in East Humboldts and the rubies and, and we lost both those populations and not been hunted since. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Nobody’s since that defer tag never got issued 13 years now just basically 12 or 13 years defer. I mean, I don’t know if I’ve ever heard something like this, but it’s pretty awesome. Well, it, it, that kid drew it and he deferred it till the next time it became available. Yeah.

00:45:43:06 –> 00:46:54:11
And that’s this year we’ve, we’ve, we’ve talked to him and, and he is excited and, and we have room for one tag in, in the rubies. And so we’re going to hopefully have a hunter in there pursuing Rams this year and Awesome. And maybe next year we’ll have another tag. We’ll we will have to wait and see and, and, but we, we, when when somebody defers a tag because they’re doing something for our country, we, we owe ’em everything we can to make, make them home on the end and Oh, I love that. We may, we may have somebody that says we, we should have put that out for the general public, but I I can tell you No, they won’t say it out loud. No, they don’t think they’ll say it out loud. No. Yeah, not if you do it out loud, you’re gonna get chastised. ’cause that if the guy put it off because it’s just not convenient this year. I’m, I’m gonna turn it back and get my points back. That’s completely different than a Yeah, I cannot hunt. I’m leaving the country. I’m serving my country overseas or wherever he went and I can’t do it. And ca catastrophically that winter the sheep die off and haven’t been a hundred for 13 years since. So it’s just pretty neat, pretty admirable. You guys are doing that.

00:46:54:14 –> 00:47:50:13
And I look forward to seeing how, how it does, you know what I’m looking forward to, Jack. I’m looking forward to first come, first serve. I’m, I’m, I’m not good. I don’t have good odds of drawing. I I never, I don’t, I’m not a lucky guy. Adam Adam’s kinda lucky. He beats really long odds. He gets, he has terrible luck at one and two odds. He has terrible luck there. But one and 150 plus he does well on. But quite frankly, I’m looking forward to the first come first serve. I, I can tell you, I really am surprised we made it this far in this conversation without talking about first come first. Well, well I thought that was gonna be be a leader. Well, well it’s fun. It was neat you guys. I didn’t even wanna bring it up. I don’t wanna wanna eliminate the competition. Well, but it was pretty competitive last year. And, and I guess just to quickly summarize the program, these are tags we’re talking about that get surrendered by people for whatever reason, within any reason, within any reason, not, you know, moving on from the military and they get all their points back.

00:47:50:18 –> 00:48:56:22
Not deferred, but yeah, you turn it in within 14 days of the start of the individual season, they’re turning the tag for once you get within that timeframe, you guys were finding, hey, there’s just a hard time getting it turned around and reallocated to anybody that actually wants it when they haven’t had time to prepare time off work, scout, hire, guide, all that. So let’s just throw ’em on the internet and we’ll sell ’em as first come first serve. They take your points. But basically you guys pre created a website last year where you just had to watch that like a hawk and you know, tags, you know, you had little peaks all throughout the fall as archery. Antelope hunt was what the first thing that started and then then rifle archery, deer rifle antelope actually archery deer. Yeah. And then into the muzzle loaders and rifles and then elk and you know, it just kind of had different phases all throughout the year as you got within those 14 day windows of hunt openings. And then, so yeah, you’re gonna do it again this year. And can you talk about any like changes that you guys are for sure gonna have yet, or are you still putting the final touches on it? And I ended up getting an archery deer. Yeah. I mean it was, oh, I got, I got a tag for myself for an elk and I got my antelope for my boy.

00:48:56:29 –> 00:50:18:05
I mean, and it was one of those, we played it and, and just, you know, it, we did, it was a drought year. It was a drought year. A lot of people turned some deer tags, especially backlash. And, and had I, I, I don’t know, I I hunted a great buck. I did, I hunted a great buck. But, but what a great system. Yeah, yeah. I’m gonna give you some numbers on that. And people think that first come, first serve replaced the alternates and, and it definitely didn’t. And it was largely taken up by residents it sounded like to me. Yeah. We changed our, our workflow through the application process because in 2019 we only had 40,000 people apply for alternates. And then in 2000, 2050 2000 we changed our workflow and we had 112,000 alternate applications. So in 2020 we put out 545 alternate tags. In 2021, the same years we implemented first come first serve, we had 669 alternate tags go out. So that went up even. Yeah, the alternate the alternate, it, it, it’s still alive and well, it still works and doing its job. Yeah. And those are for people that you turn ’em, you call them 15 days or greater before the hunt. You call those. Correct. You go to that one, then the first come, first serve comes in, you can turn your tag back in up to the day before the season.

00:50:18:28 –> 00:51:39:16
And then, but, and if you do that within that 14 day window, that’s getting too tight and they then they’ll go up on first, come first serve on, on, first come first serve. We did 987 unique tags. Okay. We had 1,033 sales. We sold some tags twice. Somebody would go in and buy it and then go, oh boy, I don’t have the time. So they turned it in and we’d sell it again. We, we know a guy that did that. I know one guy that did that. But anyway, not, not me or Jason, but hey, INow will take their money, whatever, maybe they’re checking to see if it was legit and how it worked and if they went one, one click too far, one step too far. Well, and they bought it. And then you have a little bit of buyer’s remorse or utilize. Yeah, maybe they can’t find a guy in four days and they say, I’m gonna turn this back in. So anyway, whatever. Or, yeah. And, and on on the breakdown, 173 horns longer than near antelope, two junior tags, 560 mill deer tags, buck tags, 102 bull elk tags, 21 spike tags, seven Nelson Desert, Bighorn sheep tags were sold to that and two UT tags. And one of those UT tags happened to be mine. I, I had a utag and it just wasn’t fitting into my schedule.

00:51:39:19 –> 00:53:08:08
I had other, oh, you other hunts going on with, I turned it in. I, it wasn’t hunts that I had myself, but when somebody else is sitting on a RAM tag, and I’d rather go hunt a ram was a good friend of mine than go hunt my own use. So I wanted to make sure that, that that fulfilled somebody else’s need to get into the field. And do you have the break and it worked out, worked out for everybody? Well, that’s, and do you have the breakdown? It was almost 1,987 unique tax. I don’t know why it’s important, but resident, non-resident breakdown. Was it like 70 or 80% went to residents? 80, 84% were returned by residents. 873 and then 276 were purchased by non-residents. So 26% of the total tags that were purchased through first come first serve were purchased by non-residents. But 73 or 757 of them were purchased by resident. So 5 75 25 of the, of the roughly thousand first come first. So 75. 25. So a little bit higher than the natural draw split. That is a 90 10 ish. But they, you knows technically could go to anybody. There’s just two. Whoever was click in the mouse, guess there’s no, there’s no quotas based. A resident tag turned in, doesn’t go to a resident, it could go to anybody and the non-resident tag turned in could go to anybody. So anyway. Correct. But the residents got the lion’s share. So anyway.

00:53:08:11 –> 00:54:29:03
That makes sense. Well I think it was, I mean I think it was a great program. You got well and, and yeah, you had 900 or a thousand tags that, that either got people hunting or they actually help you accomplish management objectives because the hunters actually wanted a field and harvested animals and did whatever. But anything that, that, you know, it’s gonna change for this year that you want even want to get into, is that still the final touches coming on that process? Yeah. And how did you like the program overall? Well, the program was a great success. It did everything we wanted to. We did see some people trying to get in and game the system and, and the way that our system works, you can detect when people start using bots or auto clickers and, and different ways to, to try to game the system. And we actually pulled some people down on their accounts and had conversations with them that if that type of activity continued to occur, we’d pull ’em down again and, and we’re making some, there were some changes the commission put into place. We’re gonna make some regulation changes to ensure it’s a fair process. That’s above all. We want a fair process. Well, yeah. And there’s computer programs there out there that are hunters and I’m sure somebody can Yeah. Develop that. Some people will say, oh, Jason and Adam have an advantage.

00:54:29:12 –> 00:55:40:29
’cause they sit at their desk all day and, and sit on the computer all day so they can see it. And I run a, a backhoe and, and I don’t have a computer, but that same guy that runs a backhoe, he might go to work at four 30 in the morning and be up when you guys are still asleep. And there was, I know logging of people that bought him at three and four or five in the morning that I wasn’t awake. Correct. Four, I guarantee that. Four. So there’s different ways to have advantages and disadvantages, but we’re, we’re going to do everything we can to keep that, that system whole. And, and we’re working with the commission. If we do see that somebody’s gaming it away, we we’re gonna pull their accounts down and if we see ’em try to help other people game it, we’re gonna pull those accounts down and, and if it, if it gets outta control, we’ll just suspend the whole system. It a, a fair, honest process is more important than getting these tags out. If tags, you could just boot ’em from the system altogether, ban ’em for five years, lock them from system or whatever of, so yeah, if you want a personal phone call from Jack, try to try to take advantage of of endow bill it. Because it’s funny not, you called them personally, right? Like you’re, you’re No, no.

00:55:40:29 –> 00:56:55:00
They, it, it, it worked different than that. We, when we decided we were gonna start suspending some people, they said, well, we need a suspension code to put on the account so when they get in, they’ll know that they’re suspended. I said, well put on there just like your bank card, when you, when something happens on your bank card, suspicious activity has been recognized in your account, please call. And the only number they had to call wasn’t the front desk or wasn’t somebody in, at cal or somebody in our licensing office. It was my cell number. So how’s that? You wanna, so I, I gotta talk to quite a few of ’em. Some of them did elected not to call me, but elected to stay. Yeah. Off or, or well try to email me other things. So yeah, so this will be something we’ll take into effect basically the end of July because you’ve got, you know, again, I think archery antelope and archery deer, some of the first kickoffs of this, but the details will be ironed out. That’ll be I’m sure, shared via email through when all that’s ratified and, and determined any, any changes how you’re actually gonna implement it. But cool program, it’s, Hey, it’s another chance late in the summer. It isn’t easy for everybody, but hey, you know, you go.

00:56:55:00 –> 00:58:06:02
The other thing is it goes on for like four months because I mean, there’s sheep tags getting turned back in the end of November. Jack, there’s, I mean there’s deer, deer seasons in December. That’s what I means. So it starts the end of July, but it goes a long time. And so yeah, maybe we’re in the, I can guarantee from about September on, I, I wasn’t around playing this game at all last year. What, what date does it open up? Do you remember? Well, it’s going, last year we had an opening date because it was the first year and we already, I I can tell you roughly 14, 15 days before the Archer, Adam and I have been wanting to have a browser open already. It’s going to occur before that because it’s early. We may have somebody that draws a cow elk tag Oh yeah. In, in the first draw. Yeah. And do we have the seven days electronic return? We don’t print the tags anymore and send them to you. You can elect to electronically return your tag in that seven day window. And if you don’t have alternates to give it to Yeah. Then you’re like, we’re stuck. We gotta, this is already, we already know this one’s ready to go it, we could do that. But in that seven day window, they will go into the second draw.

00:58:06:07 –> 00:59:18:27
But as soon as that second draw goes and we don’t have alternates for some of that stuff, it’ll, it’ll start happening. Yeah. Real. I can’t tell you exactly when because we don’t know when the first tag’s gonna get returned as eligible because they don’t have an alternate. Right. And to be an al to qualify for an alternate, somebody has to have it as their first choice. Yeah. We had a Bull Elk tag going to second draw last year. ’cause nobody had, I think it was oh six one as their first choice. That selected to be an alternate. So we had a bull elk tag go in the second draw because somebody turned in something that nobody had marked as alternate as choice. So even though there’s an alternate option is on choices two through five. Really? It’s your first choice. Yeah, it’s your first choice only. Yeah. Well another reason is I think if somebody doesn’t draws this Silver State Desert or Cali and they don’t want it, that’s, that starts July 1st. So it could happen in June. You could get a first, you imagine first, first serve Governor Tech. Yeah, I’d like it. I dare some to try that. I dunno. Alright, well good stuff. We’re excited about it. Some of the key, the key dates would be May 10th is our application deadline. This is this upcoming Tuesday, 11:00 PM May 10th Pacific time. Yeah. So anyway, yes.

00:59:19:07 –> 01:00:45:22
And then May 20th we’re looking at a, what’d you call it again, Jack? For let the adventure begin. Let the adventure begin. Maverick Maverick. And now are you guys copycatting Maverick? Did they even have Maverick gas stations? Do you guys have Maverick gas stations out there? Yeah, we, we, we copied yesterday on May the fourth be with you. We copied us. Okay. Okay. I don’t know who that’s who, who drums up who, who drums up those sayings? Jack, who drums up? I’m sure. I’m sure we weren’t the first one to call something Midnight Madness. I’m sure other, other people. Maybe some basketball teams in n NCAA or something. Yeah. So anyway, that’s anyway, May 10th, May 20th upcoming dates that we’re really excited about. Yeah. Anything else you wanna talk about real quick about Nevada and what you guys got going on there? No, it just, we’re just trying to stay ahead of it and we’re just praying for rain just like everybody else. Did you guys get through some of those black bears that never did hibernate given, given, given Lake Tahoe residents? Heck, I I can tell you, even though we’re dry right now, we had a fantastic December. Yeah. And that, that snow that pretty much the, the whole state gout in December put the bears down this year. There was a couple on the lake that we share with Cal couple What there. Yeah. But those on the California side.

01:00:45:22 –> 01:01:55:07
We’ll, we’ll let Hank the tank stay on in California. They just, that’s what I was You’re not claiming those bears. That’s what I was wondering is how, how’s he doing? I don’t know. Hank didn’t have our ear tag in it. So we don’t know anything about Hank this I, I can, I know what position Jack played in football. He was a punter. He’s punting this one in California. He doesn’t Oh, I like it. Hank looks down there Good. In the California side at the Tahoe Keys. That’s the, that we were watching the news there on. Yeah, they had that made the news in Utah and then we saw Yeah, what a, a momma and like three or four cubs woke up and under the cabin. It’s been scratching all winter and the lady was wondering what the noise was. Yeah. Some gal, some gal could hear ’em all winter under there. Anyway, kind of funny. Well, well appreciate your time Jack. You’re always good to, you know, we jab a little phone, but you’re, more importantly, you’re a good ambassador for your state as deputy director and Nevada Department of Wildlife and you’re a big hunter, yourself and sportsman and we appreciate your coming on with us today just to kind of hit some of the highlights of your state and it’s crunch time and it’s one of the last big remaining big states, multi-species states remaining for the draws.

01:01:55:08 –> 01:03:11:05
So I encourage our listeners and everybody to get your apps in by Tuesday the 10th, 10th May 10th. And, and, and I can tell you if you guys, anybody listening has any questions, just look at your magazine. I I got that in the mail and I read it again and you guys are spot on with what you put out. So I, I really appreciate you guys putting out that type of good information. You bet. We appreciate it. Thank you. And yeah, any questions give Adam or I a call here at Epic Outdoors (435) 263-0777. Of course we publish a monthly publication this time of year covering all the state’s draws and so anyway, we appreciate you Jack, thanks for your support as well. And we’ll be talking soon probably, probably May 20th for Adam, about 6 6 30 Pacific time. Yeah, something like that. Yep. Let me know how it goes. Alrighty. Alright, talk later. Hey, thanks guys. You bet. Bye. At Epic Outdoors, we help you reach your hunting dreams. Whether it’s helping you to develop a long-term application strategy, or finding the perfect outfitter for your next hunt. As a member of Epic Outdoors, you’ll also receive the Epic Outdoors Magazine and have access to the best hunting consultants in the industry, online tools and more. To join Epic Outdoors, visit epic or call 4 3 5 2 6 3 0 7 7 7.