Some of the highlights were, being guidable, regulations on landowner tag systems, how fire effects hunting areas and game, point system in Wyoming, is it worth gaining points for moose in WY, 200″ Mule deer vs 400″ elk, if you had to choose between Biden and Harris, regulations changes we’d like to see, trail cameras, benefits of having us do your applications, tips for field judging Mule deer, judging deer off of trail camera photos, adding bear hunting information, how to hunt a burn, and Josh’s mustache.

Disclaimer: this text was produced through an automated transcription service and likely contains errors. Please listen to the original audio for exact content.

Anything to do with Western.

Welcome to the epic outdoors podcast. Powered by Underarmour.

Hey everybody. Jason Carter and the epic outdoors crew. We got Devin, Josh Wyatt, John, how y’all doing today?


How’s the scouting going? Devin? How’s this? How is your latest scouting trip?

It was great. I had a blast.

Really? What was the highlight? Seeing the big buck or getin’ rid of some rodents.

And I went up there. I went there alone, but I came home with guests.

Many friends. Yeah. How does a guy do that?

You leave your truck parked in the Sage brush for a couple days.

And you have friends.

I have friends.

They took my waters. It was, it was, it looked like a war zone.

Inside of your vehicle. Something.

May have been attacked. I don’t know. They had a, a party. Let’s just say,

What do you mean the attack was there? Blood remnants of blood and stuff.

There was blood.

All right. So tell us what happened.

Just it’s happened once before in my old truck, they got in there. Ate some granola bars, no big deal. Right? Well, this time there was a, it was worse.

They ate their granola bars and water.

Oh yeah. I mean, I’m allergic to mice. Like I do. My arm was hyped up and.

I got the haunt of virus.

I get to town and I’m just feeling a little kind of like when you got a tick on you a little, it wasn’t that bad until I pulled her to get gas and I felt something on my foot and I looked down a little bugger, jumped out from the dash, like right next to the pedal, right onto my foot. Just.

Something about it.

Well, I just picked up Wyatt from the shop and he had to watch out for traps. I haven’t caught one yet. I think he bailed after I kicked him. I don’t.

Know who hasn’t dealt with some road. And so seriously,

I’ve I, you know, I like to sleep in the back of my truck. Cause you’re up off the ground. You don’t have the Rattlers Rattlers out or out at dark. Like that’s, they’re out to feed. And so you’re just like, well sleep in the back of my truck. I feel. Yeah. I don’t have to think. Right. And one night, depending on where you’re parked, I was parked near waterhole, like an idiot because where there’s water, there’s feed rodents, come out and the roads come out. The snakes come out, whatever. I’m way down in the desert, Mojave green world. And I had rodents in and around and they climbed up in the truck bed. I mean everywhere. And I’m just like, what in the crap? never had been infested like that ever.

Well it’s like me and it last year, last year, Devin’s in the shadows up and I I’m like, what is he doing? I look over, he shaking his truck. It’s middle of the night. And I’ve been living there for a week. I was just fine. Shaking mice right out. I can hear them running all over. My truck had been there for a week. It was a miracle,

Right on a pack rat.

We killed some,

Yeah, we did. We’ve got some traps from town. We’ll sticky traps. And we.

Got up the lady at carriage laughed at us.

Jeez. I remember one time with the rodents. I had this old, I bought this old, like 93 Chevy diesel, that one ton long bed, short or standard cab, long bed with a Chevy diesel, the most amazing era of the Chevy diesel. You know what I mean? When they were useless anyway, driving down the road and I opened up a gate and I looked back and there’s just a line of fluid from where I’d come from. I’m like, Hey, I’ve sprung a leak. Yeah. Something’s bad. And went through the gate and I pulled over and I, and I get up under there and a fuel line. They had chewed through a fuel line and just, and I’m like, you’re kidding me. I’m in the middle of nowhere and valley. And I’m like, well, I got to do something. So I spot cut it. And I took a big pan and gutted a big pin, put the big pin on both sides, close, clamped. It then drove away. Hey right.

There. Just fixed right there.

Yeah. Never touched it again. Sold it. So they’re fine. Diesel diesel is not explosive. You can hardly light it. And so whatever big pen. Anyway, I hate rodents. They’ll chew through every, and then you’re guaranteed. You’ve got wires and they, they like some of those,

It’s a part of my brake pedal the corner of the brake.

Well, you took it on the chin.

Even the, on my four Wheeler. I’ve got half of the choke. We pull the choke out. It’s half missing.

Yeah. Those are only things you can see. Imagine all the wiring harnesses,

Fuse panels.

I was mad when I started my truck. Cause we were driving. I was in the side-by-side a lot. Why it’s like, you’re going to you better be careful that I heard something, but I think it’s all right.

So Wyatt, how’s the scouting going for you? It seems like you took a little jaunt yesterday.

Yeah. It’s just getting rolling. So nothing great to report yet, but hopefully in the next couple of weeks it really turns on.

Yeah. That’s going to be great, Josh.

Well, I guess so far seeing some bucks found some new bucks, but.

What I, what I like about Josh is so we got some new cell cams in. We only ordered like five just to test them. They’re super inexpensive. And they’re awesome with Josh is our gear test guy. Like, here you go, Josh, throw them up. Sure enough. He’s starting to load us with photos. It’s working. They’re working. Awesome. Yeah,

They are. It’s kind of fun.


Except now my next, this weekend and next week going to consist of picking them all up, I guess.

Well, yeah, so everybody that’s running in Utah and Nevada, we’re getting ready to pick them up. It seems like scouting. Season’s already coming to an end. As far as the technology part of the scouting and then a boots to the ground, of course, boots have been on the ground too. So anyway, we’d been that Polaris razor really hard. I can run. I mean, and you guys are the same way. Why you mentioned this, there’s not a trail cam trap line that could be run as efficiently as you can in a raise. They’re doing 60.

No, you can easily double the amount of work you can do in a truck that day.

It’s unbelievable. Yeah. The only thing that bothers me is these squalls, you know, you get an afternoon, you know, rain, shower hate that.

Mine’s the dust being exposed. I just hate feeling dirty like that.

Yeah. Yeah. There’s something to be said for a truck and windows and air conditioning. But anyway, if you are looking, John, you’ve been over to the triple S player store here in Cedar. Yeah.

Yeah. I went over. So one thing that’s kind of new. Every time we’ve been over there in the last two years, it’s like the showroom is empty bone like.


Yeah. This is the first time I went over there and they’ve actually got machines in in. And so I talked to them and they have several that are ready to go. I mean, more than I’m going to mention here, but we had Adam that was looking for probably six months for a new Wheeler to go. And so they’ve got a couple of used machines in there as well as new. So just like dimension, a few, they’ve got a 2010 Polaris sportsman, five 50 and they want 5,800 for it. And it looks like it’s in great shape. So.

They do a, you know, kind of a trade in program.

Trading program. So that one, that one, it should have been on Adam’s list right there. But anyway, if you want that or they’ve got a bunch of 2020 models, they’ve got the razor pro 24,000. They’ve got, let’s see the razor.

20, 22 model.

That’s a 20, 22 model. Yeah. Brand new brand new. Yep. And like they’re upgraded a little bit. This one has got like this Walker Evans shock package.

It’s pretty amazing. I think they don’t, they don’t like stock. I don’t, I mean, they do sell stock vehicles, but man, so you get left.

Alone and it’s sweet. So.

They’ve got the 20, 22 plus razor XP. Yeah. Four seater,

1000 sport. And then the, if you want one of the Rangers, the crew SP five 70 premium, they’ve got that. I mean in stock and they’ll ship nationwide. So give them a call. 4, 3, 5, 8, 6, 5 0 100.

We’ve been selling electric bikes. Yeah. That’s what I like about these guys there. I mean, there’s a generators players, generators. They sell all kinds of stuff. Anyway. Saturday. Pretty awesome.

Can I give him a call if you’re looking for something else that this is, these are just a few that, that I, that I saw in there that are ready to go. They’ve they’ve got a bunch. So.

3, 5, 8, 6, 5 0 100. And they’ll ship anywhere, man. Maybe even outside the lower 48, who knows Colton’s up for a challenge.

So if you’re in the market, I mean support somebody who supports.

Us. I lack it. Alright. Okay. Fellows, here we go. Josh question reader, guy. We’re on like part two of the question and answer section. Should we grind into this and see how far we get?

Yeah, I’ll bet we can make it at least one page.

Or like five to go. Here’s the first question comes from Colton Gilbert. He says, here’s my question for the podcast. I’m going on my first guided hunt for doll sheep here in August. So question is how do I make sure that I am a good client? In other words, how do I be guidable if that’s, if that is a word, most guys hunt, bow hunt for themselves and by themselves or with friends and develop strategies and ways they like to hunt. How do I make sure I helped my guide? Help me. Thank you for what you guys do. Lots of good info,

Right on. Okay. I think this is a great question. It’s not like, Hey, what can you do for me? Outfitter or guide what, you know, I had a bad experience. I don’t get it. Or, or, or a good experience or whatever. And we put a lot of emphasis on, is the guy prepared? Does he have good gear? Is he, has he scouted? What’s the food like, what’s this what’s this, but it’s nice to have a little self-reflection even though I’m paying for this, what makes me a good client? Like how can I be ready? What, you know, what can make me? Guidable like, I mean, humility comes to mind. A lot of guys are like my way or no way I’m paying you. We’re going to do it my way. Will you? You could consider the fact that you’re painting because you need him, you need his expertise.

Maybe he has a little more experience than you do in this particular area. And I’ve guided guys back in the day, not anymore, but back in the day where it’s hard, when you don’t have a quote guidable client, they feel if it feels like there’s a competition between the guide and the client and the guides and the client’s got to prove to you that he’s not just a dumb client. So there’s a little bit of that. And nobody wants to be that guy, but also having enough humility to say, I hired this guy for a reason. I’m going to kind of go with him, although it’s okay to flush it out at your hunt. You want to maybe have some input on a stock or whatever. And, and, and because you’ve hunted you, you have valid input, but what makes me guidable as a client? I think that’s a great question.

Yeah. And along with the humility thing, they’re like, no, your capabilities, you don’t be honest with the guide with your capabilities. You pull a gun out. Yeah. It might click up to a thousand yards, but what are you comfortable shooting at? Where, where have you been saying with archery and what, what is your confident range? Let, let your guide know. So they’re not stretching your abilities or taking you out of your comfort zone to make the shot of a lifetime.

Well, and I think when you get two guys together, a client guide, sometimes the client wants to prove that they’re they’re fully capable. And so they don’t talk about, Hey, by the way, I, I I’m been known to get some buck fever. So when we’re, when the heat of battle, like go ahead and, you know, yell out the range or, or, or tell me the range, make sure I’m very conscious of the rain. Make sure I dial it correctly. Maybe this is how my, this is my gun. This is how it works. This is how I have it set up. In fact, here’s my range finder with my, with the, with the load in it, feel free to grab that and help me out. If you, and maybe reset me, if you know, I’m going to shoot through grass, you know, and you see that, like, don’t be intimidated to reset me. Like, Hey, this isn’t good. You’re gonna hit the rock in front of you or whatever. Like sometimes guys just don’t say that like, Hey, I’m, I’m known as oh two shots. Sam is the first shots, usually in the air. So just talk me through this when you don’t want, I mean, like, don’t get to say that, you know what I mean? Yeah.

And on a sheep hunt like that, I’d say, be in shape, know what you’re getting yourself into research. Maybe talk to other sheep hunters, guys that have been up there. Those mountains are a lot different than what we deal with in the lower 48, a lot of the time and not used to backpacking like that. So just, just prepare yourself,

Make sure you’re in shape. Don’t don’t put it off until one month before it takes longer than a month. Yes.


Definitely. You know, so, and we’re looking at the same thing. We are going on guided hunts at times and Alaska, Canada. What makes us a good client? We feel at the same question, like, how am I going to at least do my part? So I’m not sucking wind on this poor guy. That’s trying to make sure my hunts have success and make sure I’m happy as a client.

And then you guys talk about honesty, you know, just communication, but also honesty before the hunt, I’ve done two on one hunts where people that know each other. And when you fill out your help form and say, what, on a scale of one to 10, what shape you’re in? Both of them are a seven, but one guy can’t go 50 yards. Right? So, you know, that just, that’s just going to limit you. And it just affects everything. But I like guys that to stay positive during the hunt. Like if you miss something, it’s okay. You know, like you can day two of a six day hunt. You miss. And you’re just down in the dumps. Like it’s not fun. That’s not fun for somebody who’s just, you know, kind of pessimistic, I guess.

Well, I think if you keep the energy up and you’re a positive thinker as a client, your guide wants to work harder. Trust me. There’s nobody that wants you to be successful quicker and have a better hunt than your guide quicker means he can go help somebody else or, or whatever. And he’s done his job and the pressure’s off. He wants you to be successful, but he also wants you to be successful in what you want. And so some guys will say, I want a 290 inch deer. I don’t want 190 inch deer. And then the first one 70, Hey, what do you think? Like, Hey, you know, and, and so just be realistic on, on what your goals are to, you know, with yourself and your guide and help them, help them understand.

And talk about it before the heat of the moment. You know? And, and like, I always like to tell my clients, like, if I tell you like, kill that bug right now, there’s no question. If you know what I mean, like trust me. And, and because that doesn’t happen, like we know that doesn’t happen every time, but if it does, and it has to be quick, like just trust me,

Nothing’s more frustrating than having a little argument when it’s time to be pulling the trigger,

You know? But then as a guide, you’re like, well, maybe I am, maybe you, you, you start to question yourself, okay. He’s not thinking it’s big enough. And I do think it is, but maybe I’m missing something. And then now your guides questioning. And then pretty soon he’s intimidated to tell you what he really thinks of the deer or elk or sheep or, or whatever. You know, nobody wants to be the blame guy, you know, and if there’s mistakes made, okay, there’s a mistake made. It’s, there’s some in the heat of battle, it’s hard to have perfect communication. And you know what I mean? The guides got his way and style of any, he loses it. You know, he gets excited and Hey, get your gun out, get, do this, do this. Bi-pod your bullets, your whatever. And, and then the client, he has his way of whatever happens when he gets excited, he loses his mind a whole different way. And so you gotta figure out how to work together, even though you’ve never really hunted together, you know, it’s a challenge.

Like for a client, just ask questions. It’s okay to ask questions. I like sharing knowledge with clients.

Like Devin, what are we doing at Mickey? D’s getting breakfast after, after daylight. You know what I mean?

We gotta run back to the dorm.

Can you tell me what well, what happens is I don’t see any game until eight o’clock, you know, I don’t know, explain yourself. I’m just teasing. That never happens with Devin, but just saying it, for instance,

Gray, light sausage McMuffin, kind of.

Guy like the sausage.

Don’t often tell seven 30 places,

But the McGriddles, do they even make the McGriddle? Those are like 4,000 calories.

Oh yeah. You got, yeah. I there saying that, where that was coming from, but I, I hit a lot last fall one time.

Yeah. There’s some McDonald’s that are overloaded with clients, especially guided clients, but Hey, you know, sometimes that’s the best breakfast place in town. If they only opened at six, they only opened at six.

That was another one I had thought of was if you’re going to ride around in a guy’s truck for five, six days, like try to just respect it.

You know,

You don’t Donald dropper just tucked in the door under the seat.

So even though we’ve had a war zone with the mice and they’ve ate off the brake pedals, we still want to make sure.

We’ll see how clean it is right now. Oh yeah. I love that thing. Last night. Lysol wipes, you light blue light. Is it.


Up? It’s gone anyways. Yeah. Like respect people’s equipment. I’ve had that happen.

You mean spit and seeds on the floor. It’s just as that stuff like that a little bit,

Mostly just built stuff and just garbage coffee.


Well, I, I liked that cause you don’t want your guide on edge again, not that we have to tip toe around the guides, but it just seems natural. Just a, just a general respect for yeah. You’re paying for it and yeah, you kind of look and look at it as you’re renting vehicle and you’re renting all the equipment and whatnot. You can look at it like that, but it’s just hard from a guidance perspective to have somebody disrespect, anything just to have respect and be courteous and kind, I guess, Josh, you’ve got some of these higher end or been around him. What, yeah. Some of these, you know, a higher end type clientele that are, you know, paying the big bucks for big deer and you’ve probably felt the pressure in camp and the pressure in and around guides and, and clients and whatnot. What can you add to what we got going?

Yeah, I think, I think that’s just, it be, I guess be cognizant too, of everything that’s happening. You know, there’s a lot of stuff as a, as a, a client that there’s a lot of stuff that happens behind the scenes that you don’t even know about. That’s going on. That goes into your hunt and communication between spotters and guides and all that kind of stuff, as well as what most of the time, if you go back and lay down for a nap, odds are your guide or your spotter. Aren’t, they’re continuing to work even throughout the day. Sometimes when it’s these long days in August, it just happens. And you do. But if you happen to not see your guide for a little bit, while you’re back at camp, having a nap or just remember, you know, he is still working and working hard and just, I guess, accept that and know that there is a lot going into the hunt more than just the few hours in the morning or evening in our truck or on a hike or something like that.

Okay. Any, anything else?

Well, I don’t know anybody that goes DIY where everything goes a hundred percent perfect every time. And, and then you go on a guided hunt and you expect everything to go perfect. Every time it’s still hunting, it’s a good, you know, so keep that mindset of it’s okay. If, if it’s not perfect all the time, but for, for this guy, just to be self-aware enough to ask this question, he’s going to be fine. Yeah. He’s got a good attitude. Like you got a great idea.

One more thing is, you know, don’t call your guide every week for six months building up to the hunt, you know, it’s okay to call it, communicate with the outfitter and the guide,

But to micromanage his scouting or.

Just like, because you’re not the only, probably not the only client that guide or outfitter house. And they don’t have time to talk every day to who knows how many clients I just,

And going with that kind of understand that they will be off the radar. I mean, from time to time, it might take four or five days for a guy to get back to you just because he is on a scouting trip. He is.

Sometimes some communication, but you don’t have to, like, I don’t know. I feel like sometimes.

Yeah, with the cell phone era, it’s like, you know, like you said, what, like in Devin, like people expect an immediate text back or an email or, or to answer your phone and, and you know, and sometimes scouting just, isn’t going great. And sometimes it’s just, we’re grinding through and it kind of sucks for a minute. It’s hot, it’s dry, whatever. And it’s, and you know, you don’t want to give somebody a bad report and you just want to work for a minute. Just let me just let me grind through this and we’re going to be ready when you get here. So, all right. Okay.

Wait, wait. Let’s, let’s add just one other thing to that. Be a good tipper.


Yeah, these guys, you gotta, you gotta think, you know, it’s their.

Job to make a living to go again. I’m never going to see this.

Kid again. Doesn’t matter really why he’s doing it just to make a living for his family. And, and they’re not like if you’re, if it’s a guide working for an outfit or a lot of times, I mean, they’re not making tons and tons of money. They’re doing it a lot of it’s because they love it.

Really added it up the wear and tear on their vehicle and the fuel. Obviously we’ll have to talk about that, you know, and, and the optics and everything that goes into it, all that you’re going, bro. Like you can go broke pretty easy as a guy. Yeah.

So be generous. You got, if you can afford a guide and you can afford a good tip.

Yeah. If you can’t afford a guide, don’t hire one. Yeah,

Don’t go. Alright.


All right. This next question comes from, I apologize. I do not know your name. I tried to search you and track you down on.

Well, if you would’ve have given it to Wyatt, he’d have figured it out. Why it can’t find or figure out why it would have Facebook. He would have been on my space.

It was before why I was.

Born, snapped.

It out.

I could’ve, I could’ve just DMD the guy, but I kinda like his name on Instagram. So we’re going to go with it. Smoke wagon, 86, he asked, do you guys feel that there should be some sort of regulation on cost of landowner vouchers, maybe standardized prices based on hunt quality, any other ideas? Maybe you disagree. Period. I understand the tags, the tags value is whatever you think it is. But I believe people are in the are beginning to take advantage of pricing. Things are through pricing things through the roof. Just feel like it’s spinning out of control thing.

And I, yeah. I mean, I look at it and say, no, there’s, there’s no way to regulate this ever. I, I it’s like the regulating the price of a truck. I think, I think a $80,000 diesel’s not worth it. Yeah. But I wish it was regulated and they were only 40,

But they, and I think you see it, they go up and they go down as well as, I mean, you don’t realize a lot of these guys, these, a lot of these guys are getting tags for compensation, for damages or things like that. And you, you don’t know what their damages are, you know, you, you just don’t know. And so they’re trying to compensate for damages from wildlife. So yeah, that’s hard.

So who is it? It’s my tag. And I get to decide who gets it, like who, who, who, you know, who out there can tell me what to do with my tag? Like it’s, you know, in some states regulate it, you can’t sell these. You can only give them to blood relatives or ranch manager. You can only, you know, use them yourself or immediate family members, you know, like one generation like immediate family members. But, you know, and, and we have our opinions on that. You know, you want land owners to want wildlife. You want them to be happy, want them to be compensated for any damage or abuse or make it to where they smile when they have something on their property instead of, you know, go through it grudgingly. But, but anyway, I would just say it we’re our own worst enemy on this as inflation through the roof, you know, people are also getting paid a little bit more and they have a little, you know, and then vouchers are gonna go up to like, everything kind of goes up in life. And it’s just unfortunate there’s texts. We used to buy for pennies on the dollar compared to now. And it just is what it is. It’s a F it’s a, this is it’s private business landowner vouchers that are sellable is, is a private business. And, and.

The supply and demand situation get so many of them in theory, the only, the only organization that could regulate this is government. And you throw that in and all they can do is mess it up.

I love John’s stance on, on government and your life.

It’s true.

John hates hos John, you are an HOA president. How does that how’s that?



Did you get that job? Well, all right, so we’ve got a condo, right? And it’s got a,

And this is the main house, right? It’s not like, here’s not like your third home.

So we’re building a house. We’re almost ready to get into it, but we’re in a condo and there are like five or six old women just like, they want to fill the pool in with dirt. Like it’s, it’s.

Because they hate the kids having fun.

It’s like complaining all the time. And my wife’s like.

Fun haters.

If you’re not the president, then like, they’re going to go sideways. They’re going to go do away with the pool. So anyway, I’m like, I can do it. So I did it and yeah, how much they pay it. Oh, it’s free.




Worth it. It’s definitely not aware of that. So I can just see you walking around with your clipboard checking. Those are supposed to be planted here. So to go with blinds. Yeah. Kind of my government attitude. Well, there’s, I let a lot of stuff go. My name is John, and I’m here to help you.

Sure. Complaint. What did they call? It looks your nickname.

Oh geez. This is my, yeah. So the worst was we had, we were having once a month HOA meetings and is just a complain Fest, so that doesn’t have to be edited, but it, it was, it’s just horrible. So like an hour and a half of just how so I researched and figured out in the CCNRs, we only had to have one meeting a year. I mean, this is like a big social thing for these retired people to come and complain once a week, once a year, once a month. And you swipe changed it and you, you would have thought like the world was ending and one like king John.

Is going to decide how much John. So anyway, anyway, forevermore it’s king John, everybody.

So yeah, that’s, that’s a tangent, but I, you know, that kinda goes along with,

Well, it goes along with the government, right? So anyway, got to have a little government out there, by the way. Can’t just, can’t just be doing whatever, whenever that doesn’t work either. But you.

Add too much of.

This. Definitely. Overruled.

If it’s regulated and yeah, it was based on value and, and how good it was. That’d be great. But I guarantee you, you, you get them controlling,

Right? Everything is going to, it’s going to make it worse. I love it. I love some of those stories. Okay. Where are we at?

Here we go. Next one. This question comes from assessor Castello. He says, what’s up guys. I have a question that I need some expert insight on much like yourselves laugh out loud. He says, so I have a good, good thing. Going in New Mexico for elk hunting. They had that huge fire in April that just got put, put out a month or more ago. It’s very thick in this area. While the fire opened up a lot of vegetation that it burned so quick that it jumped here and there. Well, for the last two weeks and going forward, they are getting dumped on by rain. I figured elk hunting would be no bueno for the next two to three years. My question is, can it be good hunting as soon I have the fire?

I think it can be incredible hunting this year. Oh yeah. Remember that big old fire over there by Springerville and all that country. Remember when it burned, the elk were standing in the black timber.

I was just going to say we killed a bull in Nevada. Once I drove up the road in my special permission for the.

Forest service, he went around the side. Didn’t, you.

Know, I talked to them and they let me go. And it’s dark. I’m driving up there and it’s like flames. It was like an apocalyptic. There was trees lit lighting on fire. Next to me, we killed that thing.

Whoever let you win, go in there. I.

Can’t remember her name, but she was in that truck.

Down there. She said, yes. I gave her a PB and J and I, it, I called an office in.


They said I was good to go.

The portrayal. We waited for three days. But it was, I thought it was like, totally put out until I went up in the dark. And it was.

That’s the best way to have the place to yourself. Did you ever see another hunter?


Nobody else?

Well, there was, we killed the bull the first day we could get up there, but it wasn’t an absolute, pure black nothing, but it was like, he said skipped around a little bit. There was feet, but they liked,

They like.

That. Yeah. They love it. Roll around in it. I’ve heard it kills ticks. Somebody told me that the ticks don’t like the Ash.


I’m talking rolling around in.

Well, a lot of it, you just look at it and you go, how are you? This is a mosaic question and mosaic pattern burn. And that gives still a lot of feed, but there’s, some of this has been pure black. It’s like the elk don’t know where else to go. Like I’ve always been here. I can’t believe can see out of this, the chorus now, but they’re standing there and you don’t wonder what they’re eating, but they’re fine. Yeah.

And their feet seems to come back pretty quick to get a few good rains late in the year. It seems like you’ve.

Got that fresh,

Fresh strain comes back pretty, pretty fast.

Especially if it’s in an area where there is grasses. I mean, it’s the best thing for, I mean, how many people do you see this in the spring time go burn their lawn. Still, you’ll see a guy out there with one of her burning their grass off. And all of a sudden it comes back off and that’s a lot of times the trees themselves are going to be burned. But if there’s grass there and there was somewhat any kind of moisture in the ground at all, all it did was burn all the dead grass off the top. And that’s green stuff. Like days, days, green grass will start.

Within days. Yep. Same thing. There are some places like the Kaibab it’s still kind of looks.

There’s place where it gets.

Kind of like a cross. Yeah.

I would say temperature of fire probably has to play, play into that a bit.

And then the rains after, and then if there’s a receipted program receipt program, or, you know, obviously it’s kind of nice to have some stuff with a little, maybe dry land alfalfa mixed in, and few things that grow big Brutus was a product of freaking amazing, you know, a receipt that had an amazing, you know, combination of food, you know what I mean? It came back and it was incredible. And I swear, that’s why there’s big deer. You know, they get older.

Ah, Utah has it. I can’t speak to New Mexico. I’m not sure, but util has a phenomenal program to where they have a lot of money. That’s set aside that that’s one of the big things. As soon as there’s a fire going, they’re already in the plan of getting it rehabbed and working up a seed mixture and all that stuff. And it’ll get receipted this fall, this winter, you know, and be ready for next spring. So obviously that stuff that receding won’t be growing until next spring summer, but they’re pretty aggressive with that stuff.

It’s don’t, don’t, don’t let it change your plans too much. Check, check the new Bern, I guess that’s the end of the story. And then next year it’s going to be incredible. Year three,

It’d be overgrown with saplings or something that would be able to see anything.

So anyway, okay. All right. Question, rater guy. Here we go.

All right. This question comes from Dodger Seevers he says, is it worth my time and money to start gaining points for moose in Wyoming? Or will I croak of old age before I draw?

Well, that’s a tough question because now we’re looking at potential change in the system and where maybe these will be more like a bonus point where you get more names in the hat. And so it’s anybody’s guess how the future is going to play out and, and whatnot. We haven’t been, I personally have not been gaining points from, so I don’t think it’s worth it.

Yeah. With our current program. No, but with the changes that might be coming in the future. Yes. What I would say.

Yeah. Yeah. But, but having said that at 150 bucks a piece. Yeah. I mean, you kinda got to decide how, how, if it really does make sense for you or not, and how important a moose in Wyoming is to you. So that’s a tough question. We get those questions all the time and it’s hard to make that decision for a guy.

Some of it, I think just boils down to, if it’s something that you can financially do, and it’s not affecting you that way, you don’t know what management’s going to be in 10 years. And you might think it was the best decision you’ve ever made or in 20 years, you think of when a waste of money for 20 years, it’s hard to know. And if you could financially do it, I’d say it’s probably worth it in a way, if it’s, if it’s a species that you really want to kill or in a state, you really want to hunt. But.

I wish I wouldn’t have opted out of the program years ago. I’d probably have a sheep tag and a moose type right now. Yeah. But I did. And then now I’m, you know, shapeless in Wyoming. So anyway. All right. Anything else to add there? No, you guys, anybody here gaining points.

For how old he is, but.

The most thing in Alaska, I’m not a guy that needs multiple species of move. So.

You’re the.

Boots. You’re okay. Not to have a Shiraz.


You’re okay. Not to have a shower as well. And Devin, how do you feel you want to?

Well, when I was 13, I chose to apply for moose in Utah was my one once in a lifetime thing. So I don’t need to have Wyoming moose.

You’re good. You’re going to get one, right? How many points you have?

Not enough. Yeah. It’s the same thing, but it’s cheaper,

Which is a shame because you come in here early in the mornings when Devin’s just in here by himself. And you’re gonna hear him in there working on his moose calls. It’s pretty. Yeah. He’s, he’s getting ready. Like he’s going to take those once-in-a-lifetime points and he’s going.

To use 11. Do you think those are moose calls debit from your perspective? What are those.

Noise? Believe anything? He said.

Not one thing.

I listened to morning moose calls for 11 days straight all day long.

That is.

True. How’d you guys what’d you guys do in Alaska? Wrong. Go ahead.


He became the Raker.

Call it, call him moose right now.

Doing it on the podcast. I have to wiggle my nose. It’s not like you just sit here and do it. You got to shake. You got to get into it. Yeah.


He was good at it. We tested our skills before we went and he was a lot better. So.

Well, good.

Well, we’ll ask the first. This is kind of a two-part question. And the second part could be really serious with breaking news. That just came. What do you mean? But we’ll, we’ll get there. John bore asks, if you had a choice of a 200 plus mule deer, excuse me, or a 400 plus elk, what would you choose?

Where are you going with what you were saying? You’ll get.


Oh, all right. So 200 inch deer, 400 plus inch bull. One of y’all I think a 400 inch bull is really hard to come by. I was.

Thinking the.

Same thing. I go get a tag first off that has a 400 inch potential. Just go get one. You hardly can. And then, and then to make good on it, you know, how many, 400 inch bulls are killed in or were last year in Nevada, 400 incher, you know? And then you look at, you know, and so yeah, people say that a mule, there’s the hardest thing. And they’re dying hard and maybe, maybe they are maybe a book head we’re talking 3 75 elk or a one 90 net Gilder, right. For typical versus typical, you know, maybe, but having, even at that, go kill a book bull net 3 75, you’re going to have to net. I mean, you’re going to have to be gross in the three high, 3 83 90, you know, a 12 inch deduction or 15 inch deductions, pretty tight, actually pretty darn symmetrical on a bull, you know, with all the different measurements. And so I just think it’s extremely tough to find a F to find and kill and, and put a 400 incher on the wall I have yet to do it. So.

Are you picking elk? It’s a choice. There has to be a choice. This could shock the world right here. You can get shocked.

The world with the truck chasers.

Already. I’m pretty sure you have a couple of two Honda’s.

I think the elk are extremely hard.

Well, you think of how many? 200 inch deer killed 200 plus versus 400 plus elk at a year.

Yeah. Less, less elk. Right? Much less. And this is when I was a kid and I was like, heck, bent on getting on the board with a 200 incher. And I was didn’t have any money, no money at all. Newlywed. No, nothing had nothing but time. I had some time. I just thought you can make a 200 inch happen on a general season tag. You can on a tag, you can get somewhat regular. You want a 200 inch or an Idaho. You can do a general season tag. And we, if you have enough time and you put a few years into it, maybe it’s 10 years, maybe it’s 15. And you, that is your only goal. And you grind it. Like it’s like, it needs to be ground out. I think you can make it happen. I don’t think you can say that for elk. You know, you guys are silent.

I agree with you a hundred percent.

We’re not shocking the world here.

Well, just kind of the mule deer guy pick it right here. I mean,

But how many, how many elk tags do I have right now? How many deer tags do I have? Like, I’m not sitting necessarily saying I’m picking out, but I think if it’s thanks, Wyatt. But I think that it’s time. I think when it’s time to do that, it’s like white tile. I want a 200 inch wide toe, like so bad. My teeth ache, but not bad enough to give up all my deer tags. If I wanted a 200 inch wide tone, I was serious about it. I would slate Kansas, Iowa, Wisconsin, whatever, you know, whatever. I could do, figure out something in Ohio, whatever. And I would try all I could do to make it happen. And I’d have to do it for 10 years in a row. And that probably still won’t happen. Lee, Lila, Costco. I mean those guys, how many years and deer had he killed before, you know, made it happen.

Like it’s still something you can’t do, but you have to put a lot more time in than I am. I’m not doing a single white toe. You know what I mean? You have to put a lot more energy than just thinking about it. You have to give up what you’re currently serious about. You know what I mean? She punters one, a 400 inch bull. You’re going to kind of probably have to give up Alaska and Canada or whatever else you’re doing and just say, no, I’m how serious am I? I’m going to show you how serious I am. And I think that’s kinda, that’s similar to, to elk. I don’t know. What’s your, what do you guys think.

If I had to choose, you know, elk? I think that would be awesome, but I’d have to go with me over there and just meet with their guy. So,

But you’re also got pictures of a bull you killed last year. That looks for.

Hunter. He does. Yeah. It takes a good dog.

So you’re like kind of quenched your thirst for it. Maybe. I don’t know. Devin.

It’d be elk.


I love big deer, but like, like you said, 400 is not just going to come from a general unit. You’re not going to go grind one out, somewhere in a lot of units. It’s very, they just, they’re just rare.

And maybe it’s 2 22.

I was going to say, you might have to change that to 2 21, 2400 and now you’re talking a deal. And now.

That changes.

Things. Oh.

Yeah. Two 20 over 400. That’d be a tough one.

Does he have e-cards? Does he have mass? They have triple lag guards. 35 wide and pipe mass.

Oh, two 20 with no eye guards. There’s going to be giant.

Or a 400 inch, six point.

I want to kill a 400 inch net six, but not bad enough to give up everything else I’m doing or I’d be doing it. That’s what I think. I, when I kind of put that into perspective, you got to give up what you’re currently taking. What’s your, your time? What, what sucking your time right now? You have to give that up and go do it, you know? Yeah. Josh. Well,

I think.

Chris you’ve killed some stuff.

Well, I guess that’s somewhat of a luxury, I guess, of that question, but I don’t, I’d probably take the deer. I don’t know that it’s not just a 200 inch deer. You’re talking to 20 plus.


Don’t know.

Can you not find him?

No. No.

Does it bother you? All right.

Yeah, I think I’d take the deer. I don’t know. But like you were saying though, right now, if you think about it, I think if you said, okay, I want to kill it 200 each year, this year or a 400 inch bull, where do you go? That you could do the elk? You know, I feel like this is not like there’s a million, 200 inch deer out there, but to, to really sit down and say, this is my chance to kill, or this is where I’m going to kill a 14 inch bull. I don’t honestly, I can’t think even our best units in Utah, whatever, anything I, I, I can’t think of a place to say. That’s where I go do it. It’s tough.

Beaver beaver, Utah.

There’s probably.

One 70 K a hundred K 200.

K K. I still don’t think you can buy yourself a.

Yeah. That’s.

For our low fence, 400.

And 400 inch bull.

Without a gov tag, even a gov tech. Sometimes it could be a hundred, some gov tags. We’ve had some super tough years find a bull. Yeah.

Okay. Why it is spoken and I think you’re, I think that’s right. I think you’re dead on with that statement.

All right. The second part of this question, we may need to start off with a moment of silence for our president. Just kind of dealing with some stuff right now, but I took a fall.

Don’t know this. What? Tell him Josh.

Oh, president Biden just tested positive for COVID. Oh. Even with all the amount of vaccines and serum, we’re supposed.

To pray for our.

Leaders. I know.

And I, I think we, I think we should. That’s.

Why I asked for a moment of silence that was kind of for Jana sake.

There’s only one person that can help him. And that’s the man himself. So keep going.

The question is, what is, this is just a question for you. So none of us, for that to answer, what is Jason’s choice for sitting president for 2020 for Joe Biden or Kamala Harris? Those are the only two choices.

Carmella, Kamala, Kamala, or what is it? Only two choices. The only two choices. So come on. How about.


Abstain from voting? I mean, I just think as big of an idiot as I think Joe is, I think he’s actually a kind person. Okay. So there you go. I’ve set a positive about, about him. I think, I think he seen, he, he appears for me for what I’ve seen. He’s a kind person he’s just, we’re all subject to our environment. And he has a bunch of evil people surrounding him. He knows he is not one. It feels like not one good positive person with, with a brain in their head giving him good advice. You know what I mean? I think he, I think in, in generally speaking seems like a nice person, but he doesn’t, he’s not, doesn’t obviously doesn’t have the wherewithal to, to for the job and he’s surrounded by evil. So I think that’s, I think that’s the problem. I think Ms.

Harris, I mean, I think she’s, I don’t think she’s a good person. Yeah. And I think she’s smart enough to wreck the place and she’s not gonna listen to anybody except for the evil around her. And so I guess I feel a little bit more nervous with her than with Joe, but Joe’s making some he’s signing stuff that’s put in front of him that he shouldn’t be signing. And so he’s, he’s not doing a good job and we all know this, right. So I guess, I guess you’d have to say Joe, but come on. You know, really? I don’t think that’s a fair question for a hunting podcast with that said Josh, I w I want every one of your answers or we can’t go forward.

Oh, take Joe over.

Her. Okay.

Oh, he’s a lover of people, women, children. He’s a nice guy.

I’m going to agree as well. So.

Y that’s as far as you’re going, as.

Far as that’s all you’re getting out of me, I’m going to get a degree as well.

Do you have, and you don’t get that luxury.

I think you nailed it, man. I ain’t a hundred percent agree with you. Do you really do? I couldn’t have said it better myself.

I don’t know.

I don’t know. There’s just something I’ve never met her, but it’s like.

Women in general, women in general, I think are, are kind, you know, guys, I think sometimes we’re we’re bullheaded and whatnot, but I think to deal with other nations leaders and whatnot, I don’t, I’m not saying women are a bad choice for president. There’s S there’s some, I mean, there’s some great women leaders out there would make a good president and they do a great job. But sometimes these, these other countries, to me, you know, there’s just maybe a little bit of a different respect, you know, man, to man or whatever it is. But Mack in the ice age, you know what I mean? So on top of that, but with her women are generally not evil. Maybe as much. I don’t know. I don’t know.


You get a bad one,

Worse than.

An evil, you get a bad one. You can’t fix them. Oh, tell me I’m wrong,

But they’re bad. They’re bad.

Do we need,

Okay, next, next question. Next question. All right.

Let’s move on. Question reader, guy,

John at 46 minutes and 20 seconds. All right. Tanner Jain says, what regulations would you guys like to see added or taken away in Utah in the next five years? And how would they impact deer herds? Ex examples, no scopes trail cameras, no orange, et cetera. Thanks.

Oh, I’m going to let you guys,

Debbie. I think we kind of already touched this on the first page. Didn’t we? Yeah. We talked about long range rifles. We talked about social media.

We did. So.

If you.

Want to move, I don’t like change. I have a hard time with change in a lot of aspects, but yeah, I don’t know.

Sometimes I think when we’ve changed a bit here in Utah, we know how the troll camp season, you can use them right now, but we have a season there they’re exploring the Muslims and maybe, maybe a one power scope or no scopes on muzzleloaders right. To make them more of a primitive weapon. I agree with that. I think it should be in the guys that are really muzzle or hunters. Maybe they’re drawing odds of go we’ll increase a bit. And we’re really putting guys that value Muslim or hunting, or want to kill something of the Muslims. And instead of just putting rifle hunters on muzzleloaders because of the season dates, things like that. I think those are, that’s a good change. Having said that sometimes we were looking for change when there doesn’t really need to be any chance.

You don’t want to force it. I feel like somethings are forced and it just,

This COVID environment everybody’s so ticked off, we got drought. Everybody’s frustrated. So we’re knee jerk reaction to, you know, all the change. I think there’s no baiting. I personally think that was a positive change. The truck camera season. I freaking love cameras and, and that’s hard, but, but I was, I think it’s okay. I don’t think it’s the end of the world, somewhat in favor of it from here on out. I personally think, you know, let the dust clear. Let’s see where we’re at. I think maybe address the Muslims and call it a day. We’ve got, we’ve got seasons. We got, we got hours. We got hunting hours. That’s all under control. It’s hard to regulate a rifle. I think the one thing we could do is regulate the season. If you’re, if you think there’s the, the rifle hunters are taking too much of the percent kills too high, or if it is too high, they got to reduce tags to reduce the take.

So, and you don’t want to reduce the tags, then reduce the length of the season and do something like New Mexico, five days. There’s things you can do with a, with a rifle hunt. And you maybe you would still allow for a longer archery season or a longer muzzleloader season if it was truly a primitive weapon. But you know, sometimes we’re just, we’re, we’re always thinking everything needs to change every single year. And we’re just, you know, and we all are all angry. There’s less trophies out there. There’s less animals on the landscape. There’s wild horses that are uncontrolled and there’s cattlemen that are angry. And there’s just a lot of, a lot of anger out there, but we have changed a few things and I think it’s okay to not change for a minute personally. Anything more.

It’s kind of hard when you start changing things. Where do you, where do you draw the line though, too? I mean,



For example, let’s expound upon that just a little.

Bit. So example, you’re going to take away your muzzleloader guys. Now, your modular guys are going to want your archery hunters limited your.


Yeah. Where does, where does it,

You got digital sites, you got electronic, all kinds of the range finding and the, and the, and the electronic sites on bows. And pretty soon you’re regulated to death back to John’s point of, you know, government overreach. And, but, but, but there is a fine balance of, do you want some animals left or do you want just 10 tags? Because we know all 10 are going to be successful and it’s hunting has gone away from hunting, even Phil. Here’s an example of, of the hunting world change. Do you guys even feel worried about ever being lost ever?

No. Not anymore.

Ever. Ever, never. Right. When you were a kid, did you feel like you were worried about being lost? Oh, did you look about the mountains around you? Do you think about where the trucks parked?

Oh, I remember like when my dad’s in the road drawing a map on the, on the dirt in the road and be like, scratch the plate. Okay. Now this Ridge goes like this. I’m going to walk down this Ridge. This Ridge runs like this, and you’re gonna, and he’s sitting there drawing this map and you need to go. And I’m like, I’m 12 years old and I’ve got to walk up and find this Ridge in the dirt and walk down this Ridge and all terrified,

Terrified. And that’s the way I felt we were in Oregon and the one aha. And it was super thick, gnarly thick. And it was the first garment range finder that came out was, you know, mid to late nineties, that big old clustery thing. Or excuse me, Carmen, GPS. Why is the range just on my mind, but anyway, GPS unit and it kind of half worked and it was trouble seeing the satellites and then had the little satellite bars and different things and in any way, and we trust that we were, we were basically lost and you feel like you’re walking in a circle in a thick forest in the dark pitch, dark, and then all of a sudden outcome. And there’s the truck shining in the moon in the Starlight, you know? And, and that was the first real experience with GPS that I had had, but it should kind of change that, oh, this whole phone thing it’s not even GPS has anymore.

Really the phones have changed life. You know, life, you want to know where your kid is, find my phone up and be one of those, my kid, you know, and my kids are out and about and doing, going crazy places and other states by themselves at 16 to 18 and with the cell phones and the abilities. Now I feel less anxious about it. Whereas when I was a kid, you better freaking know how to walk. You know, you better know how to change your tire on marks and the trucks weren’t as capable as they are now. Like we were driving old garbage, you know, anyway, I just feel like that’s an example of where we’ve come. Like there’s no, there isn’t none. All that’s gone. All that’s gone wondering where your bullets going to hit are, how far that animal is, all that’s gone. There are a lot of these things. And that’s what I think people are worried about is isn’t even hunting anymore. You know, is it even hunting anymore? And I, and I can sympathize with that. I feel like I wonder that myself, you know, tactics and technology, so these are valid questions. Just, it kinda we’re in the 21st century. Right?

I think the thing too, to remember, we forget kind of going to the phone, we’re kind of an instant gratification society. Now we, if you think of like, oh, I wonder if there’s bullets on this, or I wonder how much that costs within seconds, you can be looking at to see what price the bullets cost somewhere, what the cost, everything is so instant. And so fast change change is something that takes time. You know, I think about when we were running these, these color studies on deer, you put a GPS collar on a deer and you’d run it and say, one year, you’d say, okay, that’s what these deer are doing. And then the second year they do something. There could be an outlier, something totally different changes or something. There’s different things that happen. So honestly, when we changed something, some like baiting trail cameras, things like that, we probably need to wait a few years before we start hammering something else. Let’s see what that does. Maybe that gets the results we need, but we’re not that way. Okay. Now we got that done. Let’s get this done. Let’s.


Go and just keep going and going and going. And then in the turn, we’ll never really know maybe what the best factor was.

Yep. I think you’re a hundred percent Josh, a hundred percent, right. Josh in the F in the fact that let the dust clear on some of these things and let’s move forward. Sometimes there was, there was a span of time when there was no change at all for 15 years, it felt like, or 20 years. And, and then the rules, laws and whatever. Didn’t keep up with technology and tactics, the changing of technology and tactics and tactics. And so, you know, I think some of that’s been addressed in some of these states and the states have proven that they’re not above adjusting a few things. Yeah.


It’s, it’s bothering a lot of people too.

Yeah. And maybe sometimes those decisions that are made, and maybe they’re not the best thing, because we didn’t have scopes on muzzleloaders. When I was a kid, it was open sites. I didn’t move to red dot stuff. And then we moved into to sculpt. So there might be some people listening to this, that thought scopes have been on muzzleloaders forever or whatever. They haven’t. It was a decision that was made, you know, 10, 5, 10 years ago, whatever it was. And that decision was made. Now it’s been long enough. Maybe we say, oh, maybe that wasn’t the best decision for deer, for hunters. Maybe it was a good decision, but for the deer, maybe not. So let’s maybe tell that back. I’m not saying it wasn’t it wasn’t, but something like that, you almost need time to see if a decision gets made, whether it’s going to benefit or do the things you want before you just move on. So just the idea of all this change, change, change, change, change. Everything’s on the balls, roll analysis. Cheap change it. It probably needs to slow down a little bit.

Yeah. All right. Okay. Question reader, guy. We’ve got one out from something crack.

This is from cracked out. Attractants.

I didn’t know if we were talking about.

That up. Maybe a hunter asked this. I don’t.

Know. I probably did.

So the question for the podcast is how many guys slash gals feel it’s important to run trail cameras, both for research purposes, pitchers or actual hunting success.

Go ahead,

Chronicle. How we would judge how many guys or gals, but we can tell you our opinion on that one. Yeah,

Yeah. Do it. I.

Feel like it could go either way. Trail cameras are definitely a useful tool keeping track of game. I don’t know how many big animals have actually found a, because of a trail camera. A lot of it’s still done by glassing and then maybe hanging trail cameras to gain a pattern or figuring out what that animal is doing. So yeah. They do contribute to success that way.

Okay. I like it.

For research. Yeah, absolutely. I put, I’ll put cameras on trails to see migration and like all sorts. I mean, yeah.

I like to know what’s going on in December, January flavor and it’s my own little personal research. This isn’t for a big project. You know what I mean?

Drug camera’s through winter for elk. Sometimes I’d leave cameras. I’d put cameras where bowls at winter. Yeah.

I’ve got lions on camera and yeah. And I’m thinking they need to be removed. You know what I mean? I’m researching their patterns for a minute. You know, I think there’s a, I think sometimes though, personally, I just feel like, you know, the guys that love cameras for the purpose of hunting success, blame it on research. Right. You can’t stop research from moving forward. And I, I do feel like there’s a little bit of, you know, people that are saying it’s H there’s more research than maybe there really is, but I’ve seen all the I’ve seen camera work done on those migrations in Wyoming. It’s pretty compelling deer after year after year after year on the same trail, you know what I mean? Like those are when you see it, when you actually see it, it’s pretty compelling, you know? And, and I think tells a story.

And so I think there’s a lot of value there. We got, we got trail cameras on the, on the deer overpasses and deer underpasses, you know, and to see the value of those in, in a migration corridor. And it’s compelling, those deer would have otherwise crossed the road, potentially smashed by a vehicle or whatever. And we’re seeing 500 or a thousand or whatever, you know, it’s kind of like a little ticker, you know, going into a ball game or something, that’s it. You can kind of get a feel for, for how well they’re being used or not. And, and things like that. And so, you know, I think there’s a lot of research going on my personal research or research from an actual research standpoint. And then, you know, we’re running them for a reason. Y’all got cameras out and it’s, it’s in hopes of helping your hunting and, and for concentrating your efforts in particular areas where a giant might exist. That that is, there’s a reason people are wound up about the possibility of cameras going away. And it’s because they were there. They’re helpful. They’re a tool and they’re very helpful. So, yeah,

I think if you’re personally, if you’re not running cameras in some way, you should be just because like Devin said, that was one of the, probably the, one of the best things for me is putting a camera out for a year and keeping it going for you. If you can, if you can get into it, you can learn so much. Especially after, you know, we had a question about fires, some of these units that I’ve hunted and had a significant fire, and it changes things significantly for wildlife. And you might, you might need some extra help. So, I mean, just having some cameras on, in an area,

All of a sudden, everything’s good instead of just this chaining and all of a sudden this whole fire has good feet.

It’s just a particular deer or not. You learn movements, you learn timeframes, just things like that, that you normally don’t, or that you might not pay attention to after we were, you know, we put a lot of cameras up on migration trails and things on those deer studies to where now I’ll be driving along the highway. I’ll be like that trail. Wasn’t here all summer long or whatever. And you’re like, that’s weird. There’s a defined trail. Now coming off of this hillside and it’s in the springtime and in the fall, and it goes away during the summer. And then it comes back, you know, something to keep in your mind and clue in on it and say, that’s, that’s not just a game trail coming to water. You know, there’s things that you can learn from stuff like that. So use them, if you can, you don’t have to, but I’m just saying for you, I think it’ll benefit you, not maybe particular, particular deer or whatever. It’ll just benefit you as a hunter just to learn deer habits or elk habits or whatever.

And it’s good for the economy. You have to gas up sandwiches, you got to get sandwiches. You got to buy cameras. It’s just good. Right now,


Mousetraps, sticky traps, new brake pedals. I spent some money down at the carwash and the vacuum. All right. Well, okay. Are we, are we, how much more do we gotta do?

We’re good. We’re good. I think if we finish this a little bit work, it will be good. Okay. Trevor Devy dovey. I apologize for butchering your last name probably, but what are the main benefits of having you guys handle my applications versus doing everything myself aside from cost?

So this is another one that kind of goes back to that first question at answer podcasts. We had one that was very, very similar to that.

Okay. Well, I think, I think part let’s answer it though. I do think that why had I told you today? What did I tell you today? It’s going to.

Say today was a perfect example.

Today was a perfect example. What’d I tell you, perfect.

Personalization is going to be the biggest thing towards service. I’m trying to think of what exactly is.

Well, I told you, Jason, if I ever have anybody do my personal applications, it’s going to be, you.

Don’t remember that statement this morning. So.

Why, why did I say it? Because why let’s talk about the anxiety, why he’s feeling a little bit.

And the problem he solved. Today’s been like a three weeker, huh? Yeah. It’s been one that’s been on my mind for a minute. And I, so.

Yeah, I think there’s a, there’s a times. Well, for example, we have, you know, if you’re going to get a, a mentor youth tag in Idaho, you you’re the mentor, the parent, or whatever has to have a tag of the same species. And if you don’t have one, you got to get one. Well, right now you can’t just go buy one. You have to buy one of the turnbacks, you know? And so I think just going that next level to make sure your clients have what they need and why it’s been having anxiety for days, maybe a month. And, and, and I think that’s what you’re talking about. Why it’s personalization? Is that something we normally do not, it’s not necessarily something we normally do. Is that something that needs to be done and that you actually care about the client and you want to make sure his season’s a success.

Yes. And I feel like you take it to the next level. You’re you, you head up that department, of course, you, we all work in that department and you have, you know, good gals that actually do the actual filing that are, that are great at what they do. But, you know, you just take it very, very personal. If a guy needs a, you know, an obscure tag of any sort, it doesn’t matter antlerless or not, or whatever it is, an obscure tag of any sort, you know, regardless if it’s on what we regularly do or not, you take it and own it as if it’s yours and that’s your schedule. And I just think we all do that to a degree and to our gals that filed the applications. And I just feel like it’s that level of service that I personally want. Like, I w I want somebody not just that I’m a number, not just that I did that and check, and by the way, we don’t offer that. And good luck to you. I feel like, I feel like we take it to the next level in that regards. And we treat it as if your schedule is our own personal schedule. Don’t you agree?

I would agree with that.

I would say, I would say I was blown away when I started working here, how serious the application season and processes is taken, taken here. You know, I’ve always just done my own and everything. And it’s generally at 11 o’clock at night on the day that it’s due.

To be on top of the.

Pile. Yeah,


No, mainly because I just, I I’ve got till then or whatever. And I felt like, I don’t know that I had was as serious as I probably should have. And coming here, just seeing the checks and double checks, and then getting thrown into the mix of actually coding a guy for what this guy’s wanting, you know, you read his information and you see what’s, he’s wanting. And then personally saying, okay, if I am that guy, this is the tag that I would want to have, you know, to based on his criteria,

Coding and.

Treating his application like mine and stressing about it. Like I’m seriously.

Stressful. You’re going to have to answer to that guy.

Exactly. And that’s why, that’s why I need to.


Do that. Like when I was blown away. And I feel like if guys saw that, I, I would hope they’re expecting that. That’s what they’re getting. But I think at the same time, they would probably be blown away how serious we are. It’s not just something that we do. It’s, it’s a serious, serious project. And we take it personal when we’re doing these applications as if it’s our own.

And why he does a great job of you. You save people money,

You know,

There’ll be guys buying, hunting license, and you, I hear you all the time. You know, you’re saving people money and you’re telling them like, for 10 bucks, you can throw your name in the hat here. They do it. And they draw that you get people tags, they on their own never would have even applied for because they didn’t under truly understand the system.

Yeah. Understanding the system is a huge part of the battle. And you think you understand the system. I know how the point system works, but there’s, I know how the basic deadlines, but there’s nuances. There’s just little things they’re like, yeah. But if you did it this way, Montana’s a classic, there’s so many nuances and variables and, and options for general deer, general deer and elk general elk, and then everything that goes with it. And when to get a point and, you know, do I, I don’t have any points. I want the best chance to draw this year. Do I play in that point system? Well, if you do, your odds were like 30% last year. If you don’t, your odds are like 70%. Like there’s just little things.

Yet. Every state has a cork.

Yeah. And maybe lots of quirks. And then to know all of that, and then to know your schedule and to know how the demand, what you really want. And then to wrap that all up and make a decision, I think is, is very involved. And like you said, Josh is not taken lightly. We, we have to answer to that guy or gal and we want to get that. We want to make all their dreams come true in regards to hunting. That’s what we want. That’s our goal here. And, and if you’re happy we have a client for life. And so anyway,

States are ever changing to, with their applications. What what’s there, what’s not, and we’re doing a good job of staying on top of that with between all of us here at the office.


I think, I think too, like why like, say with why at our treating stuff as our own you’ll, you’ll, you’ll, we’ll talk to a guy you don’t see notes that are taken or things like that. I would think most guy would say, well, okay, in Arizona, I want to hunt the strip. Or, you know, they, they feel like, oh, I just do the strip or, gosh, I don’t know. I can’t do all the research. I’ll just do the strip. And it’s like this, this individual, there are several other units that would meet this person’s needs than the strip. And they’re going to get attack significantly sooner. And so we’d get aggressive with it and say, this tag will meet your needs. You know, you need to be applying here and not just wasting application on it, on a hunt that you may never draw. We’re going to, we’re going to get you a tag off of what you’re wanting.

Yup. Okay. I think we fleshed it out a few. If you have any questions or you do are considering having somebody do your applications or help you in that regard, give us a holler for 3 5, 2 6 3 0 7 7 7, or you can hit us up on And we’ll get with you. So it is scouting season. We want to throw a little shout out to phone scope. They make some incredible scope adapters for our cell phones, where we can take video. Pretty awesome. I’m using it right now. So anyway, I’ve always got the case on here. Of course, it’s kind of a little logos fallen off in a few things cause it’s on there 24 7, but anyway, pretty awesome. You snap on the attachment, throw it on your scope or whatever binocular you’ve got and you can film away. And so anyway, great opportunity there. Credible products, good people,, P H O N E S K Check them out and get the products you need right off their website. Of course they sell them at any of the major sporting goods stores as well.

That actually goes on really well with our next question. It was.

Like, all right, here we go.

Well, I’m just thinking of where it says. The next question comes from broken Stokes, Barack. And maybe, I don’t know if that was a typo, but.


The question comes from best tips for field judging, mule deer particular judging deer off of trail camera pictures, but.


Phil judging, I think being happy to have a phone scope or something like that to take a picture and or to get a video to look back on after you’re in the moment I was with with had a good friend with me the other night, we were doing some stuff going to look for jump a couple bucks. Oh geez. Look at that first one. That’s a big buck, you know, and they’re running two bucks run away from you. And we were able to get up the road farther and they were standing there on the hillside and looking at both of them, the one that we just off the top of your top of your head, the first one, look at that one. He’s got an extra look how wide he is big. And then you get up there and they’re standing next to each other.

And you’re like, man, that other deer is a bigger deer than he is. That first year we saw was like a three-year-old deer maybe. And the other one’s like five. And so he’s got, he’s got like a baby. He’s like a baby giant. But his antlers compared to his body size, it would probably you’d get up to him and think, whoa, whoa, whoa, what happened? Whereas the other dude next to him is a five-year-old buck. And you’re like, okay, that, that deer would be significantly larger. Even though he doesn’t look that big right off the bat.

And I think too on this field judging. So, and, and I’ve, I’ve, it’s really hard to judge stroke, camera pictures, you’ve got head size and body size and the position of the camera, just like you can, you can take your cell phone and make something look big. You can do the same thing with, with, with, you know, a stealth camera or whatever the angle it’s up or down above them, below them looking up whatever, perfect eye level. And you know, it’s hard. You can, truck cameras can, can mess you up. But my, my, my theory is you better look if you’re, if you’ve got a tag in the unit and you have some significant deer, let’s call them whatever deer deer, but you have significant animals on camera. You better look at the top three physically and look at them with your eyes, with your eyes, because then you’ll be like that deer is bigger than he looked on truck cam.

I cannot believe how much bigger that deer is or vice versa. That terror. We have a deer on camera. We had a deer on camera. My brother-in-law’s killed him. And it was, it looks significant. There’s a desert deer, smaller body, maybe even on the younger side, a little bit thin. So all the points look extremely long, something thin and mass meeting and smashed it. And I was like that deer only went such and such, you know, low eighties or whatever. And I was like, that thing looked high nineties on camera. And so it goes both ways, but I’ve been, there’s been some, when I look at the top, if I have a bunch of bucks on camera and fight, if you have a hundred different bucks on camera and it’s not hard to do that in some areas or 150, and you’ve got it down to the top three, you’re probably going to be blown away at how big those deer are. You probably don’t need to look at them and really put some emphasis on them. And there’s been at times when I’ve had other tags going on, other competing tags, I never did take a look, go hunt, another tag. And somebody smashes my number three bucket, number two bucket. I’m blown away. How I didn’t put any emphasis at all on hunting that particular animal. So anyway, that stands out to me. How about you guys?

Yeah, I’d say the same thing. I mean, trail cameras seem to go either way. I’ve seen trail cameras, making animals look. Absolutely. And I’ve seen it make two 30 bucks look 200. Yeah, two. So, I mean, it’s just complete opposite night pictures and another thing too, that kind of take away from our animals as well. Yeah. But there’s nothing to replace. See it in real life.

Nice pitchers will change the mass. You’ll get a night picture and you’ll be like, he looks good. But then you see, you know, a daytime photo and you’re like, he’s massive. Night’s shots. Don’t show the mass. Like they really are in my mind. And so if he looks massive at night, he is massive. You know what I mean? He is massive. I think another thing is, is when you, you look at the years and the, and the antler compared to the years, if he looks compact, like you gotta look at it objectively. I got a picture of a buck. You guys know this. I mean, I have a picture of a bucket, three feet or four feet, you know, and he looks awesome. But then you got to look at the ears and go, that is a compact book like that. He does look awesome, but he might not be awesome.

He might just be a compact well-built buck. You know what I mean? Compared to his ears and his body and stuff. If you really look at it objectively, it’s tight frame, you know, or whatnot. So I look at that and I’ve got another picture of a book. That’s, you know, like 12, 15 inches out past the year on one side that that’s a freaking stud and he looks massive at night. That’s a stud, that’s a wide, massive potentially monster. You know what I mean? And so you’ve got to look and I only got one side to, I got to look at him. I need video mode. You know what I need 4k. I need the place around it. I’m going to borrow cameras from Josh and Devin. And why, I mean, we’re, we’re going to, I’m going to get some better film and then, and then need to go look at him in person. And hopefully he makes you want to throw up, you know what I mean?

Well, I had had a good point the other day. We were looking at some bowl or a videos of a bull. And the one video you could tell he’s, I mean, this is a giant bull, but the one video, why it made a good point that I never thought of much before. He’s like, it’s almost too close. You know, it’s it’s phone scope, video. That’s too close. And.


And a lot of times I feel like you always try and get so close to get that nice crisp, clean video, but then the other video of same bowl and it’s, I don’t know, it’s a long ways away and you can, you’re like, oh, you got to zoom in on it. But before you zoom in on it, you’re like, okay, that you can see the bulls, his whole body. And then the antlers in relation to the bodies are turning. And you’re like, okay, that has a pretty significant bull because you’re out away from him a little bit, you know,

Kind of like that bull I was showing you guys got triple browse on the one side. Yeah. And then there’s a 300, 3 26 point standing there. And it looks like a, nothing. It looks like a cow with antler.


And his body’s giant. And even though, and he’s massive. So you start looking at him and even though his sword doesn’t look, you know, 24 inches long, you know, it’s longer than you. You know what I mean? On his fifth, doesn’t like the, well, till it’s you get a well-told on the back, you give it more credit. Maybe there’s the same length. There is a great, well tell, but you give it a little more credit because it’s sexier, you know what I mean? And so I just, when he walks by in a couple different shots, I’m like, how big is he really? Like, I think that he could be special. Yeah. You know, hard to know. And then you got the curvature of the fronts. I mean, you guys, we were looking at a bull photo and why it’s like, what is he really like on the back end?

And we can see what he is on the front end, but what is he really? And then you got the head on shot. Yeah. He’s 42 inches inside, not 38 or 36. Like those are things, all the angles. And I think part of that with the trail cameras, I quickened them up. Like I like a Shaw. I like a three shot bursts, one second intervals on, on a, on a delay of an ideal delay of nine to 14 seconds. And, and I have to sit through a lot more photos than most guys. But when they come in, I’ve got, I’ve got animals that have only come in once or twice in the last month because they obviously have a different water or you get one of these microbursts and you get water in the road or you get water out in the Hills or whatever, you get a little catchment.

And so they don’t have to water as much. And so when they do come in, I want from behind, from front, the sides, both sides, the, I want all the angles you can get. And so I usually try to Quicken them up. But if you’re dealing with cattle, then I do a schedule time and I’ll do from, you know, 8:00 PM to 8:00 AM or 9:00 AM. And then I don’t have to deal with all the cows standing there all day long, next to the water. And then I’ll start back when the animals, when the, when the game is most likely to come in. And so I don’t fill up a card, but I don’t know. That’s do you guys have any setting preferences that you like? I mean, that’s for where I’m at in particular, Josh here, you’re up in green, beautiful country here in higher elevation stuff. And it might vary up there. Yeah.

It’s all across the board and it all did, does it just depends on which cows were there. Oh, you know, w what other stuff is there, if there’s antelope coming in? I mean, it’s, I’ve got one now that you know, some on a tank and there’s a pair of mourning doves there, and that’s all they do is fly all day long. But, but I had a buck that I was looking at the hit at 10 o’clock in the morning. And.

That’s, that’s.

One of the times he hit, that was one of the only times he hit. So I’m like, I don’t know what to set it up. It’s just 24 7. I’m going to have to roll through 8,000 pictures of mourning doves a day.

Yeah. You don’t have a choice. Yeah. And then I’ve got one, like, there’s a pond, it’s a giant pond that you cannot camera, but you can camera the entrances. So to speak. I mean, there’s some, they like, I mean, deer just like water. They’re going to go with the easiest route and the most safe and secure route. And so they come through this great big gate and I’m on the gate, but I can’t see the pond. I can see the pond bank and I Quicken it up. I want a three second delay, you know, three shot for shoppers to every second on a three second delay. And then that way, when he walks through, I get him. When he comes back, I get him. If I, if I’m on a 32nd delay, I’m not getting him. And, and I feel like the cameras don’t truly give a 32nd delay. They fall asleep. I feel like if it’s too long, they fall asleep and don’t wake up. And I miss, I miss the game. And so everything is a very custom, I don’t just go to a Q3 or Q2 or Q1. I’m like, I custom every time, every time on my gut-feel, what I need to do to get that animal. And I’m, and I sit through a lot of photos.

I always try whether I’m looking or trow camps, you got to have a head-on on a deer or an elk to really judge you. I say, I, yeah, you don’t, I I’ve shot one buck, walk away for me. And it wasn’t a great choice. He didn’t, he didn’t look at me like, you know what I mean? Yeah.

I’ve always thought that’s the most important angle too, is the.

Head on, on,

I think about how many Instagram photos you see of people with their deer, and you say, I’d like to see that thing head on.

They don’t want to show it. Exactly.

There’s a reason why there’s only side.

Sucker, 16 inches.

There are 17 inches wide, the side shot.

Well, Y you’ve run a lot of cameras. Do you? And of course we all have here, but you’ve said the least, just tell me, you know, what do you think on judging? And then also, you know, camera’s set up.

So just kind of, like I said back, you know, daylight, pictures, overnight pictures. I definitely prefer those head-on shots. As far as judging, I have seen them both blow up animals and both make animals considerably smaller, or look considerably smaller on cameras. They’re just kind of hard to judge. As far as camera settings, I like a burst, letting the, letting the animal come in and set it off multiple shots and hopefully get multiple angles in the, in that time period that he’s there. Cause you could only get that animal to hit one time. I mean, maybe he’s water in the spring. Maybe if you get him the one time and then that’s all you have to go off of. So,

Okay. I like it. Okay. Question reader, guy. We’re going to dive into one or two more. How are you guys feeling?

We got, well, let’s.

See, let’s crank this.

Page. We got it there. The next couple are pretty quick.


Braden Richmond asks, have you considered adding bear hunting information? State’s rules and draw info.


Darn it. Sometimes you guys get on bear tangents. You know, I think there’s times we all like the big stuff, right? Like I’m always interested in what Arizona bears and some of the reservations. And there’s some things that, you know, we, we, we, you guys, you, Josh had a bear tag, like everybody’s interested in bears and Hunt’s hunts bears, but it’s hard like the, the drawing phone to, to go into the claws portion of the drawing full and whatnot. It’s just at some point what we, I think we really pride ourselves in being the best is, is big game antlered horn, big game.

You know, we have a lot of, a lot of good Outfitters there for bears too. And Devin knows those really well and be able to.

Help out with any better questions.

We apply, you know, we apply ourselves and get points and you know, whether it be Utah, Colorado, or whatever, and we’re, we participate in it. We founded Montana for bear and, and different places. A lot of us have haunted, Utah and whatnot, but we’re just, you know, don’t have any plans there and we’re not going to do fishing. We’re not going to do Upland game. I mean, there’s, we really stick to what we know maybe to a fault business-wise but we want to feel like we’re the best at what we do. So, or, or very top tier. And anyway, so having said that, no, it’s probably a simple answer there. Yeah. So.

This next question is one we’ve already talked a little bit about so we can probably brush by it, but it does maybe bring up a couple of things. It Andrus Tingey says how to a hundred burn in Colorado, for example, two versus four versus six years after it occurred for elk or deer, maybe different strategies given how vegetation returns over time to the landscape and how elk and deer use different burns over the years. We, I mean, we did talk about it and I would say, get in and, and get on them a to start learning it. Be stuff gets in there a lot faster than you think, like Devin was saying, I know a lot of guys, I say mountain Dutton. And I think it happened on the penguins lake as well. These, some of these units, they burned fast elk, especially if it’s big timber, if it’s big timber stuff, get in there and hunt it because those elk they’re used to just standing in there and being 50 feet from it. And you can’t see them. So I know a lot of times, a lot of guys loved hunting. Now when they run a herd of bulls or herd elk on a hillside and they’re standing over there and they think they’re, they still think they’re in a timbered hillside and that they’re covered and you can shoot through it.

I think it almost feels like the sooner, the better, the longer it goes, the harder it’s going to get. Especially if you have those sapling Quakers, like on the Dutton we ever hung out when it was black and just grass. And then two years I go back and you could all, you’re looking at your glass and racks. You don’t even see their bodies. Yep.

And I think a lot of vegetation after burns, it’s really good. It’s really nutritious. Sooner after time, it turns to old, just old decadent stuff and doesn’t get used as much. So I’d hit him all the time. I mean, there’s always a chance for burns. I’d always make sure you keep them in your scouting, but hit, hit him as soon as you can, because sometimes you may only have four years, but it’s really good.

I think too, like Colorado, I hunted a hundred burned pretty aggressively this, this last year. And what I found there’s there’s deer in it. There’s a few deer in it, but there was the majority of deer were in their old, natural, you know, migration corridor and where they winter and it wasn’t in the burn and they didn’t need to leave the burn. They didn’t, they had to walk through it. They didn’t need to leave it. There was no weather per se that pushed them. And so sometimes like a second or third season rifle, deer tag and Colorado burn isn’t necessarily the answer it might be. Now, if it burned where they naturally always went, they’ll probably be standing there. But I F they left the great feed and went down to the garbage, like they always did before the burn, even last year and the burns old now, you know what I mean?

It’s older. And so I like kind of like, you’re indicating it’s not the end all be all. Although there are places in Nevada when it burns. There’s no feed and Nevada doesn’t have these hard, there are some units that have hard migrations, no question about it. But there’s some of the desert units that when there’s a burn, it’s incredible in the, and they love it. And it’s a relief. There’s good feed for once there’s whatever. And you see a change in antler development, you see a change in maybe even deer numbers and populations and healthier doughs and whatever. And so there’s places that absolutely, if there’s a burn, you don’t not hunt it, you absolutely hunt burns. Like, and I used to be a saying, when, you know, mine is, I can hardly think of a burn that didn’t produce a big deer, you know? But then when you, this guy’s asking about Colorado specifically, you know, in Colorado, for example, I saw where there was burn. Wasn’t that effective, you know what I mean? It wasn’t that effective. And you know, so I guess it’s just kind of, it can vary, but generally speaking burns burns are the most inexpensive. And the, you know, government’s obviously trying to fight a lot of them, but the inexpensive, you know, wildlife habitat projects are, is, you know, there’s pretty great habitat up here on penguin.


Yeah. That’s right.

Thick, thick Cedars, just like that opens up all that feed. Whereas Colorado Pines, maybe it’s.

I don’t know.

Yeah. It might not change much. It’s hard to say.

I mean, if you’re, it’s not like you guys though, you guys, you guys hunted north Eagle, some of that country, and there was, you know, a burn spot or whatever did, was that good or bad? I mean, just, I open it up. I actually don’t know the answer to it.

There was good feet everywhere on that unit. I wouldn’t necessarily say.

They were, I.

Felt attracted to the.

Burn in a burn scar. That was like the size of a football field.

I did see.

It at work.

Yeah. I looked at the there’s a buck. There was a couple bucks.


In a sea of Cedars though. You know what I mean?

Right. So maybe they’ll see a Cedar still had other deer in them. You just couldn’t see it. Correct. You know, but where they drawn to it now, unit 18. I mean, it it’s a freaking burn. Right. That’s all that’s left of that place. Right. So, and we found deer in the burn. Obviously there was no other place for them to be in large part in the particular area where he ran. So, you know, did that mean at work? I don’t know. I think those deer would have been there anyway, but they work a lot more, you know, easier to class and find. And so, but in a lot of country, Arizona, Utah, and Nevada, I mean, you hunt the burns don’t don’t ignore burn. Good grief. Don’t ignore burn. So, all right. Are we good? Thanks. Hey, here we go. Pollock. I’ll be the question reader guy. I want to read. Well, I don’t want to be left out. We should all be a question. Reader, guy, Watts from Remington Vader is Paula gonna rock the mustache for the hunts? I mean, Hey, I’m just saying you might have a stalker. I’m just teasing. Remington me. That’s a normal question. Not a big deal.

I haven’t even thought about it.

Hey, if you want to carry a little wind checker and your binocular harness salt all hot long, go ahead. If not grow a stash. I mean, when you feel the wind start to tingle out here, you come on, you know? Oh, you know what I, things are changing.

I think you shouldn’t even trim it until you fill a tag this year, starting about right now.

Okay. Let’s hear it. You’re going to do it. Don’t trim it. Okay.

That’s awesome.

Is it? It’s on, it’s on, oh geez.

Proclaimed on a podcast.

This hairy. Sucker’s going to look disgusting.

This could, this could last a long time.

How about all? Y’all why.

I don’t do very good at the mustache.

Why I do them as.


As it is. So.

What happens to me in a course of nine days?

It’s true. You should do a mustard.

Archibald could pull a good one. I’m sure.

Dude, go get some of that.

Bears. Have a neck beard beard.

Oh, Baird’s Baird oil. Roll it up. Huh? No,

No. I do a full beard, but not a mustache. I don’t know.

Okay. All right. Pawlak you’re on. We’ll see what this turns into.

November 28th, maybe scary.

All right, everybody. As we close out, we also wanted to throw a shout out to Q U a. You can go to They have a ton of great products, tents, sleeping bags, obviously clothing, kind of where it started. Just incredible. You know, they really focused a lot on the extreme weather stuff and the sheep hunt and being light and having a great warmth and watershed and capabilities. Of course, they morphed into a lot of other things. I’ve wearing the Tiburon pants. I think Josh, you got them on right now,


And just incredible. Just man. It was just a breath of fresh air, hot weather environments. So what a great job they’re [email protected]. Good people. We had a lot of personal friends there at Q U and just, just good people. Great products makes it really easy to support them. Also coming up, came out with a women’s line of clothing.

Right, right.

Yeah. Just recently.

So anybody that’s interested, go check them [email protected]. Really simple process going on there and buy stuff and check out and have it shipped to your door. So anyway, ultra light hunting, lighting, and ultra light hunting equipment and do a great job. Great people there. So anyway, don’t hesitate. Get on board and check them out. All right, fellows, what else we got Josh? Anything else?

Oh, I think that’s it.

That was a long podcast where we sit at.

A one hour, hour and a half. Right.

Here we go. All right. Well, if anybody out there needs help on anything course, you’ve got, we’ve got some point only application occasions that we’re thinking about. And if you need a tag, you need a hunt. Give us a call.

Lots of hunters out there.

Right now. We even got landowner tags, Devin. Yeah. We got some elk land tags and New Mexico, a lot of different options. Of course, we’re trying to email out a few of the highlights. It seems like on a weekly basis,

If you don’t see those, go find them and adjust your settings. I’ve had, I talked to a guy this morning. He said, I haven’t gotten any of your emails. I said, I’ve sent a bunch, but.

Yeah, it might be in your junk email. You know, the world likes to, you know, likes to slow down the hunting emails going out there. But then also we do send out a few emails. And so you, we can get on your junk list pretty easy. So anyway, just select that it’s not junk, right? Click it and get us into your main folder. And then that way you can kind of keep track of what we’ve got going on here at epic outdoors. We take pride in having these hunts. We work with some of the best Outfitters that and the absolute best that we can. And that’s always changing too. There’s a lot of evolution there, a guys buying out guys, and we just try to stay on top of who’s doing what, and there’s a lot of different opportunities out there. So, so please, if you’re looking for something, reach out to us and we’ll take it from there. Other than that, it’s, it’s basically July 21st. That’s like right in the center of scouting. And so we’re here four days a week, Monday through Thursday, why it reminded us the 24th is on Monday and that’s a holiday. And so what are you doing? I don’t know, Devin.


Utah holiday. So we’re going to be out on the, on Monday. So it’s going to be a short week next week, but we’ll be here Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and then we’ll be back to scout. And, and so anyway, that’s just the time of year we’re in scouting and hunting. Y’all ought to be doing the same. I’ve had a lot of comments, I guess I mentioned everybody should be taking Fridays off in scouting and I stand by it. You should do all you can to work four tens and get out in the Hills with your, with your family and, and find some games. So anyway, if you’re looking for any gear, optics, cameras, whatever it is you need, give us a holler. 4 3 5 2 6 3 0 7 7 7. If you’re needing any tags or hunts, same thing, and we’ll do the best to get you on some great opportunities. All right, everybody good luck out there. If you need something, let us know.

At epic outdoors, we helped you reach your hunting dreams, whether it’s helping you to develop a long-term application strategy or finding the perfect outfit or for your next time as a member of epic outdoors, you’ll also receive, you have to get outdoors magazine and have access to the best hunting consultants in the industry, online tools, and more to join epic outdoors, visit typic or call 4 3 5 2 6 3 0 7 7 7.